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15 Feb 2024, 01:14 (Ref:4196767) | #726 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Power and Weight
How it has developed over the years.
Obviously the approach was a bit different pre-2023 before we had the first wave of additional constructors joining. Probably from now on I will start these tables in 2023. I have included a chart of 2023 only. Weight (Kg)
Max Power (kW)
The spread of these Qatar power:weight are pretty narrow. With the exception of poor old Peugeot. Toyota and Ferrari have the same power to weight, so maybe you are on to something. Interesting if that is what they are doing. A bit of a shame in some ways. Maybe Ferrari won't need the tyre warmers |
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15 Feb 2024, 01:19 (Ref:4196768) | #727 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Energy Allocation
Some changes here.
Energy Allocation (MJ)
Not a perfect correlation, but there remains that relationship between power and energy allocation. Well, apart from poor old Peugeot. To a much lesser extent and the other way the other Hypercar front wheel drives Ferrari and Toyota are outliers. See the chart. Last edited by Adam43; 15 Feb 2024 at 01:30. |
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15 Feb 2024, 01:44 (Ref:4196770) | #728 | ||
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Here is the practically pointless IMSA WEC comparison of power:weight.
The Cadillac has a slightly higher P/W than Porsche in both. BMW is an outlier and loses out in WEC. I am going to attribute that to my little new car conservative BoP theory. |
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15 Feb 2024, 01:48 (Ref:4196771) | #729 | ||
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BTW, I don't think the front wheel drive activation speeds have changed, but will check when I get the official bulletin. It doesn't impact the newbies anyway. You never know maybe they will make it really really low for poor old Peugeot.
I don't know Pit stop docking times have changed. They were correlated with Hypercar Hybrid (1.2s), LMDh (1.0s) and Hypoercar non-hybrid (0.0s), so we can probably guess what they will be for the newbies - Isotta Fraachini being the only one now with no added time. |
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15 Feb 2024, 06:31 (Ref:4196786) | #730 | |
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But Isotta is also hybrid. So what will the rule makers decide.
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15 Feb 2024, 10:17 (Ref:4196795) | #731 | |
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15 Feb 2024, 12:33 (Ref:4196801) | #732 | ||
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I dont understand why they can't all just start at the same weight and the same power. It should then be up to the team to get the best out of the chassis and tyres.
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15 Feb 2024, 12:58 (Ref:4196803) | #733 | |||
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So it is. Scrub that comedy theory then! |
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15 Feb 2024, 13:04 (Ref:4196806) | #734 | ||
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Why? Guess MORE regs would be better in your eyes? |
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15 Feb 2024, 13:09 (Ref:4196807) | #735 | |||
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That is not how it is designed and it would be unfair to do that we’ve these cars. They aren’t designing cars to a minimum weight and maximum power. They are designing it to a window performance; drag, downforce that kind of thing. This is then homologated. That allows the manufacturers to have a bit more identity and also, importantly, keeps costs down. Hence the nine manufacturers we have now and the ability for some of them to provide privateer cars. It is recognised that the homologation process isn’t perfect so some balancing afterwards is needed. This isn’t an easy job as it is difficult to separate the on track lap times and the inherent performance of all the other variables (fuel, drivers, strategy, tyre management, set-up, changing conditions). What we’ve had is a really close, historically really close, grid. But still seen that people with experience have managed to find a way to make their car work best. We’ve still maintained so much of the elements in an endurance race that makes it what it is. It won’t be perfect, but it started pretty good. They need to keep working to make it better. A lot of us would like a here are some simple rules. 1000kg and 520kW. However the race organisers have to be realistic. This idealistic situation doesn’t give you a big diverse entry. Mainly because, rightly, these entrants don’t want to waste money on this as either they don’t have it, or it isn’t worth it. Maybe the series will die though because this will keep being lost. Maybe we can’t have nice things. Last edited by Adam43; 15 Feb 2024 at 13:15. |
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15 Feb 2024, 13:15 (Ref:4196808) | #736 | |
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15 Feb 2024, 16:28 (Ref:4196826) | #737 | |||
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Quote:
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15 Feb 2024, 16:29 (Ref:4196827) | #738 | ||
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No. Not sure how that’s the takeaway from my post!
