HANS devices in club racing

[JohnnyFiama]

More a question out of curiosity than anything..... do club racers use HANS devices? How much do the cost? At what sort of level of racing are you likely to see HANS devices appearing?

Just wondering as the potential for a head-jarring injury must be fairly similar in any form of car motorsport?

[Tim Falce]

It's been discussed at length here and here as well as other places.

[RF_Racer]

I use on myself, not cheap. I you race a single seater, you will need a 30deg model. As I know it, they dont do the plastic version in this angle. There are plenty of views agaist using them.

The level does not matter, you can crash a forulma ford 1600, you can crash a F3 car.. result is the same.... but ask yourself this, how much do you value your neck/life? Only you can answer that!

Motorsport is dangerous, but anything to minimise injury is always a bonus.

[Al Weyman]

I've heard this government is to make them mandatory on bumper cars at the fairground.

[andrew1988]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFiama

More a question out of curiosity than anything..... do club racers use HANS devices? How much do the cost? At what sort of level of racing are you likely to see HANS devices appearing?

Just wondering as the potential for a head-jarring injury must be fairly similar in any form of car motorsport?

I use one, I bought the Sport model as its the cheapest and perfect angle for tin tops.

[tux1234]

Alot of the drivers in the radical series use them. For £500 odd its a worthwhile investment, as you can never put a price on your own safety.

[brickkicker]

As its my first year racing I decided to get one, I wouldnt feel right now without it. Lots of people will knock them (mainly the older generation who think we should still be wearing cloth hats!!!). I cant say it restricts any movement of vision, as they now all come with the new style vision tethers.
Best money you can spend, after all if you have an off you need to go back to work on the monday to be able to get the money to fix it!!

[Al Weyman]

I've never worn a cloth hat in me life. WHy don't they just sell them for a reasonable price say £200 and then we will all have them and please dont come back with that old turkey 'whats your life worth' because that is no excuse for profiteering.

[JamesH]

I'm with Al on that one.....

If you take 'What's your life worth' to the correct conclusion, you wouldn't even get in a race car in the first place. Think about it. You spend £500+new harness on a HANS to make things (allegedly) safer. But if you want the ultimate in safety DON'T GET IN THE CAR.

If you want the ultimate in safety, and still want to race, then buy a F1 car. They are considerably safer than 99% of other race cars out there.

Oh, is that too expensive? How about only racing a tin top. They are (probably) safer than s single seater. Don't want too? But you wanted safe....

So, it's a trade off. You trade safety for money. It's where, in your mind, they break even that you stop looking for more safety, and just go out and enjoy.

[midgetman]

We've done all this before. MODS - any chance of closing this thread before it goes down the same old same old?

[Al Weyman]

Its all a bit quite at the moment Midgetman, what do you expect? :-)

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by midgetman

We've done all this before. MODS - any chance of closing this thread before it goes down the same old same old?

We haven't discussed this for a few months so I see no reason to close it, there are newbies joining all the time who would like info on this sort of thing.
Also my attitudes have been changed since my mate had a biggy at Silvertsone last week, I don't think a HANS would have made any difference to him but I get the feeling he may have saved the other guy from serious injuries although I have no idea if other driver was wearing a HANS or not.
As we say, it's a trade off between cost and "what if" but I am now looking into getting one.

[johnw]

Originally Posted by JamesH

+new harness

No need for a specific harness. a 3" one will do just fine.

[midgetman]

Then I promise I won't go down the same old same old. Sorry falcemob, I forgot the smiley. I was being a touch tongue-in-cheek.

HANS starts to make sense, now you don't need special belts and seats. The helmets with posts fitted aren't that bad a price either. So my next helmet will have the posts and a HANS will be on the list soon.

I still think that basal skull fracture is rare in my form of racing and will take my chances with that, but after my last sizeable shunt I did have a stiff neck and the device is a suitable price to pay to stop that. How long before it becomes compulsory?

