Help with grading please?

[David Hardie]

Can anyone help? I am a marshal at Croft with the DDMC, and expressed an interest in flag marshaling. I have been upgraded for 2006 from Course to Incident, but looking at the MSA upgrading flow chart, which came with the licence, this shows I could have gone to flag for my 10 signatures. Can anyone confirm this is correct, or am I reading it wrong.
If its correct, how can I change from Incident to Flag?

Cheers all,

David

[Dave Brand]

You will have been upgraded to incident because that is the upgrade for which you have been given signatures; if you look at your grading card (assuming you kept a copy), under 'duty' you will see 'incident'. To upgrade to flag you require the appropriate training & ten signatures for satisfactory performance of the flag duty.

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by Dave Brand

You will have been upgraded to incident because that is the upgrade for which you have been given signatures; if you look at your grading card (assuming you kept a copy), under 'duty' you will see 'incident'.

Hmmm.....I could have explained that better - should have looked at a card before posting!

If you look at the top of the grading card you will see, under the name & MSA number, 'Upgrading to', where the grade that card relates to must be written. In the grid for signatures you will see a 'Duty' column; the duty you have obtained a signature for must, of course, match the grade at the top of the card, otherwise the signature will not be accepted for grading purposes.

[Stoowert]

Isn't there a time limit on upgrading? This being to stop power-crazed individuals becoming Observers in 3 years...And what is the differance between Course and Incident Marshals anyway?

[Hepatic]

course is the 1st "recognised" grade for being on the bank and being of an adequate standard. Incident is a more experienced grade showing more understanding of the handling of situations, and are usually the people that get teamed up with trainees / course marshals when you are paired up (if we're lucky!) on a post.

[David Hardie]

OK cheers, thats fine. I now seem to have a licence here, with an attendance record on the back to be signed at each meeting. Do I now need an upgrading card saying - "Upgrading to. FLAG" as I dont seem to have one of those. I know that the attendance card cant be used to upgrade.
Believe it or not I started marshalling in 2000, but have only just had my 'proper' licence sorted out by the club - hence my being a bit in the dark as to what to do !!
Please advise further.

[Peter Harding]

In theory, course is cleaning up at the end of the session and not actually dealing with things while the cars are running (ie attending the driver on track, putting fires out). The incident grade came out of the old "Fire" grade.

In practice, of course, (or is that "of incident") it only suggests two levels of ability.

To get to flag you should get the required number of signiatures doing that job as a trainee flag (and yes you should get an upgrade card for that purpose although they do have two sides so you may be able to use side 2). Start the season asking the chief marshal to assign you to trainee flag and put you with someone who can train you and give signiatures. But be aware that the current MSA/Govt led projects are reviewing the grades and grading process.

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by Peter Harding

(and yes you should get an upgrade card for that purpose although they do have two sides so you may be able to use side 2).

Upgrading cards are now single-sided (well, mine is!). On the reverse they now have a place for a picture of the marshal & spaces for examining official's comments.

[Woolley]

Originally Posted by Peter Harding

In practice, of course, (or is that "of incident") it only suggests two levels of ability.

I'd offer 'experience' rather than 'ability'. No reason why anybody capable of making green can't move comfortably to red. Once you have an incident grade it suggest to me that have sufficient experience to cover for an incident officer and give training to new marshals.

[Robin_D]

Sometimes there is more behind the badge that meets the eye. I have (today) finally collected my final signature after being a trainee for 6 seasons. I have mislaid/ destroyed various grading cards and just did not get round to filling out another.
It has become a standing joke now.

[KayBee]

Originally Posted by David Hardie

OK cheers, thats fine. I now seem to have a licence here, with an attendance record on the back to be signed at each meeting. Do I now need an upgrading card saying - "Upgrading to. FLAG" as I dont seem to have one of those. I know that the attendance card cant be used to upgrade.
Believe it or not I started marshalling in 2000, but have only just had my 'proper' licence sorted out by the club - hence my being a bit in the dark as to what to do !!
Please advise further.

I take it you're a Croft regular - so you need to contact the person(s) in charge of training and grading there so that you can attend the flag training day, get the relevant upgrading card and then next season working as a flag marshal.

[Stoowert]

Don't you all think this grading lark is a bit too complex? It seems that you need some degree from the University of MSA to understand all the grades!I thought we were all marshals! I tell my lot in my morning briefing that we are ALL observers. Keep watching the track and report anything you think Race Control would want to know - howerver trivial. This, I hope, gets everyone thinking along similar lines. We are all experienced in incidents, except the very new. How long do you get called a true novice? I'd say about 4 meetings! Even if you haven't actually dealed with every kind of incident, when you first take to the orange, your brain is like a sponge, absorbing all sorts of information. Trouble is, when you get to be observer, your mind reverts to a sponge again - a bath sponge!

[The Fat Clerk]

Believe me it's even worse when you get to be a Clerk!

[scorch]

Originally Posted by Woolley

Once you have an incident grade it suggest to me that have sufficient experience to cover for an incident officer and give training to new marshals.

WOW I would be very very careful making assumptions like that...

[Woolley]

'suggests', I said, choosing my words very carefully! Assume nothing until you've got more evidence to support it. Grades at best are a guide to what you expect from the person, but it's quite possible to have a brilliant trainee and a useless I/O (the latter is much rarer than the former, though).

[The Fat Clerk]

hear, hear.