Grade confusion

[aland]

regarding sprints, i did a 2 day sprint this year and was actually one of the more experienced marshals there (had just done my 10th day) as most of the guys marshalling were conscripts as opposed to volunteers and it was the 1st time this place had had any guys turning up purely to marshal. i was the only 1 that had a msa card and had done any proper training. so a bit of an eye opener, ended up acting as IO/post cheif as the 2 old boys i had with me 1 was hard of hearing and the other could hardly walk, okay both were good blokes but with me the only 1 that could deal with an incident on post...hmmm. okay anything that went off i dealt with but i admit i did go ape when coming back from lunch to see 2 guys sitting on the tyres with their backs to the traffic and the track was live with cars going past 8 feet away. some of my language was a bit colourful to say the least

dunno if i would go back there

[pixie2308]

Quote:
Steve the training routes for upgrade and details are now in the Volunteer in Motorsport website. http://www.volunteersinmotorsport.co.uk/grading.php

Unfortunately 'Pixie' the VIM website is way out of date and has not changed since the inception of the new grading scheme.

For the definitive version please go to the BMMC website at ( http://www.marshals.co.uk/national/b...+Officer/7.htm ) which has the correct version of the grading structure.

This booklet is issued to all new members of BMMC on joining. If anybody wants a copy then send me a STAMPED addressed envelope, my details are on the website.

Thank you Eric... at least we now get the correct place to look for the correct information! even if a long winded way to go about things! You would have hoped that the 'main' source of information that MSA direct you to would have the correct information!!!

Do any of us really stand a chance? or does enthusiasm and a bucket load of raw talent and committed people count for most of it?

[pixie2308]

[QUOTE=pixie2308;2550531]Quote:
Steve the training routes for upgrade and details are now in the Volunteer in Motorsport website. http://www.volunteersinmotorsport.co.uk/grading.php

Unfortunately 'Pixie' the VIM website is way out of date and has not changed since the inception of the new grading scheme.

For the definitive version please go to the BMMC website at ( http://www.marshals.co.uk/national/b...+Officer/7.htm ) which has the correct version of the grading structure.

This booklet is issued to all new members of BMMC on joining. If anybody wants a copy then send me a STAMPED addressed envelope, my details are on the website.

Thank you Eric... at least we now get the correct place to look for the correct information! even if a long winded way to go about things! You would have hoped that the 'main' source of information that MSA direct you to would have the correct information!!!

Do any of us really stand a chance? or does enthusiasm and a bucket load of raw talent and committed people count for most of it?

Ooher ... repeating my self now ......

[Sparky-steve]

[QUOTE=Dave Brand;2550327]Sometimes it's difficult to strike a balance between holding people back & putting them in a situation which they have neither the training nor the experience to cope with. Marshalling is a potentially dangerous pastime - the object of the exercise is to get incidents dealt with as safely & as quickly as possible. The more experienced people you are working with have (or should have!) the training, knowledge & experience to recognise the dangers & act accordingly.

Please accept that what follows is in no way intended as a comment on you personally - it's a generalisation & not intended to sound arrogant or patronising:

When a new marshal who has only done a few meetings comes on post, he/she is an unknown quantity. I will always try to have a quick chat & get an idea of what trainees have done to assess how much they have learnt & identify their training needs;
comments on your card are very important in this respect. After a few meetings you'll find yourself working with people you've worked with before & you may even start to have built up something of a reputation - good or bad!(A good reputation to have would be "the marshal who brings Jaffa Cakes for the Post Chief!")

Don't get too hung up on grading; just remember, we marshal for one reason - fun! Enjoy what you're doing & the rest will just fall into place.[/QUOTE]

i read this post twice and i can honestly say i totally agree with you..
and i'm thinking why the did i ask this question ???
i know we say there's never a stupid question, well think i've found one feel a total twit now

but now your've gone and spilled the beans... JAFFA CAKES
so that's the secret to getting on in marshaling LOL
just for that comment i'll bring some to Oulton this weekend HEHEHE


ok i've forgotten about grading, and i don't want to go past track marshal, as i'm deffo a hands on/get stuck in, person
and yep SAFE FUN is the order of the day

oh and Dave, your comments are very helpful and constructive, and i thank you for the insight and information. and how could i take them any other way.????

[Tal Aras]

Originally Posted by ChrisA

You will find that you ''will be thrown in the deep-end'' soon enough.A first timer is usually told to stay back and watch, to see how we do things. After that, you're normally put with an experienced marshal, and by his/her lead muck in.
I personally believe that the best way to learn is hands on, as many others will agree.
Good luck, and enjoy you're marshalling, I do and have done for nearly 35 years.

