USCC 2014 Entry List & Schedule ONLY

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Mechanic Z

That's a pretty big "IF". MMPR was running competitively at both PLMs.
Leading when they wrecked in 2012, and leading again when they broke in 2013. Admittedly, this was a part of the sport, but one which no team, even Audi and Corvette, is immune to.


"Rebellion would have made them look stupid"? Do you have some axe to grind against MMPR or something?







MMPR simply outfoxed Rebellion. Strategy is a rather major element in racing. Pickett Racing being able to defeat a high-quality team like Rebellion, even though the #6 HPD was slower, kinda goes to show how good MMPR really was.




Several things to recall here:
1: You are referring to the 2010 season? Recall that until his scary wreck (at Mid-Ohio, IIRC) Greg Pickett himself co-drove the #6 Porsche with Klaus Graf. And not meaning to knock Greg's talents, it did slow their lineup a bit compared to the other teams.
And "steamrolled"? They took wins at Sebring, Lime Rock and Mosport.

2: Highcroft was another quality effort. Their impressive list of accomplishments does nothing to diminish Muscle Milk's.

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Matt

Split 50/50 with Rebellion on Rebellion's first time going to the tracks. Rebellion would have made them look stupid if they ran more than one year, much like they did at PLM in 2012.

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Mechanic Z

On a related note; here's a nice tribute by DSC:

http://www.dailysportscar.com/?p=30509

Great article.

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by TRspitfirefan

Great article.

Great article which ended with the usual DSC slagging of TUSC:

2014 saw a brave new world, and another new car for the team, with a first US owned Oreca Nissan P2 intended for the new Tudor United Sportscar Championship.

It’s fair to say that this was not a happy match, the P2s well off the pace at Daytona and the Muscle Milk car hitting trouble at both Daytona and Sebring before Greg Pickett first took a step back with the team but soon decided that enough was enough – Game over, shutters down.

For a man, and a team, that had real ambition that’s bordering on the tragic.

I was loving the article up until that point. I don't know what made Pickett withdraw, and its unfortunate that he did, but DSC's axe to grind against Grand-Am clearly made it through to IMSA as well. Much appreciated, guys. DSC can do great work and most of the time do, but why do something like this in an article? Why make the "Forget the Tech, Enjoy the Race" article now, after years of bagging on Grand Am and the Daytona Prototypes for being lower tech?

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by BrentJackson

Great article which ended with the usual DSC slagging of TUSC:

I was loving the article up until that point. I don't know what made Pickett withdraw, and its unfortunate that he did, but DSC's axe to grind against Grand-Am clearly made it through to IMSA as well. Much appreciated, guys. DSC can do great work and most of the time do, but why do something like this in an article?

How is that quote "slagging" on Tusc?
It is an entirely factual statement. Did not Pickett have to buy a new car to race in Tusc? Were not the P2 cars, well off the pace at Daytona? Did not the Oreca Nissan have some mechanical issues at Sebring?
I don't understand your objections to these statements.

[TF110]

I didnt see anything untruthful in that article. You really have to be reading into things with a slanted view to see any "slagging".

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by BrentJackson

Why make the "Forget the Tech, Enjoy the Race" article now, after years of bagging on Grand Am and the Daytona Prototypes for being lower tech?

I don't think that the intent of that article, was to suggest that cool tech is not an important aspect of top level sportscar racing.
I took it more as simply stating that even if an individual does not quite understand the details of how the different technologies are affected by the regulations, there is no reason that He/She can't still enjoy the great racing.

In my opinion, awe inspiring race cars are an absolutely necessary ingredient, in the recipe for great racing. Otherwise, even the closest racing action is kinda dull.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by WolfsburgRS

Also keep in mind that Pickett sold Muscle Milk, and as he's no longer a sole owner (along with his son) deciding where to spend those marketing dollars, the ROI needs to be much more substantial than "because this is what I like to spend money on."

Pickett, also being a shrewd business man, is not dumb enough to spend his own money (as compared to company money) to try and keep up a team of that caliber. See also: Duncan Dayton, etc etc.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/...58081793361254

It's for sale, not been sold.

This is one thing, and one thing only. Winning, and have the ability to do so. It's the whole company philosophy. They didn't, and it was curtains closed.

Simple really. At the end of the day the BoP was the problem.

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

Simple really. At the end of the day the BoP was the problem.

I doubt it's as simple as that. Especially given what happened at the last round.

