DC: should he be champion?

[Ralf's Girl]

I know there are a lot of mixed opinions on whether or not DC should be champion/would be a deserving champion, etc. etc. But what are your personal thoughts? Do you think he could/should be champion and why?

I don't think (at this point) that he should be champion. My reason is that having compared him to Hakkinen, and to Britain's last world champion (ah, good old Damon...), I don't think he is anywhere near the standard of a world champion.

Compared to Hakkinen - having had the best car in 98 and 99, DC took three measly victories compared to Hakkinen's two world championships. He started last year stronger than Hakkinen, only to tail off mid-season and be completely outperformed. I see no reason why that won't happen again this year.

Compared to Damon - well, for DC to be able to say he achieved as much as Damon despite having only won half as many races is ridiculous. Despite some people insisting that Damon won because he had the best car, you can't win in the best car unless you know how to use it (as proven by Frentzen in 97). So I don't think DC should achieve what Damon did because he's just not as good.

I know it's early in the season, but talk of the championship (obviously) starts as soon as round 1 is over, so I'm interested to hear other opinions on the "DC debate".

[Maxmil]

Originally posted by Ralf's Girl
But what are your personal thoughts? Do you think he could/should be champion and why?

If DC can beat TGF for the championship, he will deserve it. Any driver regardless of their personal attributes, past record, color of hair, personal morals, etc., etc., etc. who accumulates the most points in the course of a 16 or 17 race season deserves the championship. That's the way the game is played. We are all free to like or dislike the champion (DC or TGF) and to say what we please about them, but that will not change anything as far as the championship is concerned.

[Nicholas]

Well, although his "This year is mine" quotes are treated with ridicule each year, his threat is gradually becoming greater and greater every time. I truly believe he is still reaching his peak and regular podiums have shown that.

At the beginning of last year he was being beaten by Hakkinen in qualifying. He still is this year, but he is really closing the gap.

Few seem to remember in the wake of Montoya being punted out by Verstappen that he outperformed TGF the rain-master in the wet to take victory and he is becoming more and more consistent every year.

Incidentally, for those who don't know, Newey admitted (very carefully, trying to keep his brain in focus) that the botched up start yesterday was indeed Hakkinen's fault, at least partly.

Even TGF has finally admitted that DC is a threat. Last year was not necessarily an accurate representation of DC's efforts because Hakkinen was close behind points-wise, perhaps causing Mclaren to defer to Hakkinen (wouldn't you?) when it came to making the big decision. Like ordering him to jump the start in Indy to hold up TGF (ridiculous but true).

But now it seems that unless Hakkinen pulls off a miracle, with the backing of the full team behind him in late-season, DC really could be champ.

[JeremySmith]

Well if he continues to drive the way he drove yesterday,then yes absolutely he deserves to be world champion.. Michael has finally recognized David as a real threat, about time..Michael does not care for David of course on a personal level does he,and plays Mika up to try and unerve David..Head games!

[Liz]

Yes, he does.

This is from an F1 newsletter put out by British Racing Green:

Coultard insists he is above handouts from teammates.

Michael Schumacher's second place finish in the Austrian Grand Prix has received criticism from various people within the F1 fraternity when Rubens Barrichello was ordered by the team to pass him for second place on Sunday.

Race winner David Coultard said that drivers should be above handouts from their teammates and explained "Michael can't be satisfied with the way he was handed second place on a tray. I've never had anybody give me points and if I win the title, it won't be because of anyone else.... Every point I've earned in F1 has been through racing."

That's why DC deserves to win the championship, and if he does win it, why he will not only be a winner, but a Champion.

[francis]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Liz
[

Race winner David Coultard said that drivers should be above handouts from their teammates and explained "Michael can't be satisfied with the way he was handed second place on a tray. I've never had anybody give me points and if I win the title, it won't be because of anyone else.... Every point I've earned in F1 has been through racing." [/I]


But then he also said (jokingly I assume - cos I only saw it in print) something along the lines of

Don't ban it (team ordered overtaking) until I've had the chance to benefit from it.

Incidentally I just joined the forum and am looking forward to being an active member - but what does TDF stand for? I do of course realise who it stands for.

[francis]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by francis
[

Incidentally I just joined the forum and am looking forward to being an active member - but what does TDF stand for? I do of course realise who it stands for.

