[Driver] Is Lewis the new Gilles?

[strider]

I never though I would be asking this question, but to be fair it's not an original thought. It comes from people whose opinions are far more significant than mine.

It first came to my notice when it was raised by David Tremayne in the admirable e-magazine GP+, which he and Joe Saward produce after each Grand Prix.

Perhaps more importantly, the original source of the thought was Nigel Roebuck, formally of Autosport and now of Motor Sport.

I thought back to Monza last year, and how Lewis crashed on the last lap whilst chasing the dominant Brawns," said Nigel. "That was pure Gilles. Third place meant nothing if there was a chance that he might be able to do better.

Now think of Lewis's driving so far this season. He has been in attack mode the whole time. This is from Tremayne:

Too often in the modern era drivers settle for points, ready to fight again if they don't have a winning car. Lewis has done that himself, especially in 2008. But every so often it's so uplifting to see someone hanging it out because to hell with any other approach, he just wants to squeeze out everything that he and his car have to give. It's a reminder of all that is good and, to use the new F1 word, 'excitating' (sic) about motor racing. You want to see someone who can make the car dance.

I don't think Lewis is going to win the title this season, but he is going to give his all and provide us with plenty of entertainment along the way.

[chunder]

In a word no he isn't!

Gilles was a talent yes and a pure driver, but he was also, at times a little dangerous!!

He pulled off some amazing moves later in his career, but early on was repimanded by many drivers for baing too rash and OTT, much like his best mate Scheckter was early in his career!

Lewis has been controlled, quick and ruthless! I would never have called Gilles ruthless, but definately quick and mayeb a little out of control!!

But by God I miss him!!

[Knowlesy]

He has elements of Gilles I suppose, just much better overall.

[Super Hans]

They definitely share the same determination and will to win, though their motivation is probably different. Gilles' raced for pleasure whereas Lewis seems to be always wanting to prove something to himself or others.

[Belatti]

I must admit that thought crossed my mind while watching Lewis fighting many many times.

Now I have to be careful because after saying that while watching a race with a bunch of Argentinean tifosis they almost beated me to death

[strider]

One thing I think they have in common is that they are out to win every race regardless and the championship seems to be secondary.

[Super Hans]

Originally Posted by strider

One thing I think they have in common is that they are out to win every race regardless and the championship seems to be secondary.

I admire that attitude. That's why I'd like to see a few non-championship Grands Prix with huge prize money. Let the drivers throw caution to the wind and race.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

He has elements of Gilles I suppose, just much better overall.

But for whatever reason will never be loved or revered as much.

[tony griffiths]

Gilles was a gentleman !

[tristancliffe]

Originally Posted by chunder

Gilles was a talent yes and a pure driver, but he was also, at times a little dangerous!!

So much like Lewis. Talented, pure driver, and downright dangerous at times.

Originally Posted by tony griffiths

Gilles was a gentleman !

So very much not like Lewis.

[snowen250]

In some respects yes they are similar, the desire to win never give up spirit is the same. As is the ability to ring the neck of any car they are in.

However personality wise they couldnt be more different. Gilles was quiet, unassuming and often modest regarding his abilities and chances. He would never spit back at the team the way Lewis does.

I respect Lewis as a driver and believe him to be immensley talented. But as a guy, just not keen. Gilles on the other hand.......greatest raw talent that F1 ever saw in my humble opinion, as well as being a nice guy. Dodgy taste in food though.

Simon

[Born Racer]

He is in a way, although I have read nothing of Gilles to make me think he was quite as good as he's sometimes remembered, and as good as Hamilton. He was clearly an inspirational driver, who captured people's imaginations and all the 'artistry' of motor racing. And that is in part why he is remembered fondly.

I'm aware some people think it is sacriledge to even question Gilles Villeneuve's reputation, so I've probably just put myself in the firing line.

[BrendanMcF]

I see more Senna than Villeneuve in Hamilton.

Gilles was a tough, but religiously fair competitor, which ironically probably led to his ultimate demise. He raced to be the fastest, sure to win races if possible, but that wasn't his primary motivation. Being the quickest guy out there was what he thrived upon. That's why he was 11 seconds quicker than anyone else in a wet free practice session at (as far as I remember) Watkins Glen.

Senna was more volatile, passionate, and an intensely driven man. He didn't just want to win, he wanted to dominate, and race wins, and pole positions were his aim.

