MS - Webber incident

freud · 30 May 2004, 20:29 (Ref:988606)

As Quoted by Michael Schumacher:

"Actually yes, there was one particular one and I don’t know what was going on there with Mark when he came out of the pit lane. I went past him and he must have seen what car was in front of him and as I was turning in suddenly, in the sort of side line, very late, I saw him flying into me and I was really shocked. Fortunately I could open the door. It was just this little moment of me not seeing him and he would have crashed into me. I don’t know what was going through his head, what he was trying to achieve there, but that was a bit of a moment. "

I thought MS was particularly harsh on Webber in the post-race LIVE TV conference (which is directly beemed to millions). Did anyone else notice it? I, for one, missed the incident completely untill I heard MS in the press conference. Then I had to get the replay of the GP from my friend and I was flabbergasted to see MS waive and point his finger at Webber after such a minor incident.

My feeling is that Webber was not at fault as his turn was quite natural and he wasnt probably looking at his mirrors. And common sense makes me think what would Webber get out of deliberately hitting MS?? Does anyone else thinks likewise?

Anyway, imho a harsh comment on live TV. Even if he thinks it was dangerous driving, he could've said it in the press-conference later on.

grumpy1 · 30 May 2004, 21:08 (Ref:988639)

It was close but I think Webber saw him at last second and changed lines as well.I have watched it a couple of times and IMO that Webber was taken by surprise that MS was there.Looking in his mirrors would not have shown MS as he would have been hidden behind the Sauber(I think it was a Sauber).

The Grumpy1

Fondmetal · 30 May 2004, 22:11 (Ref:988682)

stop supporting webber, he was in the wrong period!!

DannyG · 31 May 2004, 02:09 (Ref:988795)

I agree MS was a bit harsh on Webber with his comments. I dont think MW was trying to prove anything and there was nothing in it. Perhaps MS should be complimenting MW on how he lets him past with ease when being lapped.

I wonder if there is some sort of hidden agenda by these comments?

grumpy1 · 31 May 2004, 02:30 (Ref:988811)

stop supporting webber, he was in the wrong period!! (quote)
And I suppose the coming together of JPM and Ralf was Ralfs fault as well.

The Grumpy1

hgmonaro · 31 May 2004, 03:49 (Ref:988832)

I'll be having another look but I didn't think MS was ever in front of MW. If that was the case MW must have been extremely late on the brakes. I thought the hand waving might have been for the rest of the lap that MW didn't yield.

Several times when someone was coming out of the pits and someone else was coming down the straight flat out I thought the person on the straight was going to sail past well before the corner but the one coming out of the pits managed to hold the corner. Maybe the camera angle was distorting the relative positions of the cars.

Also, didn't MS (maybe it was RB) have another near miss with someone else in the same circumstances?

freud · 31 May 2004, 06:06 (Ref:988859)

Quote:

Originally posted by DannyG

I wonder if there is some sort of hidden agenda by these comments?

Hmmm.. interesting. I did not think on these lines but you have a valid point here... Webber is a favorite of FW and PH and they have tremendous respect for his abilities and character(just like JPM)... may be thats why? I just cant say for sure.

Dixie Flatline · 31 May 2004, 07:44 (Ref:988900)

Wouldn't have thought so. MW has constantly cited MS as his inspiration for his driving style in Formula One and they are co-presidents (or something like that) of the Drivers' Association. I have had the feeling that they've actually been quite chummy with each other. Things might change, though, but I don't think MS would change what he thinks about MW merely because FW and PH are respectful of MW's abilities and there is a chance MW could end up in a Williams next season.

NiceGuyEddie · 31 May 2004, 08:17 (Ref:988919)

Webber's comment:

Quote:

Webber retorted: “I would do it again tomorrow. I was faster than him at the time, I left the pits on new tyres and pulled away, to start with, from him. I was racing Fisichella and knew Giancarlo was pitting on that lap and I might be able to leapfrog him.

Webber should've been more careful for he was leaving the pitlane and Schumacher was on the racingline. Webber should've been more careful for he was about to be lapped by Schumacher. If Webber was pulling away from Schumacher, than how on earth can Schumacher pass him a lap later?

jetsetter · 31 May 2004, 08:35 (Ref:988929)

Looking at the few near misses caused by drivers exiting the pits maybe they should look at re-constructing the pit area so the cars exit the pits in a safer place.

Mr V · 31 May 2004, 08:57 (Ref:988956)

Mark was abit naughty imo (as was Panis earlier on in the race, coming out on Michael) but both were racing Montoya in each instance.

I think Michael is right to feel abit aggrieved.

**Adam43** · 31 May 2004, 09:03 (Ref:988962)

I don't think that is too harsh. In terms of having the balance between shooting your mouth off and being dull and not saying anything Michael is normally quite fair. And this is one of those moments.

Mr V is right. Michael a bit aggrieved. Mark a bit naughty.