Sorry - I meant TGF - typo

[Liz]

Hello and welcome! TGF stands for That German Fellow. It's not meant to be derogatory, it's just a shorter way of writing his name.

[Orange]

Welcome Francis!

TGF is "That German Fellow" apparantly coined by Liz...

As far as DC's winning the championship, its never going to happen (for better or worse.) Although he has been putting on a good show so far, this year belongs to TGF... as disappointing as that may be. The future belongs to Williams, Honda and Renault, so unless DC moves (which he almost definately will not) he is doomed to be remembered for all time as the the guy who could have been Champion. As far as his being above "taking handouts" it is easy for him to say that, having spent how many years being the guy giving the handouts... Once Mika is gone, and he has Nick Heidfeld (or some other young un) backing him up, he will be more than happy to make him move over and give him some points

[KC]

I have never understood how one driver could be more deserving than another.

Who ever has the most points should be the champion.

If DC wins it all he will have earned it, just like MS or MH before him.


No edit, just a url fix

[EERO]

RG, I 'm a little surprised that you would post this thread. Say what you will about DC, he perseveres. If he wins it, he wins it and that's ALL that matters. There is a big difference between saying "I don't think he is talented enough to do it" and "Even if he does it, he doesn't deserve it". How would you feel, having made your best effort to achieve a a long sought after goal, if some one said to you, "You don't deserve it."

I, for one, hope he gets it, and I think he'd be an excelleant champion. He is poised, gracious, gentlemanly, and likeable. If he does win, he will be very deserving.

As KC says:
Who ever has the most points should be the champion.

[Roy2]

That would be okay with me. He was bumped from the Williams team in favour of JaV at a time when he was beginning to out-qualify Hill. He had two character building years with McLaren before they got it right in '98, then hung in there as Mr. Nice Guy against a superb Hakkinen in '99/00.

I think he learned the hard way that you get no respect, no thanks, for deferring to a team mate. It hurts the reputation,lowers the market value, and it's the last thing a driver should do until he's mathematically out of it. Racers like Frank Williams have contempt for nice guys who defer. Rubens should never obey another team order and you can bet that DC won't.

He's the best passer in F1, on his game, and is the man to beat Schumacher this year. It's too bad, IMO, that Ferrari play the game the way they do. If McLaren won't do the same for DC, then DC and MS are not playing on the same field. Ferrari have no shame, so it's up to Rubens or Ron to see that MS isn't gifted to the title. Rubens for his own sake and Dennis for the sake of the sport.

For the sake of the sport??? Yes, because the practice should either be banned or normalized if the world driving championship is going to be fought out on a level playing field. In the '50's no. 2's were routinely pulled from their cars in favour of the no.1 if his car quit. It was done by all teams, recognized as unfair, and stopped.
What Ferrari are doing and the FIA is allowing is ****, IMO.

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally posted by EERO
RG, I 'm a little surprised that you would post this thread. Say what you will about DC, he perseveres. If he wins it, he wins it and that's ALL that matters. There is a big difference between saying "I don't think he is talented enough to do it" and "Even if he does it, he doesn't deserve it". How would you feel, having made your best effort to achieve a a long sought after goal, if some one said to you, "You don't deserve it."

But on the other hand, there is much talk of how TGF didn't deserve to win the 1994 championship - yet he had the most points and he won it.

As I said, having compared him to his team-mate his record is less than impressive, and perhaps the fact that I don't want to see DC win stems from my being a Damon Hill fan, and my opinion that to achieve the same feat when he isn't as good would be unfair. I also said: "I don't think DC should achieve what Damon did because he's just not as good."

However, that is just my opinion and I'm just interested to see what other people think - I'm not trying to make anyone else think the same way as me.

[KC]

I don't have any sympathy for RB if he signed a contract that expressly forbids him to actively seek to beat his teammate or requires for him to be subservient. After all, you must have some respect for yourself. What good is racing one of the best cars if not the best, if you can only race for one position behind your teammate?

However, I think RB's contract does not require him to be subservient to MS. I think MS's contract says that the team is required to keep any teammate subservient. So he gets the order on the radio to let MS by and he must comply for fear of being sacked by the team. The man drove an excellent race in Austria and had as much a chance to win it outright as DC or MS did, that is until team orders came into effect at mid-point of the season. I think the silver lining has worn off of RB's dream drive with Ferrari. Or at least it looked that way in his face in the post-race press conference.

