Test Track Emmen Holland

[F1 lobby]

I made a design to extend a brand new test track in the north of Holland which they developed at the end of last year 2012.
This extension could be a realistic proposal to be approved by Emmen municipal district and the province of Drenthe.
Only proposals should be made quite quick to have a bit of a chance that it will be considered because extension of the track is fact, just a matter of time and money but licences are already there.

Currently it's a 850 meter oval track mainly but in the near future they will extend the track to a total of 2300 meters which is already approved. So now the design can still be improved and extended to a FIA classified race track.
There are already a kart track and a dirt track located next to it so Speedpark Emmen could maybe become the next dutch playground!

The design is a 4600 meter track with a total height difference of 15 meter, hills throughout several sections with positive camber of 10 degrees corners. The straight wil be ground level which connects with the existing "oval" part.
Heighest level points on the apexes, and 12 meters width.

[F1 lobby]

I see there are quite some views to this thread but no replies, your creations are also welcome ofcourse! Just keep in mind that the height differences and the banking of corners stays the same. The available building area is approximately 600 meter by 600 meter.

The green lines are sound retaining walls of 5 meters high, which are already placed on the west side, towards the city of Emmen at 10 km distance.
The total area is 1000 meters west side and 600 meter north side. The entrance is on the south side with enough parking space around the trees area.
You can check the terrain at Google Earth, search for " Pottendijk, Emmen"

I am curious what kind of solutions you guys come up with!

[werner]

I guess the , let's say, more neatly painted white line is the current proposal? Your proposal is very, very twisty. It will be fine to drive around with a roadcar, but for a race it seems a bit to tight. Paddockspace is very crampted aswell The exeption is offcourse the corner before the longisch straight. For safetyreasons that should probably be changed however, there is no runoff at all possible.

So, just a testtrack, or a place to have some fun with a roadcar would do fine, a real racetrack, not so much. No problem though, sicne that real racetrack is 50km away in Assen.

[F1 lobby]

Werner yes the neatly drawed lines are the approved future track.
Because it's an area of 1000 x 600 meters it will be possible to create this twisty proposal although it will be a real skilled drivers track. It is very demanding for both riders and tyres but that's where the real skills of the driver will be shown.

The last corner is probably not possible to make like that because of the lack of run-off space but despite it's a very fast corner it's exit isn't quite as dangerous as it looks now, lot of tyre walls will do I guess...?

Paddock space on the left after the last corner, maximum available width is appr. 300 meter, pitlane entry before the last corner and the pitlane exit runs until the "oval" part.

[F1 lobby]

Guys I earlier posted about a current design which is already approved but the owner is willing to consider an extension if the proposed design is suitable for the area.
I live close by and I will arrange an appointment with the owner to propose our alternative lay-out.
Now is the moment to have a fair chance to realise your design, at least propose your own design, after your posts we need to discuss together which design will be elected. That design needs to be visualized in Bobs Track Builder, and I saw that Bio is very good in 3d animations

I made a rough sketch but it is maybe too twisty for the available size.
What I already mentioned is that we need to use elevation changes in the design, I was thinking of a maximum elevation of 10-15 meters with 10 degrees banking curves. The approved future extension is 2350 meter, I planned to make twice that size. The area too be filled is 600 meter by 600 meter.

Approved future track: 2350 meter

http://www.testtrackthedinga.com/upl...Pottendijk.jpg

Current oval track: 840 meter

http://www.testtrackthedinga.nl/uplo...nga%20site.jpg

Their website is: www.testtrackthedinga.nl

I'm curious with what you guys come up with...

[F1 lobby]

A lot of viewers but not even one alternative design!? Even though this could turn out to be a realistic development nobody wants his fantasy designs to become reality I guess so just keep on dreaming

[F1 lobby]

A while ago I had an idea to propose a more attractive design for a test track in Holland. It will never be a F1 track but a good club track would be nice.
The owner already have an approval for an extension of the track, total length 2350 meters.

I just made again a simple, bad sketch(clockwise) but I would like to see some more attractive and efficient designs which uses the quite cramped space of a 600 x 600 meters field. Some elevation changes would be appreciated
Try to maintain a total length of 4500 until 5000 meters (the oval included)


[IMG][/IMG]


This is the current existing test track, length 840 meters:


Google earth: Kartcircuit Pottendijk, Pottendijk WZ, Nieuw-Weerdinge 52°49'11.59" N 6°58'49.37" O

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Perhaps you didn't get ant takers is due to the lack of relevant information, things such as track width, levels of safety- Tarmac run off or grass and gravel. If it's a test circuit are you looking for an access road from most points back to paddock, or would it because red flag and towed or trucked back to the paddock around the rest of circuit.

Your own suggestion shows track lines quite close together what is the min separation?

[F1 lobby]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

Perhaps you didn't get ant takers is due to the lack of relevant information, things such as track width, levels of safety- Tarmac run off or grass and gravel. If it's a test circuit are you looking for an access road from most points back to paddock, or would it because red flag and towed or trucked back to the paddock around the rest of circuit.