However, neither are a perfect fit as Hamilton is very much a one-off, and unlike any other driver. He has natural car control like Jim Clark, aggressive overtaking abilities eclipsing even JPM and Mansell, the ability to get one quick lap in qualifying like Senna, wet weather skills that border on the extraterrestrial, and perhaps his only failing is a relative lack of experience. It took Ayrton several years to truly show his ability, and I expect we have not yet seen the best of Lewis.

I never judge a driver's ability by their personality, it's like rating a footballer on his good looks...

[Born Racer]

That's why he was 11 seconds quicker than anyone else in a wet free practice session at (as far as I remember) Watkins Glen.

In context, isn't this slightly less impressive than it's made out to be? I can't remember how but I recall reading that the circumstances make these 11 seconds sound more impressive than they are.

Senna was volatile, so perhaps you're right that he's more like Ayrton.

[F1 Prospects]

Gilles Villeneuve got me hooked on motor racing and I was lucky enough to see him race in Formula Atlantic and in F1.

I think in some ways the memories of Gilles are a bit too rosy because of what happened to him but the great thing about him was that the average fan could identify with him, something they can not do, in my opinion with Senna or Hamilton or almost any other driver in the last 30 years or so. It is a given that he put everything he had into each lap and his outlook was that you had to aim to dominate if you were a true racer but that was his downfall as he tended to lose site of the big picture and aim for points rather than wins when neccessary. Both Senna and Hamilton understand this and apply it where neccessary.

But the reason Villeneuve is so revered even to this day is that he wore his heart on his sleeve, drove to the the full of his potential regardless of the car or his position on the track and had a genuine honesty both in a personal sense and a sporting sense that people recognized and cherished. Was he the best racer in F1? Absolutely not. But he was down to earth and true to himself and that is why he belongs right up there with drivers that have won championships or more races. And that is also why I would caution on calling anybody the "next Gilles" because what made him who he was was not just his performance on the track but how he was off the track as well.

[Super Hans]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

In context, isn't this slightly less impressive than it's made out to be? I can't remember how but I recall reading that the circumstances make these 11 seconds sound more impressive than they are.

IIRC only six cars went out on-track. Five of them took it easy because of the biblical conditions, but Gilles pressed on and went fastest by 11 seconds.

[ralf fan]

Interesting comparison. He does have elements of Gilles from whatever I have read of him.

[strider]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

Senna was volatile, so perhaps you're right that he's more like Ayrton.

Senna was deeply introspective, which is not something I have noticed in Hamilton.

Originally Posted by F1 Prospects

But the reason Villeneuve is so revered even to this day is that he wore his heart on his sleeve, drove to the the full of his potential regardless of the car or his position on the track and had a genuine honesty both in a personal sense and a sporting sense that people recognized and cherished. Was he the best racer in F1? Absolutely not. But he was down to earth and true to himself and that is why he belongs right up there with drivers that have won championships or more races. And that is also why I would caution on calling anybody the "next Gilles" because what made him who he was was not just his performance on the track but how he was off the track as well.

That's a very good assessment of Gilles in my view, but the way I read the comments that started the thread was that they related purely to driving style and attitude to racing, not personal characteristics out of the car. I'd say that Gilles as a whole was one-off and that we shall not see his like again.

[herowassenna]

Originally Posted by Super Hans

IIRC only six cars went out on-track. Five of them took it easy because of the biblical conditions, but Gilles pressed on and went fastest by 11 seconds.

Facts are very black and white though, aren't they?
Of those five cars, one belonged to Jody Schekter, who coming back KNEWhis time couldn't be beaten. He was 4 seconds quicker than the next guy in 3rd, but he was gob-smacked by the 11 seconds to Villeneuve.
Also, Jaques Laffite amongst several drivers, found places to watch, his quote afterwards,
"Gilles is on a different level to us."

Regarding Hamilton's extra-terrestrial skills in the wet, he's performed brilliantly in some wet races and yet been completely invisible in others.
He was quoted in the British media as "being the best in the wet" after his 2008 Silverstone win. Conveniently forgetting 1) that Mclaren was known that year to possess a chassis that kept it's tyres in the correct heat range for wet weather prowess and 2) that he had hit the barrier in Monaco early whilst raining, forcing change of tyres and subsequent race strategy that came to him..
He wasn't exactly a demon at Monza that year, in qualifying or the race. What about Brazil 2008? Nearly lost the title because he was in 6th... till the last corner and a slick shod Glock in the Toyota.
Oh yes, if Hammy's skill are so amazing, why has Button out-performed him whenever it has rained this season.

