[Driver] Susie Wolff/women competing in motorsport (Merged)

[Richard C]

I find Michele Mouton's comment very interesting given that I have always felt rally to be much more dangerous than F1 (I suspect statistics would prove this out as well.) So while I am not arguing against her point at all, I do think that when she was racing that she had convinced herself that she was safe (or safe enough) in her rally car. That her need for "self preservation" was pushed down by her need to win and the thrill of racing. I don't think that is a particularly female trait.

I think that everyone has a limit as to what they find to be too risky. There very well may be a statistical difference between men and women regarding the "need for self preservation". I think the actions of many teenage boys might be proof enough of this.

But, I do think that other things likely have a larger influence. And that natural variability will allow an individual to rise up above the average. Some people are risk takers and others are not. And I think there is always successful drivers who reach a point in their career (age, starting a family, some other trigger) where the though of injury or death creeps forward enough that it factors into their performance.

So I have no doubt that there is are a number of women out there that could arrive at a similar conclusion as Mouton's, but in the reverse in that she would feel completely at home in a F1 car at speed but not comfortable in another type of racing. Within that group who are "not afraid", I also think there is someone who if the stars were to properly align (given the right backing early on, etc.) could win in F1. I think the problem is that "on average" motorsports is still a "male sport". That the available pool of women drivers who might reach the top of the mountain is currently pretty small.

Richard

[Born Racer]

Does she have any evidence for this?

[chillibowl]

very well stated Richard!

imo your post gets to the heart of the matter. too much talking about what the differences are between the average man and average women when it should be about what are exceptional people capable of. some people are less averse to risk. on average that group may include more men but it is in no way inclusive to just men.

as of yet the only reasonable explanation (for me) of why there are no women in F1 is that, as you put it ' the stars haven't aligned yet' as opposed to any physiological or neurological trait that prevents an exceptional women from joining the ranks of exceptional men.

[davyboy]

Snooker is a sport that requires very high levels of hand/eye co-ordination and precision. It's very similar to motor sport in that respect, however there's no physical exertion and no risk to life or limb, yet there are very few female professional snooker players and no tournament or championship winners. Is it because women are unable to master this as well as men... or is it because, like motor racing, it's a male dominated discipline ?

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by davyboy

Snooker is a sport that requires very high levels of hand/eye co-ordination and precision. It's very similar to motor sport in that respect, however there's no physical exertion and no risk to life or limb, yet there are very few female professional snooker players and no tournament or championship winners. Is it because women are unable to master this as well as men... or is it because, like motor racing, it's a male dominated discipline ?

I think in simplest terms, we (fans, participants, pundits, etc., but mostly men) think that if a certain percentage of the population (women) don't think being F1 world champion is important, then something must be wrong with them physically or mentally!

Richard

[bella]

Originally Posted by davyboy

...yet there are very few female professional snooker players and no tournament or championship winners. Is it because women are unable to master this as well as men... or is it because, like motor racing, it's a male dominated discipline ?

no. it's because we're not sad enough to play snooker full stop

[wolfhound]

I suspect the difficulty for women is in junior single seater formula (include carts as well) because power assisted steering and brakes are not genarally available at this level. I have seen women be compeditive in saloon classes at club level where power assistance is available.

[Down F0rce]

On the subject of Susie, she really wants to do the young driver test and get his Super License:

http://in.reuters.com/article/2013/0...0DJ40920130502

I really think she needs to have a go at Formula Renault 3.5 or GP2. Driving the Williams a few times a year isn't going to cut it on it's own.

[BertMk2]

Originally Posted by Down F0rce

I really think she needs to have a go at Formula Renault 3.5 or GP2. Driving the Williams a few times a year isn't going to cut it on it's own.

I don't think getting blown away in FR3.5 or GP2 would help either - her track record isn't anything special really in any formula she's raced in. Competent but not outstanding. How many seasons in DTM and how many wins? (or podiums for that matter).

[Deemun]

Originally Posted by Down F0rce

On the subject of Susie, she really wants to do the young driver test and get his Super License:

http://in.reuters.com/article/2013/0...0DJ40920130502

I really think she needs to have a go at Formula Renault 3.5 or GP2. Driving the Williams a few times a year isn't going to cut it on it's own.