Your own suggestion shows track lines quite close together what is the min separation?

That lack of info could be the reason yes that there are no suggestions uphere for a lay-out but this project could be a real one, like I explained in earlier posts.
But the design of the lay-out needs to be 3d visualized (in Rfactor) on the end to present it to the owner of the property. So I hope you guys will post some good designs and after we can discuss all together here which lay-out will be the best option. I already have seen some existing designs of you, SpeedingTurtoise, SKG thunder and Bio which already are attached to a oval like section so maybe only a few minor adjustments will do...

Try to maintain a total length of the "new" extension of about max. 4200 meter and a width of 12 meters.
If you can come up with a flowing track on 5-10 meters elevation change throughout the track would be nice and keep in mind that the south oval curve already has a banking of 70 cm height difference on 13 meters width, so that's like 15 degrees??
Just try to be efficient as possible with the cramped square area..Clockwise or anti-clockwise, you decide...

The minimum seperation between the track lines should be considered within a proper run-off area. An access road throughout the inside of the green soudwalls, especially north, east and a part of the south side is a good idea but maybe not very necessary, depends of the purpose, just a club track or intentions to hold an international racing series.

There are a few options for the pit area, the existing 840 meter sprint track/oval has a potential pit entry/exit which measures only 200 meters length on the east side. but if you want to have more space for a proper pitlane/paddock of about 300 meters length than the best option would be on the longest straight, on the left, west side. But the southside could also be suitable, just above the "new"parking area, paddock area..

The green soundwalls made of soil are 5 meters high and 10 meters diameter.
Those soundwalls are present on the southwest side and a part of the west side but needs to be extended throughout the whole outside of the property. Those green soundbarriers can also be used for grandstands.

About parking space, how many visitors will be attracted, for which events, it depends, if the intention is to get a FIA grade 2 for testing and GT series or WTCC, than the current parkinglot/paddock on the south side won't be enough and therefore could be used an extra area above the trees area. Like in the first sketch I left some space for parking.



[IMG]

[LuiggiSpeed]

Just had a look at your post, I'd be the "specialist" for cramped tracks, myself always trying to maximize space efficiency....expect something from me soon...

[LuiggiSpeed]

If I had so much spacer Id come with this 3.2Km affair, 13 turns and the usual combination of turns that I like to see. It's a little bit of a Sepang cross with my favorite S concept somewhat. I'm not claiming it's the wildest track I've ever drawn, but I'd be more than happy to test my motorcycles here. All you need is the official "other track" and the junctions.

[F1 lobby]

Originally Posted by LuiggiSpeed

If I had so much spacer Id come with this 3.2Km affair, 13 turns and the usual combination of turns that I like to see. It's a little bit of a Sepang cross with my favorite S concept somewhat. I'm not claiming it's the wildest track I've ever drawn, but I'd be more than happy to test my motorcycles here. All you need is the official "other track" and the junctions.

Luiggi I like your design because it's quite efficient already but where are the junctions to the existing oval track?

I attached again a pic of the existing, current part which is already there, from there on the track needs to be extended. I covered up the current extension design with green color so you guys have a clear picture of where the extension needs to be connected to that current, already existing oval part.

[LuiggiSpeed]

Originally Posted by F1 lobby

Luiggi I like your design because it's quite efficient already but where are the junctions to the existing oval track?

I attached again a pic of the existing, current part which is already there, from there on the track needs to be extended. I covered up the current extension design with green color so you guys have a clear picture of where the extension needs to be connected to that current, already existing oval part.

Thanks!! I couldn't download the correct sized pic to work over, I'll try something more serious shortly

Looks like you are "the other one" that designs thinking in some specific site! Nice to have you around, I'll try a little something for you brother.

So the green part is not there but the white/red is and you want an extension to the existing, not necessarily with the green idea?

[F1 lobby]

Originally Posted by LuiggiSpeed

Thanks!! I couldn't download the correct sized pic to work over, I'll try something more serious shortly

Looks like you are "the other one" that designs thinking in some specific site! Nice to have you around, I'll try a little something for you brother.

So the green part is not there but the white/red is and you want an extension to the existing, not necessarily with the green idea?

yep connected to the white/red part

Thanks mate you seem to understand where Im coming from, it's nice to dream away by our fantasy tracks but to tell you guys the truth I am quite dissapointed in the amount of responses and feedback, since half a year I found out about this site and thought to be at the right adress to find some support from (race)track minded people but it seems that a few of you uphere only are focused on fairytales about their dream fantasy designs but where is this forum for in the first place anyway? We all would like to see one of our designs one day become reality don't we? Or do we let this asswipe Tilke spoil all tracks with his genius lay-outs, not, this guy has the reputation but for what actually?? All of his designs have at least 2-3 first gear curves and 2-3 long straigths, that's not racing but pulling away at the traffic lights,,,ok ok little bit overdone but you know what I mean right

In a short period of time I started 3 very realistic threads, about Zandvoort, the I Challenge project and now again this test track proposal, for your fantasy designs to maybe become reality and what did I get, bearly one proper suggestion, let alone a descent proposal! I noticed on all 3 threads a massive amount of views but almost no one who really shows his interest or visions about these real life track issues, maybe because it's only Holland or are there some real amateur racers overhere anyway? (like me dutch SBK) I expected at least some feedback of the dutch guys uphere.. It's nice to talk about length, pitlanes, paddock, lay-outs, curves and straights but do you really know how it feels to attack a curve with 200+ km an hour?

