Marshals help required please

[johnw]

I originally posted this question, buried in another thread.

"Finally, was there a report, verbal or written, about the Schuey/Alonso incident at Silverstone and what was the feedback?"

Having realised that no-one responded to my question, I'll try again. There were plenty of you at Silverstone, someone must know.

If no report submitted, why not?
If there was a submission, what was fed back to the originator?

I'd really like to know, not for idle gossip, but as I intend bringing this up at an MSA meeting to which I have been "invited" in order to discuss my concerns with all things safety.

Your assistance, as ever, much appreciated.

John

[Stephen Green]

John,

As a rule marshals are requested not to talk in open forums about possible disciplinary matters. This may explain why you didn't get much if any response?

[johnw]

Thank you for that Stephen
I was beginning to think that the thought police had taken over.

I didn't want any discussion re the merits or otherwise of the move, just to know whether anyone reported anything.

The point being, that if we lesser mortals see that sort of move going unpunished, we could reasonably assume that it is condoned/approved by the MSA - rather like the stupid "one move" rule that was invented a few seasons ago.

If any of you are under the no discussion in open forum veto, you could always PM me? All I am trying to do is get the MSA to own it's responsibilities.

Cheers
John

[Stephen Green]

That was going to be my next suggestion...PM's

[Piglet]

I'd also imagine that as a general point procedures that are in place at the GP do not necessarily reflect what happens over the rest of the year. The involvement of the FIA means (as I see it) that things do not happen in the same way. I'd be very surprised if a marshal got feedback in this context - I'd also imagine that there is much more reliance on the cameras and recorded footage in race control than the brief written or verbal report of the guys on the ground who may only have seen either the beginning or the middle or the end of the manoeuvre.

[Woolley]

Despite all of the cameras and footage, we note that big Schumi apparently did nothing untoward, little Schumi was obiously not at fault for the Hockenheim shunt, but Montoya was blatantly responsible for nerfing Barrichello off as he shouldn't have been mostly alongside him. Go figure, as they say. No, F1 is not the best example to follow...

[johnw]

Thanks Piglet
I sort of assumed that things might be different, but I note the despite 139 views on this thread, nobody submitted a report.

Woolley
Whilst I agree with your sentiments, let's not open the door to TGF v Everyone else takeovers.

I am trying to establish whether the normal MSA procedures are followed at a GP in Britain.

If not, it would seem reasonable to me that the FIA/MSA or whomever make it clear to the rest of us that the careless/reckless/dangerous moves which are obviously condoned in F1 (and BTCC and even Cupra's), will not be accepted in club racing.

John

[EvilPumpkin]

Just a note folks, as I understand it, we aren't to discuss contraversial situations with interested parties except through the relevant club and with a formal approach from the person involved.

This isn't a question of "thought police" John - it's a question of professionalism and fairness to all involved parties. It's also for the protection of the marshals involved. One careless remark can get you into a lot of trouble if you make it to the wrong person.

[JimW]

John

I suspect that if you do the maths (numbers of marshals at the GP who saw the incident and compare that with the number of marshals who use ten tenths) it is quite likely that the people at that corner are not seeing your request.

Have a good break - oops no, make that a good holiday.

Jim

[Woolley]

Originally posted by johnw
Woolley
Whilst I agree with your sentiments, let's not open the door to TGF v Everyone else takeovers.

Just happens they were the most obvious strange decisions, rather than directed at any particular drivers. I'm sure there were others, but frankly I don't watch that much F1 as I prefer motorsport!

[johnw]

Pumpkin
Clarity and transparency are always the casualties of petty bureaucracy.

I fail to see how identifying whether a report was submitted, or not, compromises your professionalism or could be seen as controversial.

However, I certainly wouldn't want to compromise any marshals, so thanks for the advice. I must anticipate a "lot of trouble" as I'm just bursting to vent forth with careless and intemperate remarks at the MSA meeting.

Jim
Was always rubbish at math, but understand your point - thank you. Trying hard not too break anything except perhaps the status quo. Have a great holiday yourself.

Originally posted by Woolley
.....but frankly I don't watch that much F1 as I prefer motorsport!

Most Excellent!

[EvilPumpkin]

Originally posted by johnw

Clarity and transparency are always the casualties of petty bureaucracy.

I fail to see how identifying whether a report was submitted, or not, compromises your professionalism or could be seen as controversial.

Hi John,

Yes I suppose they are - but at the same time, people have a right to consistent and fair treatment and that's difficult to enforce if rules get changed or bent for one individual and not another.

If you want to know if a report was submitted, all you have to do is contact the Chief Marshal for the event. He/She should be able to give you that information and that maintains the integrity of the information as well as the clarity and transparancy. It's a lot more convincing if you get your information through official channels than from "some bloke/blokette I met on the internet"!!!

If you're going to be intemperate, then make sure you're standing on solid ground, not quicksand!

[johnw]

Thanks for that Pumpkin
Is it permissible to let me know who the Chief Marshal was for the GP in question?

Must say, some of the most convincing and transparent people I have encountered in motorsport have been the ones met though this medium, but understand your point, thank you.

I was told long ago that it was best to stand firmly when throwing punches. It has worked so far!

Much appreciate your concern and advice.
Merry Christmas.
John

[EvilPumpkin]

Originally posted by johnw
Thanks for that Pumpkin
Is it permissible to let me know who the Chief Marshal was for the GP in question?

That one I can't answer - but if it isn't, I'm sure someone can steer you in the direction of the marshals club who are responsible and from there to the CM.

Have a great Christmas too!

[Alan Green]

Possibly best to contact the MSA directly for the contact? via www.msauk.org

Al.

[Guisbro Rod H]

In the F1 Business, how does an observer transmit his report in writing? It is a long time since I assited at a GP; it was before the 20 minute rule and pit stop penalties. Are the observers each issued with a fax machine? Presumably after the event is too late because the presentation is completed and the Press will not want marshals reports changing results retrospectively.

May I therefore ask how Observer's written reports processed?

[Stephen Green]

The GP is no different to any other race in many respects. Observers reports are telephoned into race control and followed with a written report. Any additional information that may be required by race control of the stewards will be asked for via the telephone.

[Guisbro Rod H]

Thank you Stephen - Rod Harrap