[Tristan]

Whoever gets the most points indeed SHOULD be WDC. Doesn't necessarily make them the best driver, though. DC ISN'T the best driver.

However, if he does win (which he won't, or I'll eat my feet, remember) good luck to him! So far this year he's been the most consistant driver, if not the fastest/most exciting.

BTW: that McLaren is probably the best car on the grid, believe it or not. It's just a cow to set up right.

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally posted by Tristan
Whoever gets the most points indeed SHOULD be WDC. Doesn't necessarily make them the best driver, though. DC ISN'T the best driver.

I think that's what I was getting at, in my own roundabout way...

[JeremySmith]

Well said EERO....David Coultard is working very hard this year, and futhermore driving very well indeed..He is a real gentleman..He is keeping his opinions to himself this season, rather than shooting himself in the foot..Good luck David!!

[Airhead]

He is however head and shoulders above some blue and white suited guys. He is also likeable in a way the Damon was and TGF isn't.

I agree that he is one of only four drivers to take it to TGF over the last few seasons. He deserves the WDC and won't have to nerf someone to get it.

[EERO]

Originally posted by Ralf's Girl


But on the other hand, there is much talk of how TGF didn't deserve to win the 1994 championship - yet he had the most points and he won it.

I don't think DC has deliberately driven into an opponent trailing him by a single point in the final race of the season.

But what really matters is not what he has acheived in past seasons, but what he IS doing this year. He has improved every season and I think he is still improving.


BTW, I'm a Damon Hill fan, too-I don't see liking those two guys as being incompatible.

[EERO]

Originally posted by Tristan

BTW: that McLaren is probably the best car on the grid, believe it or not. It's just a cow to set up right.

Moo?

[francis]

I don't know why - particularly as I am Scottish by birth and upbringing - but I find it hard to warm to DC. I do respect him but I find it hard to root for him. Damon has been mentioned in this thread and I am a great fan of his - something to do woth the fact that in his youth he was a bit of a misfit - cxame late to 4 wheel racing - and got where he got to by a lot of hard work.

There wewre also a couple of comments about the boys in blue and white. I personally think JPM is a bit over cocky and will get his come-uppance. I thought his maneouvre ain Austria was childishly silly. Maybe MS should have known better thasn to attempt the pass but there were 4 cars crawling over the back of him so he had to do something. JPM said something along the line of MS couldn't have got round the corner either - that's rubbish - MS managed to come to a complete halt while still on the road. The other boy in blue and white - Ralf - my opinion of him totally changed 3 years ago when I met him in the British Airways lounge in Dusseldorf 3 years ago. He is very shy, very polite and charming. I will have nothing said against him!!

Back tot hte subject. If DC gets the points he deserves it. He's a good driver. But he's not a great driver like MS, MH and I think probably JV.

[senna12]

As it has been pointed out, the question is whether David deserves to be champion this year. Based on his consistency and results, I would say yes. He has scored points in every race this year, and driven superbly. Whatever one might think of him personally, the fact remains that he's been delivering the goods in a very firm manner, and being a gentleman in the process. It will come down to him and Michael, who we know has an advantage

[kuchi]

At this point of the season it is hard to tell, but based on results, Mr. DC has finished all the races, so this means he has been one of the most regular drivers. He has two wins out of six races, that's pretty good, and he has scored points in all of them I think. So based on this he deserves to be called as a possible 2001 wdc, but not a sure one.

[Tristan]

Yes yes, I think we're all agreed DC COULD win this year, that's fairly obvious. The issue is SHOULD he win? IMO, he's not the best driver so "NO".

[JeremySmith]

Originally posted by kuchi
At this point of the season it is hard to tell, but based on results, Mr. DC has finished all the races, so this means he has been one of the most regular drivers. He has two wins out of six races, that's pretty good, and he has scored points in all of them I think. So based on this he deserves to be called as a possible 2001 wdc, but not a sure one.

David is driving very consistently this season,To win the WDC the driver and his equipment have to be consistently good..He only trails Michael by four points..So surely he is a little more than a possible WDC, wouldn't you say Kuchi?