[banbury]

The moment it becomes compulsory in club racing is the time I stop.

Safety is good,but if it becomes the be all and end all, don`t race.

[kjw]

I use one and don't have a promlem with it. Once you are driving you dont notice any difference. I agree they are very expensive especially if you have to change your helmet as well. I am sure if as Al said they were £200.00 ish most driver would opt for one, but the current price is excessive.

[AndyV]

Originally Posted by banbury

The moment it becomes compulsory in club racing is the time I stop.

Safety is good,but if it becomes the be all and end all, don`t race.

I hear that, but as it is unlikely to become compulsary before my pristine belts become outdated and my 45yr medical is due I'll be out to pasture already by then as my credit limit will be expended

Is there any sign that a head and neck device other than HANS is likely to gain approval in the UK. I've read on a US SCCA forums that the def'nider (spelling?) has popularity but am unsure of its approval status.

Andy

[Chris Y]

Originally Posted by AndyV

I've read on a US SCCA forums that the def'nider (spelling?) has popularity but am unsure of its approval status.

Def'n'der : http://www.defnderneckbrace.com/

Unsure of any 'approval', or if you need any for UK club racing, but I hope it does get some, because some competition in this market would certainly help Joe Average saloon/single seater racer.

[MGDavid]

I presume you didn't read the reasonably informative article in the latest 'Motorsports Now'
DefNder has been submitted for testing for FIA approval (p15).

[RF_Racer]

Looks clumsy and complicated... cant see it being popular.

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by RF_Racer

Looks clumsy and complicated... cant see it being popular.

It doesn't matter how clumsy it looks as long as people buy them and give the HANS manufacturers some competition.

[RF_Racer]

I dont think the authoroties will let people hack into their own helmets. Look how strick they have become with the installation of hans clips. Now has to be done by the helmet manufacturers.

[bdwoody]

and they are qualified competant people the same degree as the person that fitted my seat and belts....ie me !!!!
like others have said if they were reasonable money then i would buy one just as a little extra saftey,but in 20 odd years of racing ,with more than a few demolition darbys under my belt i have never really seen any of the so called injuries that certain experts are saying. a head on in a granada with a jag does take the wind out of your sails but i allways managed to go to work on a monday .
when the elf and safetys get there claws into club motorsport propper stylie then (as someone posted ) thats it i'm done and it'll be all over for me ...

[socram]

Its the law of diminishing returns. Once we all had hard hats - that helped a lot. Then we had seat belts, and that also helped, then roll over hoops and fire resistant overalls. We then moved to hoops with two back stays, then finally, diagonals and cages.

From that point on, safety improvements have been relatively minor in terms of their overall effect on serious injuries or deaths. However, some circuits still leave a lot to be desired, with Armco or concrete barriers inflicting the damage rather than car on car.

The HANS device is indeed far too expensive. As race overall manufacturers and also as retailers for other items, the HANS still shows the lowest profit margin of any single item we sell, and by the time we have fitted it, it shows no profit whatever, but we feel we have to supply them.

[Rotary7]

A first post from me, but this is a subject of some importance, and one I have done a bit of research on. The one problem not mentioned so far with the HANS device is that it only protects you in a frontal impact - side impacts are dealt with by structures present in the car. Many of the cars we compete in have none of the side impact head restraints present in modern single-seaters, in which case the first impact will likely dislodge the seat belt off the HANS, creating a more perilous situation for the rest of the accident. DefNDer and Leatt Brace,whilst being more cumbersome, offer side impact, rotational freedom of the head, as well as being not needing 2" shoulder strap sections. The Leatt Brace also doesn't require fittings installed in the helmet. They dont yet have a single-seater specific model, but I've done+/- 10 race meetings in a replica 7 with a very reclined moulded seat and the Leatt is just OK. Regarding FIA approval, HANS, DEfNDer, and Leatt are all SFU approved, which is the USA version, and no doubt every bit as strict.