Arrows

Osella · 21 Jul 2002, 19:24 (Ref:339036)

Excuse me if this has already been covered, but what exactly did Arrows hope to acheive by NOT qualifying?

I understand that they wished to fulfill the minimum entry requirements by attempting it (which must be questionable in that they actually attempted not to qualify) but why didn't they want to race??

El_Gibleto · 21 Jul 2002, 19:35 (Ref:339041)

As I understand the situation, the ownership of the team is in the process of being transferred to a a different group. The current owners were unwilling to authorise more expenditure than absolutely neccessary to ensure the retention of any "rights" and meet any participation obligations under the "concord" agreement.

Theoretically this situation could continue for the remainder of the season.

Tristan · 21 Jul 2002, 19:54 (Ref:339054)

Yep. They simply have no money. If they DIDN'T run, they'd incurr penalties, fines and costs. By avoiding running, they save the dosh on two fronts.

Osella · 21 Jul 2002, 20:12 (Ref:339063)

Do they not stand a chance of getting involved in further litigation from their sponsors? If I were Orange, or Lost Boys(!) I'd be studying the contract I had with them closely...

Tristan · 21 Jul 2002, 20:17 (Ref:339067)

True... I'd be seriously ****ed.

NiceGuyEddie · 21 Jul 2002, 20:25 (Ref:339075)

The sponsors have no interest in a deadbroke Arrows either, so I guess they understand what is going on. Its just a dificult matter for all those involved. Ron Dennis revealed he knows a little more on the subject, and he stated that Arrows will compete for the remainder of the season.

Osella · 21 Jul 2002, 20:39 (Ref:339095)

I really hope so. Underneath it all is a good car, good drivers (I'm a real HHF fan and also beieve Bernoldi holds his job on merit)and a team that know a thing or two about racing.

**Spudgun** · 21 Jul 2002, 20:49 (Ref:339111)

I know that back in 1996 one team was quoted as saying that an F1 car cost $3,000 a lap to run not including personnel and other equipment.

No doubt that has sky-rocked in recent years.

Tony Jardine on ITV said that by sitting out Friday practice the team had saved around $300,000. So they saved quite a sum of money by not taking part on Sunday.

But although I can understand why they did it, I think this whole thing is making a mockery of the sport. As I've stressed in a previous thread, surely Tom could see this whole situation coming.

If so, why hire Frentzen? He costs money. Did Tom seriously believe that Jos would sit back and let this happen when he already had a contract for 2002?

I think Tom's past is finally catching up with him.

But on a more general note, surely the Max 'n' Bernie show are going to have to do more to help the teams. Something like.. ummm.. MORE TV MONEY!

If something isn't done the whole thing could collapse and alot more money will be lost by all parties than what they could spend to help keep this whole thing going..

chrisgr31 · 23 Jul 2002, 16:09 (Ref:340790)

Having been at Magny Cours the Arrows situation was highly frustrating. So far the Arrows have given the Jaguars a real run for their money, there was very little information on when/if the Arrows were going to appear etc.

However there was the Orange Arrows merchandising stand which looks greatand lots of Orange billboards all over the place

shiny side up! · 23 Jul 2002, 20:54 (Ref:341105)

According to some of the news today, they may not have HHF for that much longer (going to Toyota, perhaps). IF that were to happen, I'm sure Toyota would have to give Arrows a bit of cash...

I am quite impressed with what Arrows always seems to be able to do on their limited budget. I hope they get this straightened out for the best. It is a shame to not see them whipping Jag's tail on Sunday

steve nielsen · 23 Jul 2002, 21:23 (Ref:341136)

Is Arrows going to Germany?
23-07-2002

We hear that the Arrows transporters are back at base in Leafield giving rise to speculation that the troubled team might not go to the bother of attending this weekend's German GP.
The row over last week's debacle continues and it's believed that a repeat performance in Germany would leave the FIA little option but to come down heavily on the team.