Hmm….nice idea but I genuinely believe Susie would be annihilated! Her record in DTM and in fact the whole of her motor racing career is not exactly exemplary after all is it? Susie has basically got where she is through a combination of knowing the right people and managing to secure the necessary backing which to her credit is a big part of the game.
Before the pro-female driver brigade jump on me I’m not at all sexist. I genuinely believe that out there somewhere is a female driver good enough to make it all the way to the top and let’s be honest if she happens to be easy on the eye as well as having talent then she will be a marketing man’s dream. But hopefully she will be there chiefly because of her talent and she will have the results to prove that she is worthy of her opportunity. And yes of course I realise that there are far too many male drivers who get to the top because they have access to the financial resources without proving they have the ability. It’s a cruel sport………money talks…….talent walks……..

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by Down F0rce

On the subject of Susie, she really wants to do the young driver test and get his Super License:

I take it that's being used as a gender-neutral pronoun.

[Down F0rce]

Woops. Why the ten minute rule again?

[Flavio Galtieri]

The obvious way to solve whether Ms. Wolff is fast enough or not is to get her out in a car in a proper test as soon as possible. The young driver test seems the ideal opportunity to me.

She has access to the simulator, will know all her teammates' performance data on that, so it's really a case of William's management taking the decision based on her simulator performance surely? They are a quoted company and I'm pretty sure they would not do anything that wasn't at least beneficial to the company in PR terms.

Otherwise, if not Susie, who else do you see on the horizon in the next year or so? With plummeting TV ratings on SKY and other pay to view services together with a possible stock market float in October I think Formula One management might see an upside to all this.

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

The obvious way to solve whether Ms. Wolff is fast enough or not is to get her out in a car in a proper test as soon as possible. The young driver test seems the ideal opportunity to me.
...........
Otherwise, if not Susie, who else do you see on the horizon in the next year or so? With plummeting TV ratings on SKY and other pay to view services together with a possible stock market float in October I think Formula One management might see an upside to all this.

good grief, you make it sound like she's the saviour of F1, I think not ;-)

[davyboy]

I think most would accept that Susie is competent driver but not the best female pilot there's ever been, nor even the best around at the moment. Even though there are some dubious drivers on the F1 grid at the moment, I'd probably put Susie behind them as well. In conclusion, she's done extremely well to engineer herself to where she is now, but it wouldn't do the female cause any good to have her take part in F1 races.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by davyboy

....... In conclusion, she's done extremely well to engineer herself to where she is now, but it wouldn't do the female cause any good to have her take part in F1 races.

This. Oh and for the record, I have never suggested she wasn't worthy of a chance, nor have I ever said I agreed with Sir Stirling. But, has anyone noticed the twitter storm emanating mostly from the BEEB, about the whole thing?

Makes one ponder....................................

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

good grief, you make it sound like she's the saviour of F1, I think not ;-)

Well I certainly didn't mean to do that!

All I'm saying is that if she has got herself into a position where she might get a test, then why not?

At least that might solve the question over her ability that's all. I can't see what harm it would do? And where are these alternative women with suitable experience?

[Aysedasi]

Man, is this thread still rumbling on........?

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Man, is this thread still rumbling on........?

Apparently!

What did you want to say?

[Greem]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

Man, is this thread still rumbling on........?

Typical. Why not "Woman, is this thread... etc etc"?

[Paradise City]

That woman hatin' misogynist Flavio just won't let it drop.

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

The obvious way to solve whether Ms. Wolff is fast enough or not is to get her out in a car in a proper test as soon as possible. The young driver test seems the ideal opportunity to me.

She has access to the simulator, will know all her teammates' performance data on that, so it's really a case of William's management taking the decision based on her simulator performance surely? They are a quoted company and I'm pretty sure they would not do anything that wasn't at least beneficial to the company in PR terms.

Otherwise, if not Susie, who else do you see on the horizon in the next year or so? With plummeting TV ratings on SKY and other pay to view services together with a possible stock market float in October I think Formula One management might see an upside to all this.

I tell you what. If viewing figures are falling then I'm delighted because I want to see F1 back on free-to-air. An utterly arrogant, self-serving, elitist and myopic decision by the teams to back the move to Sky.

[wnut]

I'll second the above post from Born Racer.

[JeremySmith]

I had the pleasure of listening to the BBC Five Live interview with Susie Wolff and Claire William's.. I enjoyed it immensely, she must have the talent otherwise she would not be there...

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

Apparently!

What did you want to say?

Er....

Man/Woman (delete as applicable), is this thread still rumbling on......?