[WEC] 2016 WEC Discussion

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by CyberMotor

Mexico City two weeks before COTA? If people think Austin was hot!

Nah, didn't make it all the way up to a 100! Or did it? Not believing the CotA numbers (anymore) anyway after their fantasy attendance quote, you could count the spectators in the grandstands in the turn 12/15/16 complex on one hand! (and the north part of the track was as said like a ghost town)

CotA is done after next year it sounds like - Indy will look even more pathetic and the track is rubbish, however Neveu will undoubtedly justify the move by bragging about the history of the place, simply ignoring the fact sportscars have close to zero history at the speedway. I'm sure he'll quote 'technical reasons' as the reason for the switch! (I cannot wait for the day he gets appointed as Bernie's successor...).

Mexico City is pulling a Bahrain - free transport for teams and crews to and from Mexico! If only they would do the same for the marshals!

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

Voted Mexico City myself, fits in nicely with CotA combo, maybe 2 or 3 weeks prior to Lone Star Le Mans. It'll be a hot one..!

Indeed!

[Deleted]

Re few pages back:

Even if the Championship had just one continent we know it's not the FIA regs preventing, as proved by the 2012 "GT1" "World" Championship...

[champcarman]

Could someone confirm to me that the Spa 6 Hours will be run on SATURDAY 7th May 2016?

Not Sunday?

[J Jay]

Originally Posted by champcarman

Could someone confirm to me that the Spa 6 Hours will be run on SATURDAY 7th May 2016?

Not Sunday?

Yes, Spa is always a Saturday race.

[DistortedSmile]

Originally Posted by CyberMotor

Mexico City two weeks before COTA? If people think Austin was hot!

lol Mexico City is actually not a hot place, like at all.

Also, Riley is evaluating a GTE AM campaign with the Viper for next year:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121092

[TF110]

Hope the viper runs in wec. As long as its not shafted by bop, it should do well.

[Pontlieue]

http://www.dailysportscar.com/2015/0...s-defence.html

Why do I get the impression again that the FIA are once again fixing something that's not broken?

Toyota and Porsche have been using well over 1000 hp out of the corners this year. And if they limit the hybrid power, LMP1 drivers will have to resort to the corners again to lap slower traffic. I don't see the security improvement.

Also, a shame about Hülkenberg. Instead of trying to defend his Le Mans victory, he'll likely spend his Sunday afternoon fighting for minor points in Azerbaijan.

[August]

The pessimist in me says F1 wanted to keep its drivers from doing Le Mans. The optimistic approach is FIA doesn't want a clash with Le Mans and there will be none as Baku won't happen. At least Baku following Canada sounds even less realistic than Korea (clashing with Spa 6h) followed by Spain last year.

[kvenom]

This was aimed at Porsche, big break for Toyota as well.

[porman]

If you want to build a series that is starting to gain some momentum, you don't implement rule changes that will hinder you in your trying to differentiate yourself. Initially, the WEC was perhaps an alternative to dare I say the f-word. That series was slowed down and sports cars were able to shine a bit brighter what with their technology and speed. To me this is in essence shooting yourself in the foot. I know the FIA cannot have their halo series looked down upon, but we are talking about two distinctly different beasts.

It is evident that the rule makers never expected such quantum leaps from 14-15 but the cars are knowhere near dangerous and much smaller gains would have come in 2016. They are already speeding up the other classes, which is a good idea in regards to the closing rates. I honestly am dumbfounded as to why you would want to in essence take away something you had been touting, power.

On another tangent. I imagine Porsche aren't exactly happy campers. The only potential benefit will be in tire management. Anyone here wonder if they will go down to 6mj next year?

If you really see your series as one that campaigns technological progress, this is perhaps a step backwards. What was really intriguing to myself and others was the technological arms race and the varying interpretations allowed in the rules.

[porman]

Originally Posted by kvenom

This was aimed at Porsche, big break for Toyota as well.

Are they really running away with the championship?

What of innovation? They analyzed all areas of improvement last year and came up with a great package. Audi and Toyota already know what they need to do and will implement a raft of changes to their 2016 cars. Porsche simply outsmarted the competition this year.

[deggis]

Last time there was a clash in early calendars (it was when LM date was originally moved to avoid Jersey GP which was then cancelled, iirc) WMSC ended up reservering the traditional date to avoid that happening for the following year. Usually I find these FIA-and-Bernie-this-and-that merely stupid but this is pretty sketchy.

Could be that it was put there for some weird contractual reason and is not actually happening.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by Pontlieue

http://www.dailysportscar.com/2015/0...s-defence.html

Why do I get the impression again that the FIA are once again fixing something that's not broken?

Toyota and Porsche have been using well over 1000 hp out of the corners this year. And if they limit the hybrid power, LMP1 drivers will have to resort to the corners again to lap slower traffic. I don't see the security improvement.