In France Bernoldi and Frentzen played little part in the free practice sessions and ran only one 'hot' lap apiece in qualifying, with neither driver qualifying for the race, as intended.

As previously reported, FIA observers in France will send a report directly to the governing body's lawyers who will act accordingly. Basically although Arrows (in)actions in France fell within the regulations, they brought the sport into disrepute. The sight of the mechanics sitting about talking and laughing while Montoya and Schumacher were disputing pole did Formula One no favours.

Although it's thought that Arrows might get away with the Magny-Cours shenanigans it's understood that a repeat this weekend would give the FIA no choice but to punish the team severely, though quite how remains a mystery.

At present Tom and his team are remaining silent, as F1 keeps a watching eye on the factory gates to see if the transporters begin the long journey to Germany.

(pitpass.com)

Kretzman JB fan · 23 Jul 2002, 23:31 (Ref:341231)

This was a mockery last weekend at France. If they have to purposely DNQ, then they are in serious financial problems. Hopefully they can sell the team because Walkinshaw has done nothing for that team but make them go down hill.

One rumor that I'm hearing is that since McNish has been extremely dissapointing in his first season they may replace him as early as Hungary. Rumors say that they are offering Arrows 4 million to replace McNish with Frentzen. If I were Arrows I would take it because even though you sell off good driver, you could find some other driver to drive the second car, and you could keep your team financially afloat easier.

Hopefully things will straiten out because this has to be one of the wildest silly seasons in recent memory

Valve Bounce · 23 Jul 2002, 23:51 (Ref:341242)

I think Steve neilsen's post is spot on. Lst weekend, Arrows saved a lot of money, including not incurring a $300,000 fine. Could you imagine what would have happened if they had intended to race, and one of the cars was seriously damaged in practice/quals/race? The team is in it's final throes of being sold; I can only hope for hte sake of F1 that everything works out OK, and TW departs F1 permanently.

Valve [img]http://www.**************************/smilies/bouncy.gif[/img]

f1manoz · 24 Jul 2002, 00:32 (Ref:341252)

How can the FIA punish Arrows? By the regulations stated in the FIA 'book', they did nothing wrong.

This could all be compared to the team orders saga, and how it make a 'mockery' of the sport.

JohnnyBravo · 24 Jul 2002, 00:50 (Ref:341262)

McNish dissapointing? Get real, that's a pretty god debut season if you ask me, especially in a 1st year team.

Valve Bounce · 24 Jul 2002, 05:15 (Ref:341338)

Quote:

Originally posted by f1manoz
How can the FIA punish Arrows? By the regulations stated in the FIA 'book', they did nothing wrong.

This could all be compared to the team orders saga, and how it make a 'mockery' of the sport.

F1, I think it hinges on the word participation, and how that is interpreted by the FIA. To be honest, my interpretation is that to participate in a GP, one must make an honest attempt to qualify the car in order to race it. Could be that the FIA might have had a quiet word with Tom Walkinshaw after Mangy and before Germany to make a better effort to race the car or be classified as non participant. In any case, I think there are some rules that the FIA should tighten up on.

Valve

twig · 24 Jul 2002, 07:02 (Ref:341357)

i guess this thread is going nowhere but if Arrows were to have raced, then they would be even further financial troubles. And for the rest of the season, they would not race. For that you would be sorry.
But what happened on the weekend, they drove the minimum, and that was all, so that they can hopefully maximise the future for the team. and for that, you seem digusted. which is confusing.
sure, arrows would have loved to have driven, its just that there is no money to do that.
Its just a pity that F1 is so expensive.

Tom.

Kretzman JB fan · 24 Jul 2002, 17:54 (Ref:341782)

what I meant to say about McNish was that he is not as good as people expected him to be in his first season. Granted the car has given him many problems, but Frentzen seems like a more impressive driver.

Just my opinion but if McNish is at Toyota in 2003 i'll be suprised because hes not a bad driver, its just that hes in a highly touted seat, and there are a lot of drivers that would want his seat

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