Anyway i just try and hope for the last time te get some ideas of you guys, you Luiggi, just like SpeedingTurtoise, ScotsBrutesfan and some others have made already some interesting flowing lay-outs which only need to be adjusted but the connection to "my" oval section is already there so that's what I'm looking for, just like your designs downunder:

[LuiggiSpeed]

It's nice to talk about length, pitlanes, paddock, lay-outs, curves and straights but do you really know how it feels to attack a curve with 200+ km an hour?

I do!

I race motorcycles, though to be honest, I'm kind of slow compared to the real pros, but I do know what the heart pounding at 180bpm means and what you feel when someone sticks a motorcycle underneath you unexpectedly and forces you wide, but you don't get mad, you look him up after the race and cheer him up!

[LuiggiSpeed]

Before I go crazy on sketchup , I'd like to throw out a couple of simple lines just to get the "feel" of the terrain. I'd start with this one, the total length is 4668 meters, including the existing oval section, I choose to go CW and got some 775m main straight, good enough for top gear, following a couple of wide turns to spread out the field before the real first tight corner, I choose to include some tight corners, because...well, they're fun! then some increasing radius corner, a fast corner that leads to a tricky stop, since the faster and wider you go, the worst you will do on the next one, so the right balance will give pilots various options, before the next hard stop, then direction change to a fast corner, a run for another medium tight corner followed by a DA that opens up (I love those) leading to a hairpin and an annoying section not unlike Catalunya's middle corner leading to yet another left that leads back to the oval. The pit lane can be located in the oval area. Hope you didn't get dizzy with my track, it's some 17 corners for 4.7K so it's not that bad because most corners are fast. I see 10 rights and 7 lefts so its fairly balanced for the tires.It's still at a very simple stage so it can be tweaked.

[F1 lobby]

This lay-out looks already great! How you think about an SSes on the second longest straight?

[F1 lobby]

Luiggi sorry man for messing up your sketch but these little tweaks are just the finishing touches of your design,,and we're done! It's a wrap What a thrilling lay-out this would be!

I opened up T4 and T5, I created "new" T10 the almost flat out chicane, and I opened up T16 also to keep the flow in the lap. There are already a few braking zones so passing will be challenge anyway. But hey that's racing ain't it?!

For some 4 elevation changes T14/T15 (" the SSes") could be build on a hill of 10 meter with a steep slope towards the highest level of the right apex of T14, T15 steep downhill towards T16. Also T7 build on a hill of 5 meters and the new chicane "new" T10 also build on a 5 meter hill. T4 also build on a 5 meter hill to create a blind entry into T5.

It's just a silly idea so just tell me if I lost my mind on this one

[SpeedingTortoise]

My idea for this site. It was quite tricky to get the length out of this track but i think I have came with a solution that is a good compromise between length and speed.

4.12km 11m track width Clockwise. Will be finished later with barriers and run off.

[F1 lobby]

Originally Posted by SpeedingTortoise

My idea for this site. It was quite tricky to get the length out of this track but i think I have came with a solution that is a good compromise between length and speed.

4.12km 11m track width Clockwise. Will be finished later with barriers and run off.

Nice lay-out too but Im a little concerned about the amount of right corners in the first sector, from the last corner (oval) until the first left hander are 6 corners and 50% of the total track length so I assume that the right tyres will cool down too much, don't you think?

[SpeedingTortoise]

Made a few changes to this. Changed the right-left-right to be a bit tighter and now the left kink is a proper corner now.Also opened up the hairpin and added barriers and run off.
Track length now 4.12km.

[F1 lobby]

Hi nice job man, only I would suggest to open up the hairpin slightly more with a mild bend towards T11 to create a more flowing entry into T12, and also open up the first proper left corner of the lap T8, therefore T7 needs to be moved down about 50 meters. The run-off will still be big enough for that part of the turn.
I abused your sketch too but like this it's more clear what I mean



You managed to use the space quite effictiently but only 4100 meters length, that is included the current oval?

[ScotsBrutesFan]

How about something a little like this...



Excuse the jaunty angle

[F1 lobby]

Originally Posted by ScotsBrutesFan

How about something a little like this...

Attachment 41822

Excuse the jaunty angle

The shape reminds me of a puzzle piece also a very efficient one although this lay-out is more technical with a lot of hard braking, I miss a little bit the flow in the track except T11 and T13 but besides that it's a yet very divers lay-out

[SpeedingTortoise]

Refined this one even more. The left kink/corner has been removed so there is more space for the new infield. The hairpin has been opened up even more and the run down to the long right hander has been increased. The track length is now 4.96km.