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15 Feb 2024, 16:41 (Ref:4196830) | #739 | ||
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I think that if they are actually attempting to do this it is a low down dirty shame. I accept that BoP needs to exist, but I feel that effectively operating your tyres should not be one of the PILLARS OF LAZINESS that can be leaned upon. We're effectively saying that it is counting for naught to actually build and develop a better car than your competitors. |
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15 Feb 2024, 17:16 (Ref:4196831) | #740 | ||
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BoP. Brilliant or Pants.
Surely you mean LOW DOWN DIRTY SHAME!
As I said I’d prefer if they didn’t do this. It could more likely be wanting to correct for a small difference in the behavior of the cars. Similar overall speed, a nuance that a heavier car with the same power to weight might solve. Could still have an impact on the tyre wear, but then that could have been a result of the initial homologation as well as their inherent management knowledge. Really it was the tyre warmers that was RIDICULOUSLY DIRTY PILLAR SHAME. One other aspect I meant to bring up was a sense of perspective here! But I’m just interested and enjoy the racing. |
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15 Feb 2024, 21:07 (Ref:4196856) | #741 | ||
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No argument there, but to be honest, I feel like they were going to do whatever it took to "have their fairy tale" so it is what it was. Roll on with the races, lets see how this year unfolds. I'm sure this thread is due for a lot of traffic. |
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15 Feb 2024, 22:51 (Ref:4196877) | #742 | ||
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Hey, I remember that movie... with Keenan Ivory Wayans and Jada Pinkett-Smith as 'Peaches'.
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Here's to the new age of Sports car/Prototypes... |
16 Feb 2024, 00:18 (Ref:4196879) | #743 | |
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21 Feb 2024, 10:45 (Ref:4197590) | #744 | |
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https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...season-opener/
Some more tweakage of values ahead of Bahrain. |
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For when your year runs from June to June - '11/'12/'13/'14/'15/'16/'17/'18/'19/xx/'21/'22/'23/'24 Instagram: rsmotorsportmedia |
21 Feb 2024, 12:13 (Ref:4197601) | #745 | ||
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Again, I just dont understand why all cars can't (at the very least) start at the same weight, power etc.
Second question; Why is the IF set so heavy? |
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21 Feb 2024, 13:42 (Ref:4197610) | #746 | ||||
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Quote:
Quote:
Although if you think for a second, it is not even that conservative. It is between between two other Hypercars - Ferrari and Toyota. So actually it is trying to do what you think they should do for a first race - it's inline with the other Hypercars! They have allowed for the category difference and ignored the extreme example of the rubbish Peugeot! Again. Last edited by Adam43; 21 Feb 2024 at 13:54. Reason: realised it is where you would expect a Hypercar to be! |
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21 Feb 2024, 13:48 (Ref:4197615) | #747 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Quote:
The bulletin provides the other data too. Peugeot is back up to 150kmph deployment speed when it is wet (unlikely to be a thing at the next race). The docking times are all 1s lower. Now there is no Glickenhaus or Vanwall they have just maintained the 0.2s difference between Hypercar and LMDh. Weight (Kg)
Energy Allocation (MJ)
Max Power (kW)
Add Docking Time (s)
Ft.Depl. Speed (kph in DRY)
Ft.Depl. Speed (kph in WET)
Last edited by Adam43; 4 Mar 2024 at 00:31. Reason: The last three tables didn't have Qatar included. |
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21 Feb 2024, 14:09 (Ref:4197618) | #748 | ||
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I'm pretty sure even unrestricted there's a chance it wouldn't make it to the end for other reasons |
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21 Feb 2024, 14:30 (Ref:4197622) | #749 | ||
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I appreciate the openness in the BOP tables (its a stark contrast to the BTCC), however whilst we have the end result, we don't get any of the reasoning behind the decisions.
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22 Feb 2024, 09:08 (Ref:4197729) | #750 | |
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Does anyone knows what the hell is "Power gain after 210 kph", the new BoP criteria appearing on the last published BoP table ? I understand it won't be in effect at Bahrain but I can't understand what's behind it.
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