Toyota/Rebellion Racing - Le Mans/ILMC/LMS - 2011 (merged)

[The Badger]

I gotts admit , before the start of last season , when there was talk of Rebellion using red white , and gold ..... I thought "oh God no!!!" . Maybe it was the thought of the Jordan Gp Benson car , that certainly didnt work .

Its on fine looking livery .

On a soft note ..... who is the team manager now , since Hugh Hayden sadly passed on ?

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by The Badger

On a soft note ..... who is the team manager now , since Hugh Hayden sadly passed on ?

Most likely his son, he was apparently the de facto manager of the team through 2010 as well (at least that's the impression I got from interviews on Radio Le Mans).

[The Badger]

Oh ..... nice one .

Im feelin it in my waters , that this Rebellion/Toyota effort will show some great results . Team has time with the chassis , brilliant driver line up ..... a supply of factory supported engines with crew I presume , and a car full of sponsorship ..... plus the technical help that comes from a factory wanting to look good .

Im excited !!!

[TF110]

Wonder if Toyota will help at all with the chassis? Or car part, or if this is strictly an engine deal.

[GTfour]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Oh ..... nice one .

Im feelin it in my waters , that this Rebellion/Toyota effort will show some great results . Team has time with the chassis , brilliant driver line up ..... a supply of factory supported engines with crew I presume , and a car full of sponsorship ..... plus the technical help that comes from a factory wanting to look good .

Im excited !!!

This all remembers me of this brilliant visit at the Rebellion team an intrepid group of 10/10ers had at Le Mans, some years ago...
There was Hayden jr. , showing us around their narrow two pitboxes, telling us all in full detail about their cars,mechanics,designers and drivers and in doing so, basically blowing us lot away with their professionallity, even running two completely different cars in two different classes! Sad though the passing of Hayden Sr. may be, I have full confidence that his son'll shine in enterprising this passionate team.

On top of that, I'm a Toyota fan !

[isynge]

Originally Posted by GTfour

This all remembers me of this brilliant visit at the Rebellion team an intrepid group of 10/10ers had at Le Mans, some years ago...
There was Hayden jr. , showing us around their narrow two pitboxes, telling us all in full detail about their cars,mechanics,designers and drivers and in doing so, basically blowing us lot away with their professionallity, even running two completely different cars in two different classes! Sad though the passing of Hayden Sr. may be, I have full confidence that his son'll shine in enterprising this passionate team.

On top of that, I'm a Toyota fan !

Having been on the same pit visit have to echo GTFours comments - I was struck by how sorted an operation Rebellion are and how well they work satisfying technical and commercial considerations - as an outfit I can see how deserving they are of this opportunity.

And yes - like GTFour I am a Toyota fan, and, as some of you on here are abundantly aware, a Toyota owner...

[TF110]

I'm an avid toyota fan and follower, whatever Toyota concerned, I am interested. F1, sportscars, SuperGt, Rally, Touring cars, whatever it may be, even Nascar, I route for Denny Hamlin and Kyle Busch. I'll be routing on Rebellion this year for a good showing.

[Bentley03]

Confirmation, on DAILY SPORTSCAR this morning, that Rebellion Racing will contest the Le Mans Series this year with 2 cars and the full ILMC with one car (no word on which of their drivers will contest the ILMC). They have also requested Le Mans entries for both cars. Great news, and a very busy year for the team!

[Victor_RO]

With the LMS entry alongside the ILMC one and their new link to Toyota, I'd be VERY surprised if the second car isn't on the main entry list for Le Mans.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

With the LMS entry alongside the ILMC one and their new link to Toyota, I'd be VERY surprised if the second car isn't on the main entry list for Le Mans.

Agreed, I'd be amazed if that weren't the case.

[CTD]

This also might indicate that Toyota is more than a passive engine supplier! It takes some money to be that active

[The Badger]

Well , my idea is that Toyota will lend some support , especially in the aero/cooling area . Especially since Rebellion is the only Toyota team at present . If the car doesnt perform well from the start , Im sure Toyota will not want to look bad and help out in any way they can .

I also feel that this is the tip of an iceberg ..... for the future . For example Acura , doesnt want to appear to be in Motorsport due to economic situations , hence the HPD banner , and possibily the same for Toyota too , so maybe its an omen for a future assault ?

Anyway , Im looking forward to seeing these beautiful Rebellion cars again , and wish them all the best in their endevours .

[Tim the Grey]

I too wish Rebellion all the luck in the world. They need it after last year's 'Character Building' races.