Red Bull had amazing speed in the rain in last year's Chinese GP, running right round the outside of the Brawns on their way to a 1-2. Circumstances on particular days favour all forms of chassis/ driver combinations. Red Bull in the wet this year don't have last years advantage.

I like Hamilton's attitude. I hate his conceited arrogance and his almost God-like self belief. The other thing that will always neutralise my utmost respect for the man, is that his good fortune means he never served an apprenticeship. All the way through to F1 with Mclaren support, and taking 2 seasons to win at every level. Something Senna didn't need.

Straight into an illegal, best car of the 2007 season, with Dennis favouring Hammy all the way. If he never moves to another team, to prove he's the best no matter what car he's in, how can anyone truly regard him as the greatest? For whatever qualities Hakkinen is meant to have had, and I looked for a long time, all he proved was he could win in a Newey designed Mclaren. Least Hill proved his ability at Arrows and Jordan.

[Adam43]

*wipes tear from eye*

He does attack a bit, yes. Although he is a racing driver. That is it really though.

What about Kovi; those spins in Q were Gilles-esque

[chunterer]

I suppose I can see the link between the two, but as has been hit on already, different drivers, different men, different eras.....

I admit to not liking Hamilton the character, but I do like Hamilton the driver - I've always rooted for press on regardless drivers over percentage game playing 'taxi drivers.'

There have been drivers maybe closer to GV in spirit than Lewis is though. If we talk about irrepressible spirit and the ability to pull off the most audacious, breathtaking or opportunistic moves then Montoya is the clear candidate. Jean Alesi was often compared to Gilles, ironically Jean even had posters of Gilles on his bedroom wall! However Jean and Juan had questionable temperaments something that maybe couldn't be levelled at Villeneuve.

Gilles as a person was from a time way back before his own, even in the early 1980's.

Of the current crop, Timo Glock is another old fashioned hard charger, but I would venture however that the driver maybe most 'like' Gilles of the current crop is actually Vettel? He has the aloof personality, not afraid to speak his mind and is mind blowing on the track, quite often capable of killing his car or tyres whilst pressing on.

[Andy77]

Originally Posted by chunterer

I suppose I can see the link between the two, but as has been hit on already, different drivers, different men, different eras.....

I admit to not liking Hamilton the character, but I do like Hamilton the driver - I've always rooted for press on regardless drivers over percentage game playing 'taxi drivers.'

There have been drivers maybe closer to GV in spirit than Lewis is though. If we talk about irrepressible spirit and the ability to pull off the most audacious, breathtaking or opportunistic moves then Montoya is the clear candidate. Jean Alesi was often compared to Gilles, ironically Jean even had posters of Gilles on his bedroom wall! However Jean and Juan had questionable temperaments something that maybe couldn't be levelled at Villeneuve.

Gilles as a person was from a time way back before his own, even in the early 1980's.

Of the current crop, Timo Glock is another old fashioned hard charger, but I would venture however that the driver maybe most 'like' Gilles of the current crop is actually Vettel? He has the aloof personality, not afraid to speak his mind and is mind blowing on the track, quite often capable of killing his car or tyres whilst pressing on.

And actually all you say reminds me so much of Stefan Bellof. And in comparison I have to agree that it would be more Vettel than Hamilton these days

[Knowlesy]

Originally Posted by Mr V

But for whatever reason will never be loved or revered as much.

Because he is alive?

Different era really. Many drivers of the Gilles era were fantastic people because the sport allowed them to be. Quite simply, more innocent times.

[Bononi]

There's one thing that makes me believe it could be so...

I love to watch him race, the way he races and I think IMHO he's the best driver out there, and will get better and better.

I'm a fan of Gilles since I first saw him racing, and I never saw anyone else do what he did ever more. Before Gilles I was (and am) fan of Ronnie Peterson, another wild driver. I love the way that they raced.

So...simples.

Yes, he might be, he should be. If not the new Gilles, the new Ronnie ! That's enough for me and thank God we have him being like them !!

[jab]

Originally Posted by herowassenna

I like Hamilton's attitude. I hate his conceited arrogance and his almost God-like self belief.

And you're a Senna fan?