Jordan man slams Honda 'mentality'

[neilap]

This seems to be nothing but sour grapes to me. http://www.f1press.net/04011.htm With statements like "...I don't think Honda, or BAR, are going to get it right", it seems that Mr. Phillips has a bone to pick with Honda. Its funny because EJ does not seem to harbor bad feelings.

The article looks a bit contrived but if there is any substance to it then it may explain some of Honda's woes in F1. I remember reading about the new president of the company being a huge factor in Honda joining BAR and not building their own team. Hopefully Honda is not worried about saving face but instead hungry for wins. Ian describes them in much the way Toyota is thought of throughout the industry.

[ASCII Man]

Well, he has a point though. Honda (the company) just isn't the same as they have been in the 80's to early 90's.

And their performance since their comeback in 2000 hasn't been great either, so even i (a life long Honda user and fan) wouldn't be so optimistic about Honda's and BAR's future chances either.

But i do hope they (Honda, BAR and JV) get their act together next year.

[Sodemo]

Drove a Honda Accord Type R about a 2 years ago, blew me away, we got a Subaru in the end though.

[Wrex]

Honda's biggest problem is BAR. Where would Honda be today had they joined Williams instead of BMW?

[f1manoz]

Honda haven't done ANYTHING since they returned to the F1 foray. Their engines have been pitiful in all deparments, but in particular speed and reliability.

Choosing BAR was a good step only in that Honda can take the team over eventually.

[neilap]

Originally posted by f1manoz
Honda haven't done ANYTHING since they returned to the F1 foray. Their engines have been pitiful in all deparments, but in particular speed and reliability.

Choosing BAR was a good step only in that Honda can take the team over eventually.

I don't agree completely. When Honda came back into F1 their motors were as powerful as most on the grid. I would assume (as we all do) that only the top three had better motors. In 2001 they started the season with decent performance. However they were never able to develop the motor the way they wanted to. So then for 2002 they did what Renault did the year before; they took a chance at with a "radical" new motor. By seasons end there was no lack of power. I believe only BMW had a clear advantage over them and the rest of the grid. However there was an inherent issue with the valve-train that plagued them till seasons end.

I think BMW's exceptional performance is what makes Honda's effort look poor.

[Wrex]

What about Toyota Neilap? Their engine was no slouch either.

[Mark Webber]

I think BAR biggest problem is HONDA. And I don't think they will get it right ! HONDA haven't done anything really since the turbo days & I don't belive they will IMO

[f1manoz]

Honda should concentrate on their bike racing. At least they are dominating that...

[enemy-ace]

"To me, success can be achieved only through repeated failure and introspection. In fact, success represents 1 percent of your work and results from the 99 percent that is called failure." ~ Soichiro Honda

I don't really know the character of the man or men in charge at Honda now, but I can only imagine that they are bean-counters more than they are Racers.

[JonesF1]

Originally posted by enemy-ace
I don't really know the character of the man or men in charge at Honda now, but I can only imagine that they are bean-counters more than they are Racers.

Well that can definitly be said about Ford.

[Sato san]

Honda have seemed to shoot them selfs in the foot many times last season...........Damon Hill even said that hiss experinces of Honda in recent years were not good ones.

[neilap]

Originally posted by enemy-ace
"To me, success can be achieved only through repeated failure and introspection. In fact, success represents 1 percent of your work and results from the 99 percent that is called failure." ~ Soichiro Honda

I don't really know the character of the man or men in charge at Honda now, but I can only imagine that they are bean-counters more than they are Racers.

According to Honda their F1 program is run by their R&D department not their "bean counters" that explains the risks that they have taken. Unfortunately for them failure is a word that has often been used to describe their current run in F1. In CART they started out struggling. The same went for their previous time in F1.

Yes it was reported that Toyota has a great motor too and its reliable! This upcoming year Honda are working on lightening the motor and increasing reliability. Power is not their main objective. This alone tells me that power was not their weakness. In past years they stated they wanted to have a motor that was as powerful as the best on the grid. To me this says they have already achieved that.

Honda is in F1 for the challenge. They dominate most of the top series in motorbikes. F1 is the new challenge. They want to win. I believe they will.

Its hilarious to see how easily people write off BAR and Honda. If they were struggling for funds then I may go along with that but that is not the case. Until they quit they still have a chance.

[ParkLife]

I don't think people easily write off Honda, but BAR on the other hand are a different situation. It is plainly obvious why people write them off. Every year they have spent in F1 they have massivly underachieved.

If BAR do not show huge improvement next year then they never will IMO.