[LM24] Toyota plans Le Mans return with hybrid!

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by Hugewally

And yet the worlds smartest people once believed the world was flat too.

Oh come on wally, you dont do you?

[Hugewally]

Seems I have a clue. If I followed your logic I would still not believe we landed on the moon either and would that the government blew up the twin towers and the levies.

[ss_collins]

Isn't it logical that a new LMP would be a Toyota engined Dome in '09/10, but any full factory effort would be when the new regs start in 2011.

why make such a distinction?

[juicy sushi]

Originally Posted by AU N EGL

I grow and manage over 5000 acres of trees. Am a very strong environmentalist. But just dont believe the BS that the media and governments play on ppl just to control them with fear.

and as you ask for respect then how about for those of us who don't believe the poor research that has been published?

The sky is not falling.

you and i debated this at length, and i'm not going to drag that issue out again. however i think the thomas homer dixon argument regarding the energy consumption of a civilization also has a great deal of merit.

back to the issue at hand:

i don't think that toyota will enter the LMP ranks. i think they probably have done the math, looked at the current economic situation, and decided that it was an $80 million they could have used elsewhere. they may have already invested a lot, but i think that would fall under the concept of "sunk cost".

this rather leaves dome out in the cold, since they apparently don't want to sell that coupe to customers (unfortunately)...

[TheNewBob]

Originally Posted by AU N EGL

I grow and manage over 5000 acres of trees. Am a very strong environmentalist. But just dont believe the BS that the media and governments play on ppl just to control them with fear.

and as you ask for respect then how about for those of us who don't believe the poor research that has been published?

The sky is not falling.

There is poor research done about a lot of things. I'm certainly dubious about anything governments say, I've long since lost all faith in them.

But figuring it out for yourself using basic science isn't difficult - we humans are a filthy species, and weather you believe the 'sky is falling' or not, there is a heck of a lot we could do to clean ourselves up. We owe it to ourselves and the land upon which we live.

I'm currently reading a couple of books which paint intriguing pictures - High Tide by Mark Lynas and The World Without Us by Alan Weisman. They ignore the governments statements and go straight to the experts, and their own findings (in very different ways, but both interesting). That, however, is off-topic.

Hybrid technology is a good start - it needs to go much, much further, with a nice minimum noise limit for us real fans (), but it surely should be welcomed and encouraged.

[AU N EGL]

Bob, Move on. You asked me for your respect, and I asked you the same.

If you want to take it off line or OT that is different.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

why make such a distinction?

A Toyota engined Dome would be a toe in the water exercise, much like previous deals, such as Nissan engined Courages, rather than the full factory GT-ONE program.

Such a program is unlikely to challenge Audi or Peugeot for an overall win.

That being the case, Toyota/Dome would need an all new car/engine package, introducing that in 2011 would make most sense, similar to how Oreca have decided to delay their new car until the future regs were clear.

In other words Toyota can afford to be cautious for another 12-18 months.

[old man]

Interesting report on DSC of the Audi R15, if I may quote DSC:


Audi’s motorsport programme is recognised by the company as a key factor in its overall success, but it is clear that the available funds are going to be targeted at areas that bring the largest return on investment; "We know just how important motorsport is for the success of the brand," said Michael Dick, Chairman of the Board for Technical Development. "Therefore, it goes without saying that Audi must also be present on the race track in economically hard times. It is all the more important for us to enter a motorsport category in which the cost-benefit calculation is positive."

Toyota should perhaps spend less on F1 and more on this programme?

[zac510]

Their NASCAR programme too.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by zac510

Their NASCAR programme too.

I assume Toyota get a decent return from NASCAR, being race winners and up against 2 (3?) other manufacturer's.

In F1 Toyota are also rans, the odd podium at best, they certainly don't have the ROCK SOLID reputation Audi have gained from Le Mans. In fact Toyota are likely still better known for their WRC exploits with Sainz and Kankunnen.

Toyota's sporting heritage is built on sportscar and rally program's, push against that, as Jaguar did, can only lead to bad things.

[zac510]

You do have to wonder what is better value:

$400m F1

or
$100m Rallying
$100m Sportscars
$50m Touring Cars
$150m distributed for country-specific racing programs, privateer support, etc eg btcc.

Give or take a bit on the amounts, of course.

We're not really in a good position to judge, we're enthusiasts and probably follow at least one or all of the disciplines in the second option above. So we'd watch anyway. Of these disciplines what's the total worldwide coverage compared to F1? Let's face it, Toyota are primarily in for marketing coverage.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by zac510

You do have to wonder what is better value:

$400m F1

or
$100m Rallying
$100m Sportscars
$50m Touring Cars
$150m distributed for country-specific racing programs, privateer support, etc eg btcc.

Give or take a bit on the amounts, of course.

We're not really in a good position to judge, we're enthusiasts and probably follow at least one or all of the disciplines in the second option above. So we'd watch anyway. Of these disciplines what's the total worldwide coverage compared to F1? Let's face it, Toyota are primarily in for marketing coverage.

I am convinced it's option B.

[CTD]

Especially:

$150m distributed for country-specific racing programs, privateer support, etc eg btcc

There is a lot of marketing to make there, if you do it right!

[zac510]

The final option would cover stuff in maybe 20 of Toyota's biggest countries! It's very broad! but I could think of any other legal way to spend $150 mill

[Japanese Samurai]

According to Best Car magazine(Japanese automobile gossip magazine), the engine that Toyota is developing for Le man is 3.5-3.7 liters V10 engine(hybrids).
However, there was no article on the Le Mans participation.

[The Badger]

Why would they build an engine when the cap is 3.4 ?

[The Badger]

Isnt it 3.4 litre max ?

[The Badger]

Sorry , double post .

[The Badger]

Sorry , double post !!!

[The Badger]

Sorry , my pc is playing up !!!

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Sorry , my pc is playing up !!!

Can some mod please delete these last posts ..... I got a PC glitch somewhere !!! Sorry .

[Japanese Samurai]

Yes, what you say is certainly correct.
I might have misundersood it because I only browsed that book in a bookstore.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Japanese Samurai

According to Best Car magazine(Japanese automobile gossip magazine), the engine that Toyota is developing for Le man is 3.5-3.7 liters V10 engine(hybrids).
However, there was no article on the Le Mans participation.

Hmm does this mean that we will first see a Dome with Toyota engine?, then later a Toyota with Dome developed chassis?

[juicy sushi]

Originally Posted by Japanese Samurai

Yes, what you say is certainly correct.
I might have misundersood it because I only browsed that book in a bookstore.

how reliable is best car when it comes to race news? i remember they always have tons of shiney pictures of future street cars, but rather limited race coverage...

[Japanese Samurai]

Best Car is a gossip magazine that should be loved.
It is a magazine laughed to say that Best Car is a news source at.
However, this magazine did the news of the FIA-GT specification car of Nissan and the scoop was done first.