I bet Michael and Mark are over this!

garcon · 31 May 2004, 09:07 (Ref:988967)

I think it's fair of Michael to say what he did. I suppose the problem is that's the only part of the story in the public domain. I'm sure (no fact, rumour or anything here other than my own feeling) that Michael and Mark spoke about it yesterday, Michael will have made his point, Mark will have made his, and there it will end, possibly with an apology from Mark along the lines of "sorry, I honestly couldn't see you as I came out"... and as they're both safety reps maybe they'll recommend a change to the pit lane exit layout?

fog_shadow · 31 May 2004, 09:29 (Ref:988996)

as a huge fan of both MS and MW, i'm not in the least bit concerened. both MS and MW are sportsman and they'll sort this out and continue to be good friends.

about MW going to Williams, i for one cannot wait to see this happen. if it were possible for Mark to join even before 2004 ends, i'd say go for it. Right now williams definately need a driver of the callibre of MW.

i've been having some thoughts about Williams, the car and a driver like MW with them in the future. but that would be a topic for another thread.

shadow

Gt_R · 31 May 2004, 09:53 (Ref:989020)

Looking at the tone at which the quote is said, the situation surrounding the issue and everything, i don't find MS harsh at all.

MS has the rights to feel tensed after that moment. The fact is that Mark is a lap down, a back marker exiting at the pitlane. As much as backmarkers have to do their own race, you can't possibly justify risking the race leader's 10 points.

The fact is Michael is taking avoiding actions to avoid a backmarker, which is unusual. Mark went wide and could have easily taken MS into a spin or something..not nice.

MB would have been informed that MS is close, and while trying to minimise losing time, MB ought to practice a bit more care in handling such situations. Of course, Mark isn't intentionally trying to risk MS's race, and i think MS is aware of that too, hence i doubt both guys are going to be enemy after the race.

Definitely nothing to do with Mark and Williams link. Rather, i just think that Michael's a bit irritated with the behavoir of backmarkers in Nurburgring and Monaco. Mark isn't the only backmarker who acted rudely in Nurburgriing.

Nothing to worry about, it'd be over with a night's sleep. And generally, i agree with NiceguyEddie and AA.

freud · 31 May 2004, 15:53 (Ref:989350)

AS quoted by Mark Webber:

''After he exited the pitlane, I was turning in and suddenly he flew into me. Fortunately I could avoid him. I don't know what he was trying to achieve.''

I am completely with Mark Webber here. After watching the incident again several times, I noticed that MS was just out of line there. He perfectly knew the MW was coming out of the pitlane and being the race leader and a lap ahead, he just didnt need to be so close.

When Webber, who used to be a MS fan, says that he doesnt know what Michael was trying to achieve, then we should take his words seriously as well. I wouldnt like to speculate about a Webber vs Ralf scenario at williams next season but its a big possibility. And MS has been known to play mind games with his opponents for ever. MW will be a big opponent of Schu brothers in 2005, hopefully.

As for those of you who dont think MS was harsh.. I could've agreed with you had Schumacher not said what he did in a live television conference. Normally drivers are very careful about what they say on live TV.

f1manoz · 31 May 2004, 15:59 (Ref:989360)

As you know, it's impossible to see what is beside your car, and coming out of the pitlane, it's near impossible to see if there is a car beside another. From what I saw, the two were nealry side by side, but considering Webber had just exited the pits, had the inside line. Where else was he supposed to go?

IMO it's a complete over-reaction on all fronts. Nothing happened, it didn't cost TGF anything and both finished the race. Get on with it lads!

**Adam43** · 31 May 2004, 16:18 (Ref:989374)

If its any conciliation freud I don't think Webber is being harsh either.

race aficionado · 31 May 2004, 16:21 (Ref:989375)

OK guys, try these links.
Hopefully they will open:

http://homepage.mac.com/emeseditoria...Theater82.html

MS/Panis

http://homepage.mac.com/emeseditoria...Theater84.html

MS/Heidfeld/Panis

http://homepage.mac.com/emeseditoria...Theater83.html
MS on Webber

freud · 31 May 2004, 17:03 (Ref:989410)

Quote:

Originally posted by AdamAshmore
If its any conciliation freud I don't think Webber is being harsh either.

Well, lets see how it goes. I have a feeling that this is just the beginning...

Tweed · 31 May 2004, 21:24 (Ref:989645)

how can MS wave his hand like he did at an incident like that after Montreal 1998?!

Piquet · 31 May 2004, 22:02 (Ref:989676)

Quote:

Originally posted by NiceGuyEddie
Webber's comment:

If Webber was pulling away from Schumacher, than how on earth can Schumacher pass him a lap later?

...eh....I think that had more to do with the blue flags than anything else.

I think MS was well out of order for that comment. He could see Webber - not the other way around therefore it was up to him to decide how he would handle the situation & he chose to risk an accident. MS is so used to backmarkers jumping out of the way, he was probably peeved that Webber dared to stay in front for a whole lap.

**Adam43** · 31 May 2004, 22:24 (Ref:989696)

Quote:

Originally posted by Tweed
how can MS wave his hand like he did at an incident like that after Montreal 1998?!

Yes a decent point, but in the heat of the moment...

Teretonga · 31 May 2004, 22:35 (Ref:989703)

Is F1 so boring that we have been reduced to arguing over what was said and what wasn't said or done after the drivers press conference? It doesn't really matter. what we need is some on track action where people actually race each other for the whole hour and a half. MS had a handy lead. MW was battling with Fisi for a place. Webber and TGF both have lives that transcend this sort of nonsense.

deeks6 · 31 May 2004, 22:56 (Ref:989714)

I'll give you another scenario here...the games have begun!

MS knows Webber is likely to be in a Williams next year and therefore a probable front-runner so he is beginning his psyche-out routine early. Now that he has put the lobotomy on JPM, he is looking for a new challenger.

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