[PatrickB]

Originally Posted by TF110

I didnt see anything untruthful in that article. You really have to be reading into things with a slanted view to see any "slagging".

Well DSC didn't even mention that Pickett purchased and ran a DP in GrandAm back in 2006

[Dyson Mazda]

Yeah I was really surprised the article did not include any information about their DP program. DSC is loosing more and more credibility every time I read an article on their site.

[TF110]

Its not that serious. Not mentioning a DP effort lessens their credibility? Seemed like an overview of their success, not a detailed walk through of all their efforts good and bad.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by BrentJackson

Great article which ended with the usual DSC slagging of TUSC:



I was loving the article up until that point. I don't know what made Pickett withdraw, and its unfortunate that he did, but DSC's axe to grind against Grand-Am clearly made it through to IMSA as well. Much appreciated, guys. DSC can do great work and most of the time do, but why do something like this in an article? Why make the "Forget the Tech, Enjoy the Race" article now, after years of bagging on Grand Am and the Daytona Prototypes for being lower tech?

It would appear that there are axes to grind by fans, against media who didn't support their viewpoint. Anyway, media calling stuff as it is....

[Maelochs]

Possibly Pickett's experience with DPs led to his announcement in late 2013 that he absolutely would not run a DP in TUSC ... and to his not running a DP in TUSC.

Sad to lose the team ... sadder to have lost Highcroft, a little less sad to have lost John and Clint Field and Autocon, but still sad ... Glad we still have DSC.

[Jaguar4]

Originally Posted by Beetle

Unfortunately, whether you like it or not, Indy and Kansas are both NASCAR-owned, and so is the USCR, so it's pretty likely that both of them will be on the schedule. Personally I found Kansas kind of interesting... quite a good race actually. I didn't survive the first 20 minutes of Indianapolis without falling asleep with potato chips in my mouth.

However I don't see what is holding the USCR to Detroit. If you look at my map, it's pretty clear that the USCR has really covered the Midwest and Northeast well. I've labeled the tracks blue if they are basically confirmed and red if there is still much debate over their existence in the future schedule. They've already got four races (five if you count Kansas) in the Midwest/Northeast in Watkins Glen, Indy, Road America, and Mosport... why do they need another one in Detroit? Personally I quite like the Belle Isle track and would trade Kansas or Indy for it in a heartbeat but unfortunately it seems like it may be Detroit that's taking the blow. Spreading the wealth to Barber Motorsports Park, VIR, or even Miller Motorsports Park would seem to be the wiser alternative.

Essentially, if Kansas and Indy are included, Detroit is probably out. However, if Kansas is dropped and it's Detroit versus Barber or VIR, there's no doubt that the vast majority of fans would pick Barber or VIR.

Indy isn't owned by NASCAR or ISC. It's owned by IndyCar and the George family. With the new configuration, I wouldn't judge the circuit until the race is held in July.

From what was reported, Kansas was on the scheduled because an exsisting deal was already in place and the contract needed to be honored. Not to mention the PC, Prototype Lites and CTSC are just racing there. Not really that big of a deal.

Detroit is on the schedule because the circuit is in Ford, GM and Chrysler's back yard.

Not everything is as cut and dry as adding races to the calendar based on the geographical location alone.

[BullMan]

Originally Posted by Jaguar4

Indy isn't owned by NASCAR or ISC. It's owned by IndyCar and the George family. With the new configuration, I wouldn't judge the circuit until the race is held in July.

From what was reported, Kansas was on the scheduled because an exsisting deal was already in place and the contract needed to be honored. Not to mention the PC, Prototype Lites and CTSC are just racing there. Not really that big of a deal.

Detroit is on the schedule because the circuit is in Ford, GM and Chrysler's back yard.

Not everything is as cut and dry as adding races to the calendar based on the geographical location alone.

You quoted something from before the schedule ever came out.

[joeb]

Fantastic read on DSC about Ian Dawson's history. I learned a lot about his early sportscar efforts. I'm posting it here because it goes in to detail about the Radical efforts both of past years and this season for TUSC.

http://www.dailysportscar.com/?p=22312

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by joeb

Fantastic read on DSC about Ian Dawson's history. I learned a lot about his early sportscar efforts. I'm posting it here because it goes in to detail about the Radical efforts both of past years and this season for TUSC.

http://www.dailysportscar.com/?p=22312

Reading that I hope Ian keeps his heart up. A Project Libra Radical with the same powerplant as the Ganassi and Shank DPs could be awesome fast. Keep at it, Ian!

