[WEC] Silverstone WEC 2012

[bella]

Originally Posted by old man

I remember raising this a couple of years ago and was told.... 'Oh no, that is not a problem" or words to that effect. It was when pictures of the Audi appeared with 6 or 8" wide screen pillars. Looking at the display car on Sunday the driver really sees nothing except what is immediately in font of him. Does the Audi have a TV rear view screen in place of a mirror or was that the Pug?

i think a big part of it is not just what your eye can see, but what you sense as well. i remember a single seater driver explaining how overtaking (and being overtaken) is as much about feeling another car there through the effects it has on your own car and hearing another engine.

an enclosed space like the prototypes with a roof not only reduce the field of vision, but they also create a cocoon against the other ways a driver is aware of a car's presence compared to say, in the lmp2 cars. if you take away those senses and replace them with increased vision through tv screens then you're depending on a driver using just the one sense to understand what's happening around him.

i don't recall ye olden days when the cars all had lids on, but what kind of driving environment were the guys working with then?

[Sodemo]

I took a few from that location, but i'd be lying if I said I was totally happy with the results.

PS, why can't I post attachments?

[Aysedasi]

You should be able to?

[Sodemo]

This is at the bottom of the screen...

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[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

I took a few from that location, but i'd be lying if I said I was totally happy with the results

Yep , very nice , Got and Murphy and Status ones please ?

[isynge]

Originally Posted by bella

i think a big part of it is not just what your eye can see, but what you sense as well. i remember a single seater driver explaining how overtaking (and being overtaken) is as much about feeling another car there through the effects it has on your own car and hearing another engine.

an enclosed space like the prototypes with a roof not only reduce the field of vision, but they also create a cocoon against the other ways a driver is aware of a car's presence compared to say, in the lmp2 cars. if you take away those senses and replace them with increased vision through tv screens then you're depending on a driver using just the one sense to understand what's happening around him.

i don't recall ye olden days when the cars all had lids on, but what kind of driving environment were the guys working with then?

I don't seem to recall it being quite such an issue, but then all of my following of Group C was done via magazine reports and latterly TV coverage - but in the last days there weren't quite such dramatic speed differentials, or to be honest that many cars on the track.

What is informative though that in 1982, when closed cockpits with Group C were comparatively new, and you did have GTs running alongside, collisions did happen - such as the one here between Hans Stuck in a Sauber and Richard Cleare's Porsche 934 at Brands Hatch. Okay the track was damp which didn't help, but it was a clear case where Stuck was leading, and pushing very hard knowing works Porsche and Lancia machinery was bearing down on him (to say nothing of the unusually competitive Ford C100s) and probably didn't give the GT as much space as he should have done.

http://youtu.be/BXC9RRrRTR0

Nothing new under the sun?

[courageous]

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

The question I really want to ask Silverstone, is how many disgruntled fans does it take ...

The more the better is the answer to that question

I am not exagerating when I say that many UK circuit bosses consider the hassle of organising security/cleaners/catering etc... as something they would rather not bother with if they could avoid it.

[TheNewBob]

Originally Posted by The Real DMN

It does not become a contract untill you agree to pay the price, regardless of what its actually been advertised as. At least in my understanding, if you paid a higher fee, then thats down to you. The vendor may drop the price (in this case retrospectively), but that would only be as a goodwill jesture.

To give another (slightly different) example; you pick up some milk advertised at 50p on the shelf. At the checkout it comes up as £1. The shop does not have to drop the price to 50p legally, but they may want to foster good relations. This is because untill you agree to pay the price, there is no contract. You either pay £1 and there is a contract, or you don't and there remains no contract.

However, thats just my understanding.

I suspect he issue here was more to do with the availability of a 'weekend' ticket option as opposed to paying a little extra in their absence. Would this be a case of false advertising or would the fact that they first turned up on a Saturday instead of a Friday (effectively missing out a third of the weekend) give Silverstone staff solid ground to say a weekend ticket was no longer a viable option?

[wolfhound]

Originally Posted by isynge

I don't seem to recall it being quite such an issue, but then all of my following of Group C was done via magazine reports and latterly TV coverage - but in the last days there weren't quite such dramatic speed differentials, or to be honest that many cars on the track.

What is informative though that in 1982, when closed cockpits with Group C were comparatively new, and you did have GTs running alongside, collisions did happen - such as the one here between Hans Stuck in a Sauber and Richard Cleare's Porsche 934 at Brands Hatch. Okay the track was damp which didn't help, but it was a clear case where Stuck was leading, and pushing very hard knowing works Porsche and Lancia machinery was bearing down on him (to say nothing of the unusually competitive Ford C100s) and probably didn't give the GT as much space as he should have done.

http://youtu.be/BXC9RRrRTR0

Nothing new under the sun?

If you compare Group C cars v P1s the front cockpit on the G C is much higher in relation to the wheel arch as the height of the top of the windscreen way set at a certain hight above the floor and I think they also had a maximum tyre diameter.
The current P1s appear to have the driver below the top of the wheel arch so the driver has very limited vision. On the older open prototypes (e.g. R10) the wheel arches appear to be lower but I don't know what has changed.

[Sodemo]

The Ferrari one is a touch out of focus, annoyed about that.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by airbusA346

Stop & Go penalties were used instead of drive through penalties at Silverstone, due to the layout, so in theory they would have just got a drive through at the other circuits.

Did you read what I said? I know they didn't get a 'drive through' penalty. I said that the stop and go penalty was like a slap on the wrist. With the pit lane being so short here they should have held offenders for 10 seconds at least, not just a stop and go. Thats what I feel at least.

[airbusA346]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

[Sodemo]

Originally Posted by airbusA346

Is that yourself?