I am in 2 minds here. Are Toyota in for the long haul, and will eventually race their own chassis, or are we looking at a 'bitsa' solution, where Rebellion have done a deal with a Toyota engine tuner/supplier for a race engine that fits LMP1 regs in 2011?

Either way, were they to win something, I suspect Toyota would take a great deal of credit, whilst being nicely hidden from public view if it all goes wrong?

[The Badger]

I dont think that Rebellion could afford to pay (TRD) Toyota for an engine deal just for themselves .

I reckon its a long term thing .

[Tim the Grey]

There would seem to be lots of money in making watches these days! Blanpain are spending it like water, and Rebellion had their Judds re-badged as Rebellions, last year.

They may be a LOT better financed than we may think.

[The Badger]

The Judd already existed as an endurance engine ..... the Toyota was developed as an endurance engine , which they didnt have before . Bit of a differance dont you think plus ..... Toyota is a works deal , and that doesnt come cheap .

[Speed-King]

Originally Posted by The Badger

The Judd already existed as an endurance engine ..... the Toyota was developed as an endurance engine , which they didnt have before . Bit of a differance dont you think plus ..... Toyota is a works deal , and that doesnt come cheap .

Isn't the Toyota a Super GT-engine?
IIRC Super GT engines have to last a certain number of races and are of course used in the 1000k race at Suzuka, so I'd say that these actually are endurance engines.

[Mal]

Originally Posted by CTD

This also might indicate that Toyota is more than a passive engine supplier! It takes some money to be that active

I think you are right - the cost of running 2 cars in LMS, one in ILMC plus 2 at LeMans strikes me as more than Rebellion could have (or would have) funded on their own

[Félix]

Originally Posted by Mal

I think you are right - the cost of running 2 cars in LMS, one in ILMC plus 2 at LeMans strikes me as more than Rebellion could have (or would have) funded on their own

Rebellion have never been exactly concerned with spending as little as possible. Running prototypes in 2 classes, a generous number of private tests and now owning 4 (FOUR) Lola chassis doesn't exactly scream "I need money from my engine supplier". In fact, just being given engines or at least certainly not paying as much for them as they did as Judd customers probably pays for the 3 extra fly-aways.

[Mal]

Originally Posted by Félix

Rebellion have never been exactly concerned with spending as little as possible. Running prototypes in 2 classes, a generous number of private tests and now owning 4 (FOUR) Lola chassis doesn't exactly scream "I need money from my engine supplier". In fact, just being given engines or at least certainly not paying as much for them as they did as Judd customers probably pays for the 3 extra fly-aways.

Well - lets wait and see

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Isn't the Toyota a Super GT-engine?
IIRC Super GT engines have to last a certain number of races and are of course used in the 1000k race at Suzuka, so I'd say that these actually are endurance engines.

Im not exactly sure where this engine came from but , to develop an endurance engine from a super GT engine requires a fair bit of development that wont be cheap .

1000K to a (5000K) 24 hour race engine is a massive development , I would have thought .

[Tim the Grey]

Maybe not. If, as siad above, it has to run for 3-4 races (Plus Q sessions) between rebuilds, you ain't far off a 24 hour engine anyway.
Run with a few less revs and maybe bigger cooling, and you are done?

At least, that's how I'd see it.

It may well be that Toyota HAVE done some work to adjust the spec, but as I said before, it's a low risk/no risk strategy for them, and at a bargain price! In Toyota Corporate Budget world, this is well below paper clips and staples on the list.

[Victor_RO]

Also, aren't the HSV-010 Honda's engine and the engine that has been consistently raced in the ARX-01 basically the same thing? That engine's reliability must be a good sign that Toyota shouldn't really have major issues on the reliability side if they derive their LMP1 engine off the Super GT engine.

[The Badger]

Where are ya Knighty !!!

I reckon the differance between an engine that can run 1000K and 5000K in one go is a big differance .

[TF110]

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

Also, aren't the HSV-010 Honda's engine and the engine that has been consistently raced in the ARX-01 basically the same thing? That engine's reliability must be a good sign that Toyota shouldn't really have major issues on the reliability side if they derive their LMP1 engine off the Super GT engine.

Indy car as well, Honda has almost the same engine for 3, make that 4 racing series. That'd be Indy, LeMans, SuperGT and Formula Nippon. Same with Toyota minus Indy. There's no doubt in my mind this engine is quite capable and will last. I remember reading that the SuperGT engines can hit 800hp with ease without all the restrictions. So with the cut backs in power I'm thinking reliability isnt that much of an issue.