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Simmi

I doubt it's as simple as that. Especially given what happened at the last round.

Actually, it is.

Pickett wants to win. He wants to be able to compete for wins. His brand is about winning.

He's wasn't doing that. Not even a chance. Four races in and there is still massive disparity in the BoP, regardless of what many think, or what the PR spin is.

He's not going to spend corporate money to be a mid pack or lower car. His brand then doesn't get the best exposure, and on some level, I suppose you could perceive, the product does not do as intended..thereby hurting sales.

Better BoP gives them a better shot to be on the pointy end of the grid. Wins/Podiums etc keeps them in the series.

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

Actually, it is.

Pickett wants to win. He wants to be able to compete for wins. His brand is about winning.

He's wasn't doing that. Not even a chance. Four races in and there is still massive disparity in the BoP, regardless of what many think, or what the PR spin is.

He's not going to spend corporate money to be a mid pack or lower car. His brand then doesn't get the best exposure, and on some level, I suppose you could perceive, the product does not do as intended..thereby hurting sales.

Better BoP gives them a better shot to be on the pointy end of the grid. Wins/Podiums etc keeps them in the series.

He told you all that?

[Dodge_Swinger]

BoP has gotten incrementally better, but the controversy isn't going away until there is one prototype spec in TUDOR. I come from the ALMS camp, but it didn't really excite me that a P2 finally won at Laguna. Was it BoP or great effort by the best team that day? It's impossible to say which, but the question is AWAYS there.

DPs and P2s came from two entirely different mindsets. They were never intended to race each other. I understand that nearly every series in the world has BoP, but the cars were all designed to the same set of rules. Adding a whole bunch of expensive mods to the DPs made them faster than P2s. What do they do, now? Adjust BoP until P2 is dominant? No one is going to be happy as long as races appear to be due to BoP.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Simmi

He told you all that?

Uh, not in so many words. And it wasn't exactly "he", more like "I've been told by"

Yes, there other reasons, but, Pickett is very clear in saying that he is here to compete and win. If he doesn't have that ability, he isn't going to do it. Period.

All starts with three words.

Balance Of Performance.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Dodge_Swinger

BoP has gotten incrementally better, but the controversy isn't going away until there is one prototype spec in TUDOR. I come from the ALMS camp, but it didn't really excite me that a P2 finally won at Laguna. Was it BoP or great effort by the best team that day? It's impossible to say which, but the question is AWAYS there.

DPs and P2s came from two entirely different mindsets. They were never intended to race each other. I understand that nearly every series in the world has BoP, but the cars were all designed to the same set of rules. Adding a whole bunch of expensive mods to the DPs made them faster than P2s. What do they do, now? Adjust BoP until P2 is dominant? No one is going to be happy as long as races appear to be due to BoP.

Open the tire formula.

[Maelochs]

Allowing free choice of tire won't help. Only Conti makes a DP tire (albeit mostly designed for the old, low-downforce DP) so if some p2s started running Dunlops or Michelins and winning, it would be unfair, so ... BoP again.

Dodge_Swinger is partly correct---we will always have to wonder what part BoP played in every P-class victory until there is a single formula.

However, that hasn't stopped a lot of people from enjoying GT2/GTE/GT-LM to the point that most here have described it the best GT racing on the planet.

I am so hoping that something like a "P1-Lite" spec with factory powerplants gets adopted for 2017, so small manufacturers can use a common monocoque between P1 and P2, with whatever necessary mods in the engine bay and simplified aero, making it cheaper to enter both ACO prototype classes.

Barring that I'd like to see simply a smaller version of P1 chassis, with simpler aero (no adjustable front wing, smaller rear wing) still with production-based engines-still cost-capped, but allow teams to play with a few aero and engine parameters, instead of straight homologated and thus basically sealed packages for both.

I'd like to see that become the accepted worldwide P2 spec.

I'd like a lot of things.

But ... TUSC fans will have to debate P-class BoP until the start fo the 2017 season--unless all the rest of the P2 teams follow Muscle Milk.

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Allowing free choice of tire won't help. Only Conti makes a DP tire (albeit mostly designed for the old, low-downforce DP) so if some p2s started running Dunlops or Michelins and winning, it would be unfair, so ... BoP again.

So....nobody else could make a DP tire?