Irish Formula Libre 2008 - Page 14

Motormouth · 1 Oct 2008, 15:57 (Ref:2302115)

While we have our anoraks on, what ever happened to the first MDGT, the Midget based, ford engined one?

Peter Dunne · 1 Oct 2008, 16:02 (Ref:2302118)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

While we have our anoraks on, what ever happened to the first MDGT, the Midget based, ford engined one?

Its probably being used as a kennel or a chicken coup behind Morgans house

According to Ed, he still the sister car to Ed's

davyboy · 1 Oct 2008, 17:04 (Ref:2302162)

I've just put my own anorak on... here's it back in the day !! Sorry but the focus was on George's metro

Peter Dunne · 1 Oct 2008, 17:22 (Ref:2302176)

Who are the two guys on the infield? The one on the left looks like Brian Foley? You can just see the corner of the old marshals post which looks like a danger in itself not to mind where those two are standing.

We've gone well off topic here. Someone mention Formula Libre, quick!

SAMD · 1 Oct 2008, 18:23 (Ref:2302225)

mmmm, what about, I see the rear wheels look like they belong to something in Formula Libre!!!

The boyo on the right looks a bit like Bertie Fisher. No, I know its not him, I said it looks a bit like him.

davyboy · 1 Oct 2008, 19:29 (Ref:2302279)

Oliver McCrossan.

Graz · 1 Oct 2008, 20:50 (Ref:2302327)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Dunne

Its probably being used as a kennel or a chicken coup behind Morgans house

According to Ed, he still the sister car to Ed's

Is Motormouth talking about the even earlier one he debuted around 1984 - the original MDGT - still distincly Midget shaped. I remember George Crozier (in his fabulous mini) taking a rather big bite out of it at Dunlop - took the whole door off IIRC - during the Leinster Trophy meeting that year. I think that race might even have been the debut of the MDGT.

Graz · 1 Oct 2008, 20:55 (Ref:2302330)

Quote:

Originally Posted by stealth1

OK Graz, would hate to get in the way of great progress, so here goes

Bodies are pretty much the same on both cars, my one was widened around the back wheels when an issue was made of the wheels protruding outside the bodywork at first. Morgans one was mounted lower on his car as he ran a rear wing initially, but then discarded it. The feeling on my car was that you would get aero effect simply by jacking the whole body up from the rear into a wedge shape, and if you look at Peter's picture of the back of my car you will see the frame that does that coming up from the back of the gearbox to under the very back of the body. There are supports on the roll cage also to prop it up in the middle ....

hope thats chalked another one off for you! feel free to ask some more now that I'm on a roll!

Thanks Ed, that makes a lot of sense. Another one off the list...

Not sure you could help me with the others - for example, what does one call 2 or more computer mouse thingies - Mouses or Mice? It's those type of things that bug me so I don't know if people really want to go there...I am quite normal otherwise, honest...

Graz · 1 Oct 2008, 21:00 (Ref:2302332)

Quote:

Originally Posted by davyboy

I've just put my own anorak on... here's it back in the day !! Sorry but the focus was on George's metro

Here's the Dempsey one for comparison against Faulkners (now Ed's) one in Davyboys pic.

http://www.conconnolly.com/cutenews/...s_2/leo062.jpg

Motormouth · 1 Oct 2008, 21:26 (Ref:2302360)

I actually took that pic, and most of the other GT pics on Con's site, back in the day!!
The 2 guys on the infield in Davyboy's pic are Oliver McCrossan and Chris McLaughlin I think?
Yeah, I remember Crozier climbing all over the MDGT on its debut at the esses, actually have it on video somewhere...... That was the one I was asking about, the front engined one. Ugly machine......

Oh yeah, off thread again, sorry!!!
Some of those GT cars must have had similar suspension to some modern day Libres? Maybe Ed can clarify?!!

stealth1 · 2 Oct 2008, 00:55 (Ref:2302438)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

I actually took that pic, and most of the other GT pics on Con's site, back in the day!!
The 2 guys on the infield in Davyboy's pic are Oliver McCrossan and Chris McLaughlin I think?
Yeah, I remember Crozier climbing all over the MDGT on its debut at the esses, actually have it on video somewhere...... That was the one I was asking about, the front engined one. Ugly machine......

Oh yeah, off thread again, sorry!!!
Some of those GT cars must have had similar suspension to some modern day Libres? Maybe Ed can clarify?!!

LOL … hey there Leo, a pleasure to b of service once again! Don’t know about modern Libres, but the 2 latter MD’s were essentially widened in the middle March F 2 cars with big ass fibreglass bodies on, so I suppose technically we’re still talking Libre!

Going off thread now though, I actually came across that original MD some years after its retirement when a hillclimber friend brought me to Athlone to see something he was thinking of buying as one of those winter projects we all think of as a great idea at the time! The guy we met brought us to a lock up that absolutely stank of cats and lo and behold there it was …. Boy, was it ugly then!

Peter Dunne · 2 Oct 2008, 06:28 (Ref:2302505)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

That was the one I was asking about, the front engined one. Ugly machine......

I actually quite liked the look of that car! It was "ugly pretty" in the same way as Kirsten Dunst!!

IIRC it was a clever way for Morgan to get around the rule of modifying if you wanted to but having to retain the original engine as your base? By changing the body of the Midget and calling it an MD GT he could then drop in a 1600 and change the box instead of that awful BMC lump? I could be totally wrong (surprising, I know) but I'm sure either Leo or David can clarify.

