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30 Apr 2009, 11:50 (Ref:2452817) | #1 | |
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Budget cap,2010 regs confirmed
£40 mil is what you'll have to find to run your very own F1 team.
http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre...c_290409a.aspx |
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30 Apr 2009, 12:00 (Ref:2452827) | #2 | ||
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So 30 was too little, afterall. That's unfortunate, and I hope it's not enough to scare interest away.
Selby |
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30 Apr 2009, 12:28 (Ref:2452860) | #3 | ||
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£40 still seems pretty reasonable to me! To major companies looking to come into the sport I reckon they'll still be interested.
What I'm NOT sure about is the lack of refueling during the race. Whilst it's nice to have it all done on the race track, what this will mean is that the slower cars can't run light, so they'll just be stuck at the back. I'm worried that this will make it a bit too processional again. |
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30 Apr 2009, 12:30 (Ref:2452861) | #4 | ||
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Have you seen the bit about financial aid for new entrants. I love this one : " It will also offer 20 economy class air tickets for each new team for events held outside Europe. " I was on a Varig flight to Sao Paulo about three years ago and the entire Williams team, along with a ton of Renault personnel locked out the business and first class sections of the plane ! Looks like there'll be a business class championship and an economy class championship in 2010 |
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30 Apr 2009, 12:35 (Ref:2452867) | #5 | ||
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This figure covers all team expenditure except:
Fines or penalties imposed by the FIA love it. |
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30 Apr 2009, 13:00 (Ref:2452887) | #6 | ||
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Exempting the driver salaries gives Alonso and Raikkonen a chance of driving for a capped team at least.
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30 Apr 2009, 13:03 (Ref:2452890) | #7 | |
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What's the point ? The whole idea was to reduce the cost of competing in F1, if there are items of significant value outside the scope of the cap, then it doesn't make any sense. I don't know why they couldn't introduce driver salary caps too... as they do in US baseball etc...
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30 Apr 2009, 14:45 (Ref:2452944) | #8 | |||
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Will we see this used? The minimum weight is now 620kg. Would the packaging work? 4WD with movable wings and superKERS could be somewhat dominant ... |
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30 Apr 2009, 14:50 (Ref:2452946) | #9 | |
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Perhaps this opens the door to putting KERS straight on the front wheels, for electrical systems this could be a simpler solution than adding it to the drive train and has a number of advantages including 4WD out of the corners which means you can get the KERS power on while the Rears are still traction limited with engine power alone.
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30 Apr 2009, 15:32 (Ref:2452968) | #10 | |
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Abolishing tyre warmers is dangerous nonsense, especially when starting with a fuel load that is meant to last for the whole race distance.
And why abolish fuel strategy now that it's contributing to offering variety? Won't it be necessary for safety reasons to decrease cornering speeds again come the end of next season ? |
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30 Apr 2009, 16:15 (Ref:2452994) | #11 | ||
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NO transmission can give 4wd, it says. But it does leave the door open to be FWD or even 1WD if you wanted, which would be pretty crazy, and certainly more spectacular as cars veer off the track!
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30 Apr 2009, 16:26 (Ref:2453001) | #12 | ||
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The bit I underlined was that it didn't apply to cost capped teams.
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Marbot : "Ironically, the main difference between a Red Bull and a Virgin is that Red Bull can make parts of its car smaller and floppier." |
30 Apr 2009, 17:04 (Ref:2453027) | #13 | ||
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I think it's a great day for F1 and racing in general It's a awesome idea. Also the technical regulations for the cost capped teams mean you're pretty much doomed if you don't go cost capped! The only thing that I'm not so optimistic is this commision. I thought it was going to be some of the big auditors, not a 3 men team. May be they will need a lot more people, but I guess it's enough for them to spot the potential breach and then take onboard more experts to investigate. Another plus to have such company onboard is the license issue, if you cover someone - you can very easily risk loosing it! And they don't care much about 40 mil companies to risk it
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30 Apr 2009, 18:46 (Ref:2453109) | #14 | ||
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A 4WD drive car would pretty much mean that there would be very few mistakes made by the driver, or at least, mistakes would be less noticable.
