ALMS 2011 Discussion - Page 100

Audi Racer · 26 Aug 2011, 04:37 (Ref:2946089)

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGD

It looks like IMSA is giving the Porsches a 15 kg weight break.

http://www.imsaracing.net/2011/ALMS/...MS%2011-26.pdf

thats good to hear. they shouldn't have given it back to them after they took it off in the first place.

Deleted · 26 Aug 2011, 12:10 (Ref:2946294)

Ridiculous, they got 25kg break after Sebring (1245->1220), then 15kg were added for Mid-Ohio and now they are taking that 15kg off again? Decide already

Fogelhund · 26 Aug 2011, 16:01 (Ref:2946442)

http://www.imsaracing.net/2011/ALMS/...MS%2011-21.pdf

Due to the physical constraints of Road Atlanta, the maximum number of cars permitted to start the
Petit Le Mans race will be limited to 53.
The complete details are listed below the following summary of what these regulations entail:
? Only ILMC and ALMS full season entries will be accepted
? Entrants who have participated in all ALMS races in the 2011 season will have priority over
entries that may be full season but have missed races
? The starting field is limited to 53 cars.
? Test Days, Practice and Qualifying will be limited to 60 entries
? The 7 entries that do not qualify will be given alternate status

Here was the theoretical list.

Presenting Zach's highly speculative, mildly offensive, and most certaintly correct (when you factor +/- 10% margin of error), Petit entry list...

LMP1 ~13
2x Audi Sport Team Joest
2x Peugeot Sport Total
2x OAK Racing
1x Rebellion Racing
1x Oreca Team Matmut
1x Aston Martin Racing
1x Autocon
1x Muscle Milk
2x Dyson/Oryx
LMP2 ~5
2x Level 5
1x OAK Racing
1x Signatech Nissan
1x United Autosport
GTE ~27
2x BMW Team RLL
2x Luxury Racing
2x Lotus JetAlliance
2x Corvette Racing
2x Robertson Racing
2x Jaguar RSR
2x Extreme Speed
2x Flying Lizard
1x Risi Competizione
1x Paul Miller Racing
1x Falken Tire
1x Proton Competition
1x CRS Racing
1x Gulf AMR
1x Krohn Racing
2x AF Corse
1x Larbre Competition
1x Michael Waltrip Racing/AF Corse
LMPC ~8
2x Core Autosport
2x Intersport Racing
2x Genoa/London Project
1x PR1/Mathiasen
1x PerformanceTech
GTC ~10
2x TRG
2x BSR/Green Hornet
1x Alex Job
1x JDX
1x NGT
1x GMG
1x Magnus
1x Porsche Napleton

Now start eliminating cars off this list.

Cars that haven't raced all races...

ILMC cars get priority..

Then ALMS cars that haven't raced all the races....

GTC - Magnus, Napleton
LMP - C
GT - Robertsons
LMP2 - 1 Level 5 car
LMP1 - Onyx/Dyson, Autocon

Help me out with other cars...

If you assume the above list is accurate, you can eliminate GTC cars that haven't done the full schedule and get down to 60....
I wonder how they will go from 60 to 53?

Victor_RO · 26 Aug 2011, 16:09 (Ref:2946449)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

I wonder how they will go from 60 to 53?

I think you've answered your own question somewhat...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

? Test Days, Practice and Qualifying will be limited to 60 entries

... they'll probably do something based off qualifying times. What, however, we'll probably find out on race week.

Nick6 · 26 Aug 2011, 16:17 (Ref:2946453)

Intersport x2
PerformanceTech
GMG

has the Black Hornet car been entered in all the races this season? I hope this memo doesn't scare off any entries.

fieldodreams79 · 26 Aug 2011, 16:24 (Ref:2946460)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Here was the theoretical list.

Presenting Zach's highly speculative, mildly offensive, and most certaintly correct (when you factor +/- 10% margin of error), Petit entry list...

I had been itching to get this discussion going since a concise list is unavailable online anywhere. Thanks Fogul. What a potential entry!!

Why not start a separate thread?

And that is an ass load of GT cars.

I would agree with Victor on the "natural" elimination theory...

Victor_RO · 26 Aug 2011, 16:31 (Ref:2946467)

Removing 7 cars... slowest 2 LMPC, 2 GTC, and three from the other classes (let's say 1 LMP1, one GTE-Pro and one GTE-Am)?

fieldodreams79 · 26 Aug 2011, 16:33 (Ref:2946470)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

Removing 7 cars... slowest 2 LMPC, 2 GTC, and three from the other classes (let's say 1 LMP1, one GTE-Pro and one GTE-Am)?

Just remove all GTC cars and call it done. Let them race an enduro Sunday morning.

AGD · 26 Aug 2011, 16:37 (Ref:2946477)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

Removing 7 cars... slowest 2 LMPC, 2 GTC, and three from the other classes (let's say 1 LMP1, one GTE-Pro and one GTE-Am)?

The problem is that a championship contender could get eliminated if they have a problem. For example, what happens of Gunnar gets Jon Fielded during qualifying?

And please don't suggest provisionals!

Victor_RO · 26 Aug 2011, 16:42 (Ref:2946479)

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGD

The problem is that a championship contender could get eliminated if they have a problem. For example, what happens of Gunnar gets Jon Fielded during qualifying?

And please don't suggest provisionals!

Mechanical problems - tough luck... but when it comes to traffic-induced problems, run separate sessions for each and every single class.

Well... it's just my idea about cutting the field from 60 to 53 after qualifying, we'll see what they actually do.

AGD · 26 Aug 2011, 16:54 (Ref:2946491)

Perhaps the ACO should allow ILMC teams to skip this round without penalty. I'm guessing most would show up, but maybe one or two would skip. Hopefully a bunch would not skip the round though.