Sad to think of this once great car languishing in a shed with cat poo for company. I'm sure there are many others suffering the same fate. Where did they all go?

Back on topic... They would all be eligable for Saloon Libre!

davyboy · 2 Oct 2008, 08:31 (Ref:2302558)

We're totally off topic here, but what the heck... its intersting stuff.

The up to 1350cc GT regs at the time stipulated that you needed to retain the original engine block from the car. The more developed MG Midgets had the motor moved back 14" into the frame... that was about as much as you could get it without re-engineering the chassis completely.

I spoke to Morgan about 20 years about it and IIRC he said that car was a process of gradual evolution from the original Midget. When he dropped the 1600cc Ford lump into it, he was in the bigger class which allowed greater freedom in terms of redesigning parts of the chassis and optimizing the engine/box layout.

It was a strange looking machine... Peter I'd say it was ugly in a Nora Batty way

Still it was about as far as you could develop an MG Midget and having had the pain of running one of those things myself, credit to Morgan for sticking with it.

Motormouth · 2 Oct 2008, 08:49 (Ref:2302576)

March F2 based? Would you not double the value of yours by taking its clothes off then Ed?!! A lot of the UK Superloons were converted back into the (now far more valuable) car upon which they were based when the class faded away.......
Does Morgan still have the sister car then?
John Keaney has the TMC
Crozier only sold the Metro in the last year or so
Halls Imp was destroyed in a Dublin garage fire..
David Dowlings TMC was bought ny Val Thompson and is stripped awaiting rebuild.
Are these cars eligible for Libre Ireland? I don't think they can race in Saloon Libre as they don't want full spaceframes (or bike engines)....

davyboy · 2 Oct 2008, 09:33 (Ref:2302610)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

March F2 based? Would you not double the value of yours by taking its clothes off then Ed?!! A lot of the UK Superloons were converted back into the (now far more valuable) car upon which they were based when the class faded away.......

That's exactly what I was thinking. Ed, are the original March plates on the car ? Do you have the chassis number ?

Peter Dunne · 2 Oct 2008, 10:13 (Ref:2302644)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

Does Morgan still have the sister car then?

Yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

John Keaney has the TMC

And will do forever. For him to sell that would be like selling one of his children!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

Halls Imp was destroyed in a Dublin garage fire..

What a shame.That was probably the best turned out car at the time. Brendan O Mahony had that car for a while.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

Are these cars eligible for Libre Ireland?

I would have thought they would fall quite neatly into the closed wheel section?

Peter Dunne · 2 Oct 2008, 10:16 (Ref:2302647)

Quote:

Originally Posted by davyboy

That's exactly what I was thinking. Ed, are the original March plates on the car ? Do you have the chassis number ?

Was that car not built from scratch by Morgan? If it was only based on a March it would not have a March plate.

Motormouth · 2 Oct 2008, 10:21 (Ref:2302651)

Ed's gone all quite. Bet he's gone home and is climbing all over the yoke looking for a chassis plate. If he finds one, all the missus will get when she gets home is a goodbye note!!!!

Motormouth · 2 Oct 2008, 10:57 (Ref:2302680)

Meant "quiet" of course. If my mother was reading this, she'd kill me.......

Peter Dunne · 2 Oct 2008, 11:46 (Ref:2302717)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

Meant "quiet" of course. If my mother was reading this, she'd kill me.......

Quite right Leo

Graz · 2 Oct 2008, 11:57 (Ref:2302727)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motormouth

March F2 based? Would you not double the value of yours by taking its clothes off then Ed?!! A lot of the UK Superloons were converted back into the (now far more valuable) car upon which they were based when the class faded away.......
Does Morgan still have the sister car then?
John Keaney has the TMC
Crozier only sold the Metro in the last year or so
Halls Imp was destroyed in a Dublin garage fire..
David Dowlings TMC was bought ny Val Thompson and is stripped awaiting rebuild.
Are these cars eligible for Libre Ireland? I don't think they can race in Saloon Libre as they don't want full spaceframes (or bike engines)....

What about some others?
George Crozier's Mini he had pre the Metro. Probably long gone but that was the car the fired my interest in the GT class
The Sunbeam Stilletto that Maurice Mitton and then Peter Faulkner ran. That was a smart little machine.

Peter Dunne · 2 Oct 2008, 12:24 (Ref:2302740)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graz

The Sunbeam Stilletto that Maurice Mitton and then Peter Faulkner ran. That was a smart little machine.

I recall hearing somewhere (but cant remember where) that its in someones back garden waiting to be built. Leo?

class1comp · 2 Oct 2008, 18:58 (Ref:2302975)

Now who was looking well on the grid last Sunday

Motormouth · 2 Oct 2008, 21:44 (Ref:2303086)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Dunne

I recall hearing somewhere (but cant remember where) that its in someones back garden waiting to be built. Leo?

Hmmm, as far as I remember, Peter Faulkner stripped a lot of it for Morgan to build (Ed's) MDGT. Noel McDonnell, who used to race a Mini in the 1350 class, bought the chassis and bodywork from him with the intention of building it up someday........
He may still have it!!

Peter Dunne · 3 Oct 2008, 07:32 (Ref:2303237)

Quote:

Originally Posted by class1comp

Now who was looking well on the grid last Sunday

Thanks Gerard, nice pic!

I'VE GOT A STALKER, I'VE GOT A STALKER!!

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