A 4WD car would also totally dominate in the wet, anyone remember the Audi A4 Quattro's from the Super Touring era? |
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30 Apr 2009, 19:33 (Ref:2453142) | #15 | |
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What a mess.How can you expect to explain that the cars on the grid are competing to different sets of rules?There is also the matter of the FIA twisting arms to persuade competitors to enter my the end of May.It would be wonderful if FOTA members collectively insisted that they intended to think about it for a bit longer,say until September.Before the controlling tendencies of the FIA became quite so pronounced,it used to be the case that entries had to be submitted by late November and I can recall several instances where drivers were not confirmed until several weeks into the new year.
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30 Apr 2009, 20:28 (Ref:2453192) | #16 | |
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P38, you're absolutely right. Formula One needs to be run under a single set of rules not this dogs dinner which will be incomprehensible to anyone who hasn't read the legaleze surrounding it.
I applaud the concept of a budget cap. But why can't it be made simple ? Just make the cap $40M to include everything and establish a sensible policing process. |
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30 Apr 2009, 20:50 (Ref:2453211) | #17 | ||
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Suppose Ferrari go for the cap.
They then pay each driver x-millions per year "extra", and then each driver, entirely coincidentally, decides to use x-millions of their personal funds each year to purchase/lease goods/services for/from Ferrari. I would be interested to see the mechanisms which would be able to demonstrate such spending being the team spending team money on areas within the budget cap realm. That said, IIRC, driver salaries become included in the cap 2011 onwards. I still think, though, post-2010, you could end up with the same thing with respect to hospitality: Ferrari provide FIAT with hospitality which ends up being like 300-million, which involves, I dunno, raffles and stuff which give FIAT money (not fixed, per say, it is just with massively generous prizes and only available to the FIAT hospitality set-up). FIAT use money to purchase/lease goods/services for/from Ferrari, which just happens to be similar in amount to that which they win in their F1 hospitality raffles (entirely coincidental, of course). Sponsors don't pay the team for space on the car anymore: the sponsors purchase/lease goods/services for/from Ferrari. Ferrari isn't actually spending Ferrari's money on areas controlled by the cap. I don't intended these examples to be taken in an utterly literal sense, but rather just the issue. Definitions of what constitutes team spending could get tricky: the circumvention of regulations could be absolutely as blatant as can be, but the matter of actually PROVING something ain't so easy. I have long been of the opinion that budget caps in F1 would prove a nightmare to enforce. I guess we are going to find out Last edited by Dutton; 30 Apr 2009 at 21:10. |
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30 Apr 2009, 21:21 (Ref:2453225) | #18 | ||
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30 Apr 2009, 21:25 (Ref:2453227) | #19 | ||
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No tyre warmers is not a problem Back in the CART days tyre warmers were banned at Indy and other CART racers and they never contributed to serious crashes or incidents. Drivers drive to the grip conditions. It just shows what a nonsense a lot of the current F1 policies and policies are. Driving on cold tyres is something every driver learns to do in karts or junior formulae. In effect, if it were true, it would mean you could never go onto a harder tyre in a race because it would have less grip.... |
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30 Apr 2009, 21:34 (Ref:2453233) | #20 | |||
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30 Apr 2009, 22:21 (Ref:2453261) | #21 | |
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Indeed. While the idea of an all-encompassing budget cap (albeit one which is £10m more than originally proposed) has encouraged other constructors to consider their position with regards a 2010 Formula One entry - Lola, Prodrive, etc - I'm fearful that all of these apparent grey areas might lead to a number of entries being shelved.
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30 Apr 2009, 22:46 (Ref:2453271) | #22 | ||
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Uh... how can the engines be developed for fuel economy if engine development is frozen?! duh....
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30 Apr 2009, 23:39 (Ref:2453291) | #23 | ||
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Also. 2010 (altered) sporting and tech regs. http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public...30-04-2009.pdf http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public...30-04-2009.pdf Article 9.1 does indeed seem to allow four wheel drive systems for budget capped teams and article 9.9 allows KERS to be run from the front axle. |
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1 May 2009, 01:49 (Ref:2453317) | #24 | ||
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Yep. A friend of mine used to race them in Aus
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1 May 2009, 02:01 (Ref:2453318) | #25 | |||
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