As far as who to put on the reserve list, I don't know. One of the Genoa cars perhaps. Green Hornet maybe. Both of those teams will have another car there so maybe it would not be a problem for those teams to still get their cars ready to race if they are a late race replacement. Magnus, PR1, Napleton, and NGT also come to mind. Maybe an Intersport car too.

Nick6 · 26 Aug 2011, 17:08 (Ref:2946503)

NO!

Then we just end up with a 30 car grid of mostly challenge cars.

Deleted · 26 Aug 2011, 17:16 (Ref:2946507)

Just take all LMPC and GTC cars out and run a mini-enduro on Friday evening or whatever. Boosting grid numbers is the one and only reason why these two classes exist, so now would be a perfect opportunity to have some balls and throw them out. Full 40-50-something grid of proper prototypes and GT2s would be fabulous! But of course it won't happen...

Fogelhund · 26 Aug 2011, 17:50 (Ref:2946518)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiana

Just take all LMPC and GTC cars out and run a mini-enduro on Friday evening or whatever. Boosting grid numbers is the one and only reason why these two classes exist, so now would be a perfect opportunity to have some balls and throw them out. Full 40-50-something grid of proper prototypes and GT2s would be fabulous! But of course it won't happen...

Completely unrealistic. The Challenge cars depend on the big enduros, as these are the events they earn the greatest revenue on their rental rides. This has been part of their budget from the beginning of the year, and is a make or break event.

Eliminate the Challenge cars from their big event, eliminate the from the ALMS season next year... then how does your field look?

Deleted · 26 Aug 2011, 18:14 (Ref:2946528)

GTC didn't compete @ PLM in 2009, yet the challenge field was pretty decent everywhere else they run at.

AGD · 26 Aug 2011, 18:15 (Ref:2946529)

How about allowing some Challenge class teams to field cars with 4 drivers? Maybe some of the Challenge teams can combine their efforts. I don't know who would be interested in that and how many cars it could potentially take off the grid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiana

GTC didn't compete @ PLM in 2009, yet the challenge field was pretty decent everywhere else.

GTC (or whatever it was called back then) wasn't a full-time class in 2009.

Deleted · 26 Aug 2011, 18:18 (Ref:2946533)

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGD

GTC (or whatever it was called back then) wasn't a full-time class in 2009.

ALMS-C. But that doesn't change the fact.

AGD · 26 Aug 2011, 18:23 (Ref:2946538)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiana

ALMS-C. But that doesn't change the fact.

I have to disagree with you there. Those teams did not have the same expectations that teams have this year. The ALMS will have to explaining to do when they tell teams at such a late date that they won't be able to compete at a race that they were banking on all season long. Yes, I realize that your proposal allows for a race to be held, but it isn't the "big show."

Fogelhund · 26 Aug 2011, 18:45 (Ref:2946560)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiana

ALMS-C. But that doesn't change the fact.

Completely irrelevant though isn't it? Teams have been created and budgeted with the enduros in mind, based upon an agreement with the series. That can't be removed at this point.

Deleted · 26 Aug 2011, 18:48 (Ref:2946563)

Fine then. Write it in the 2012 rulebook and we'll see how many PC/GTC entries we've got for other races, I guess there could be a small drop in numbers but it's not like that's the end of ALMS.

--- edit, remembered wrong about Imola

Fogelhund · 26 Aug 2011, 18:49 (Ref:2946565)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiana

Fine then. Write it in the 2012 rulebook and we'll see how many PC/GTC entries we've got for other races

A number approaching ZERO. It would be an incredibly stupid move.

Deleted · 26 Aug 2011, 18:58 (Ref:2946573)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

A number approaching ZERO. It would be an incredibly stupid move.

So if it's written on the rulebook as in 2009 (ie class not eglible to compete in all races), how come there were 5-8 GTC entries at every race they attended then?

Jonerz · 26 Aug 2011, 19:13 (Ref:2946579)

Because in 2009 the class was launched as a late duct tape job on a series that was smarting for entries. The class came was announced at St. Pete and I believe didn't debut until Miller in May. And then they were welcomed in every race through Mosport, but the influx of European teams bandaged the ALMS field at Petit. Somehow, in summer 2009 the thinking of the ALMS brass changed and they decided to make the spec classes a permanent part of the championship (we don't need to discuss the reasons) and launched GTC and LMPC in 2010.

Chris

fieldodreams79 · 28 Aug 2011, 17:28 (Ref:2947281)

What are the chances a number of Euro GT teams won't make the trip across the pond for PLM? And which ones would the most likely to stay home?

And remind me which ones going for the ILMC missed Sebring; being allowed to miss one, from what I remember from the rules, if they missed Sebring, they would have to come to PLM in order to qualify for the championship...or have those rules been altered?

Jonerz · 28 Aug 2011, 17:52 (Ref:2947290)

Well, the European GT teams most likely to stay home is hard to speculate on. One would assume that Luxury Racing, for instance, despite being so very out of it in terms of the points race would have to come to Petit to act as yet another Ferrari there to score points for the Scuderia towards the ILMC title. Lotus Jet Alliance have missed Sebring, and failed to score at Imola so there is nothing to fight for, unless they really want 3rd place in the GTE Pro teams championship (where Luxury is still in with a shot). Mileage in race conditions is probably important to Lotus as well, especially if Lotus Sport North America or whomever they are plan on running next year.

As far as GTE-Am you'd think all of those teams would want to show up because Road Atlanta is a special race track, and Petit is a special race, ten hours into darkness and all that. These teams decisions are made on budget and the desires of the men providing budget. Presumably each of those teams will have budgeted for Petit and will still have the desire to show.

So, I don't know if there will be a European team that skips out on Road Atlanta. It will be a very busy grid, no doubt.

Chris

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