[airbusA346]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

Is that yourself?

I work for the team.

[Tim the Grey]

Can we make these a bit smaller, please? And I suspect your sensor needs cleaning?

[Sodemo]

Originally Posted by Tim the Grey

Can we make these a bit smaller, please? And I suspect your sensor needs cleaning?

They appear as small boxes for me. Yep, the sensor is quite dirty. I tried blowing it out with my rocket blower thingy but didn't do a lot. I may have to get down and dirty with the swabs.

[Aysedasi]

Mine needs a good clean too - off topic I know but good advice on the best method?

[Tim the Grey]

Buy an Olympus! My E-1s 8 years old, NEVER been cleaned, as it's never needed it. They built the dustbuster into their system from the off.
My Nikon D700 has some form of sensor cleaning built in, I think it too 'vibrates' the Low Pass Filter.

Mainly, I'd look at locking the shutter open (Cleaning Mode in the Menus?) and use a rocket blower. Do NOT use canned 'air'. ANY propellant is very cold, and if it hits the glass over the sensor, the damage could be permanent...

I have no idea what is involved with a 'wet wipe' clean, but it seems OK if you do it right.

[Aysedasi]

OK cheers for that

[Peat]

Ok, as some of you know, i sent a letter to Silverstone et al regarding the amenities etc of the circuit at the event.

Here are the replies i have had:

BRDC -

Dear Peat

I am very sorry to hear of your disappointment following your day at the World Endurance Championship. I have forwarded your email to Silverstone Circuits Limited who are best placed to deal with the issues that you have raised.

I will address the point of the tunnel or bridge which I agree would make life much easier for all of us. It is, quite simply, a matter of money. These items are high priority when we can afford them and they will be built as soon as possible. However, we are currently not in a position to be able to do so, and there was not the slack in the Wing budget to accommodate them. Even a foot bridge of the standard that we would need is a seven figure sum.....

Do keep coming to Silverstone and enjoying great value sporting occasions. We really do value your support and need it in the future.

You will hear from Silverstone shortly.

Regards

BRDC Person

Silverstone Sales Manager -

Dear Peat

Thank you for your email - apologies for the delay whilst this was investigated further.

We were sorry to hear of your disappointment with the recent WEC event at Silverstone. Customer feedback, whether positive or otherwise, is very important to us and we realise that we could not reach our objectives without this. We have also discussed all points with the Event organisers so that any amends for the future can be discussed where necessary and where possible.

Weekend tickets for this three day event were sold up until Friday night and any tickets thereafter were sold as individual days only. Given your feedback, this will change from 2013 and Weekend tickets will be available for sale on both the Friday and Saturday as well as the normal advance sales.

Grandstand availability for this Event is determined in several ways and is agreed with the organisers given the costs to open stands. They will judge by the historic size of the Event, which Pit and Paddock is used and the number of advance ticket sales. The organisers are happy to look at different stand access from 2013 and aim to advertise in advance where possible. Toilet facilities also tie in with this and more can be opened.

We were sorry to hear of the unacceptable food that was purchased – as yet, we have had no other feedback on this topic, but this will be passed on for you as this cannot be repeated.

Sadly we are aware of the distance for pedestrians once inside the venue – unfortunately we are unable to finance more options for transport at present, but we do hope to increase the public bus services so that they may be more regular in the future.

Kind regards

Silverstone Person

WEC -

Dear Peat,
First of all thank you for coming to the 6 Hours of Silverstone
I red with attention your email and I have already sent back an email to Silverstone circuit with my comments to make sure we can organize a better event in the next years
We have invested a lot this year with the entertainment area, free pit walk… global branding of the event but there is definitely many others points to work on
Thank you again for the details given about your experience, it is always interesting for us.
Hope that you will come back next year to enjoy this event
Best regards

WEC Person

Eve from RLM replied first, forwarding my message to the most relevant people which i greatly appreciate.

Also, i have had an email from Divine Foods requesting my address so they can respond in writing. I am reluctant to do so incase they send round the heavies for 'dissing their burgers...

I am wholly satisfied with the response as i half expected it to be completely ignored. Silverstone were even kind enough to offer me 4x tickets to the BTCC but i politely declined.

Hopefully the fan experience might be improved slightly on my next visit, however, the on track action is always my first priority.

Cheers

Peat

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Peat

I am wholly satisfied with the response as i half expected it to be completely ignored.

Peat, just to say thank you for taking the time to 'complain'.

It transpires your efforts were worthwhile and I suspect many will benefit next year as a result of your communications with the those who have the ability to make change and have shown a desire to address the issues you raised.

The response to the bridge/tunnel issue is frustrating, but the responses to the other issues are extremely positive.

Top man!

[Graham Goodwin]

The replies also underline how importwnt it is to complain if you get unacceptable service - The 'no weekend tickets on the gate' rule is ludicrous and the poor standard if food is worse still - Note though that the circuit says they have had no other complaints - If it matters to you put it in writing - It takes no longer to send it to Silverstone than to register a complaint on a forum!

Well done Peat

[The Badger]

Well , from living a turd of my working life in hotels , I always found airport hotels mostly crap . The type of people who normally stay there normally do so overnight , so 1 night with a bad experiance probably isnt worth their time to complain , although they may not return .

The hotel doesnt get many complaints , cuz of 1 night stayers , so as far as they are concerned , everything is rosey in the garden .

Hope this post gets my point across with respect to Silverstone services .

[Aysedasi]

Anyone else who went to the WEC at Silverstone get a survey through from Silverstone today.......?

[Sodemo]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Anyone else who went to the WEC at Silverstone get a survey through from Silverstone today.......?

Yep.