This is practically just part of the slowdown plan already announced months ago and sounds sensible easy solution to me. I find the total bhp figures overrated anyway and it is an outdated way to calculate hybrid power.

Overrated also because the cars could have "1500" bhp or maybe 1499 or maybe 1501 and they wouldn't look one bit more exciting and actually hard to drive because of all of the electronics, traction control and non-regulated engine maps.

This will obviously direct to use the ERS boost for a longer time instead of maximum instantaneous boost - not just on straights?

[chernaudi]

Audi right how are making (if official figures are to be believed) a total of 840bhp, which I find hard to believe.

In truth, Audi are probably pushing 900bhp, Toyota around 1000 or so, and Porsche maybe 1100 or maybe 1200+

I always found it a bit stupid that the ACO/FIA let everyone pretty much, especially those in higher MJ classes, use their hybrid power almost exclusively as a go-faster button rather than a fuel saver that allows them to go just as fast while using less fuel.

Though, the other way around, we can revert back to the 2013 regs with a 3.5MJ max for hybrid systems, sonic air restrictors restricting engine power instead of fuel flow sensors, and maybe even 2000mm max car width. Only thing I'd change for those regs is allowing AWD hybrids to use their power at any speed.

But even with these changes, I wouldn't be surprised if the 2016 cars are as fast as this year's cars are, while having longer range on fuel and being easier on tires, especially with a proposal for there to be 4 sets of tires to be used in most races instead of 6 this year.

[J Jay]

I remember seeing a Racer piece saying the 2015 R18 had a potential 1100bhp on tap (830hp ICE + 270hp motors), but I'll be damned if I can find it now.

Obviously the limitation is a nudge towards using hybrid power for longer, less intense periods as was the original intention of the 2014 regulations I assume, but the 1000hp limit does seem a little odd when there is one car on the grid that makes its pace with significantly less horsepower than the others. But how feasible is it to apply a similar limit to torque (where Audi more) with the electric motors all the cars use?

Also, how does this affect Nissan? Are they any more or less out of joint than the other petrol cars?

[cokata]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Audi right how are making (if official figures are to be believed) a total of 840bhp, which I find hard to believe.

In truth, Audi are probably pushing 900bhp, Toyota around 1000 or so, and Porsche maybe 1100 or maybe 1200+

I always found it a bit stupid that the ACO/FIA let everyone pretty much, especially those in higher MJ classes, use their hybrid power almost exclusively as a go-faster button rather than a fuel saver that allows them to go just as fast while using less fuel.

Given the same amount of energy you would save more fuel if you deploy more power in shorter burst, than less power over a longer period.

All this change does is move the hybrid systems closer to each other. The next step from here would be to have them almost "spec" kind of like it is now in F1.

All in all a very boring and predictable change in the regulation.

[chernaudi]

Only problem with that logic is that everyone was already moving to the battery system route anyways, mostly because of what Porsche have done the past couple of years.

[deggis]

Fuel flow and ERS use is monitored with the mandatory boxes but how are they going to monitor the outputs from ICEs?

[Pandemonium]

Well... This is stupud... F*** rulemakers.

[cokata]

Originally Posted by deggis

Fuel flow and ERS use is monitored with the mandatory boxes but how are they going to monitor the outputs from ICEs?

Since with the current fuel flow we know that the ICE can't make much more than 550 bhp they will probably place a 400bhp limit on the electric motor(s)

[Spyderman]

Very disappointing indeed...but completely predictable.

[TF110]

Theyll still be fast. 1000hp for 5-8 seconds per boost instead of 3-5. With this rule, it may mean teams go for bigger battery packs with more storage. Theyll have to since the power density wont be as important as the energy store.

Teams arent going to batteries because Porsche did it, theyre going batteries because thats the best available tech. Capacitors and flywheels cant store enough energy. The A123 pack that Porsche uses is good but theres plenty of other battery makers that have products as good or better. Panasonic, LG/Samsung, Sanyo etc.

Im more concerned with the bodywork/aero rules to be changed. They cant slow the cars too much while speeding up lmp2.

[Spyderman]

Originally Posted by TF110

Teams arent going to batteries because Porsche did it, theyre going batteries because thats the best available tech..

At the start, each manufacturer chose a system they considered the best. I can still remember reading long posts about how Caps were going to destroy the other systems and how batteries would overheat and not last.
Porsche got it right. It took some time to sort out the system (nothing unusual), but they got it right.

[TF110]

Lots of that negativity was when they started out with a battery in testing. It had numerous issues but they kept on with it. Toyota had the supercap since '07, they kept on with it. But I think their lower budget aided in keeping that around.

But it is crazy how fast batteries have advanced. Because a few years back they werent looking as promising, but now theyre back and companies like Tesla are making big waves in the auto world with batteries.