As someone who's upgraded this year I'd suggest doing the smaller club meets to get the experience. Also, anything with long races (3 hours +) such as Fun Cup or SPEED or when there is a big event on elsewhere (GP, Goodwood etc). Were there are fewer marshals, trainees get asked to do more and are very welcome.

[Dave Brand]

Originally Posted by Sparky-steve

and i'm thinking why the did i ask this question ???
i know we say there's never a stupid question, well think i've found one feel a total twit now

Don't worry about it - there were probably a few lurkers with the same problem who didn't have the courage to ask!

but now your've gone and spilled the beans... JAFFA CAKES
so that's the secret to getting on in marshaling LOL
just for that comment i'll bring some to Oulton this weekend HEHEHE

Let's just say that I may be more inclined to write positive comments on a card if I'm fed JC's!

ok i've forgotten about grading, and i don't want to go past track marshal, as i'm deffo a hands on/get stuck in, person
and yep SAFE FUN is the order of the day

Don't forget about grading - just let the grade you achieve be a reflection of your knowledge & experience rather than a target you've set yourself.

[Lord Summerisle]

Originally Posted by Sparky-steve

ok i've forgotten about grading, and i don't want to go past track marshal, as i'm deffo a hands on/get stuck in, person

ok, who left the crayon box out?

and - just because you move beyond 'track marshal' grade doesn't mean your less hands on. its more recognizing the more experience you have attained.
Yes to go from Track to Experienced, you will have had to have done 15 days (split between incident and flagging, with at min of 5 days in one discipline) and done 2 training days.
but it doesn't stop you getting 'hands on'

heck, even getting up to obs/post chief level, doesn't always preclude you from needing to get hands on, if attendance is low.

But as said, this is a hobby, and its ment to be fun.

As for being allowed to help out in an incident - sometimes things happen that puts you in the thick of it (thinking of the chap on his first day on the bank, running from a Ginetta that was rolling down the wrong side of the Armco.)
What the more experienced guys are looking out for are that your not the gung ho type of chap who'll go running out to a spinning car - before the dust has settled, only for the car to drive off and leave you in the middle of the grass with a pack of touring cars bearing down on you (it has happened!) as if you get run over... well it'll be a sad thing... but the paperwork is long and tedious!

It took me 4 years to go from Trainee to Track grade (my own choice, i went for the upgrade when Obs were saying it was time i upgraded, and then it took a while to get a opportunity to be with a examining obs). And i'm happy - mainly cos i have been able to flag since the new grading came in. I don't envisage going past the track grade at circuit, as i don't want to do incident.
Were as i plan to move on up through the Speed grades as and when i feel ready.

[lucky scarf]

As a fellow newbie this year from speaking to a number of experienced marshals early on I took the view that whilst 10 + 1 is the minimum its better to gain a wide experience first rather than chase an upgrade. So far I've done 11 events for a signature and feel that I should probably double that before going for an upgrade.

The support from experienced marshals has been second to none and I think that I've been lucky being with a few familar faces at meetings (apols for those that have had to put up with me more than once).

In terms of getting hands on - why not volunteer for Anglesey in addition to Oulton. I know its a bit further for most people but most days you get the chance to get hands on being part of a smaller group most days.

[mini1400]

Originally Posted by Lord Summerisle

heck, even getting up to obs/post chief level, doesn't always preclude you from needing to get hands on, if attendance is low.

and just because your graded as an obs/pc doesn't mean that you have to volenteer for every meeting at that grade, you can grade down if you fancy doing something different!

[numbersix]

Originally Posted by arnage arnie

... It never looks good (and is very dangerous) when too many marshals rush out to an incident, especially if one doesn't know what he/she is doing ...
Steve

That's a valid point worth repeating. Keen as we all are to get up close and personal, for many incidents it's just a question of getting the driver out and over the barrier as quickly as possible with a bottle man close by, still by the barrier. It doesn't look good to see umpteen marshals milling about not really doing anything constructive. That's my job

If there is nothing obvious to be done on a live circuit then stay where you are is my opinion.

[White flag man]

But that's the problems with meetings, like the BTCC meeting at Brands Hatch this weekend, when they'll porbably be 20 incidents marshals per post. Its all about deciding before hand who is going to do what and, if there are lots of you, taking it in turns.
I'll be flagging this weekend with the other 6 flag marshals on my post

[numbersix]

Originally Posted by White flag man

But that's the problems with meetings, like the BTCC meeting at Brands Hatch this weekend, when they'll porbably be 20 incidents marshals per post. Its all about deciding before hand who is going to do what and, if there are lots of you, taking it in turns.
I'll be flagging this weekend with the other 6 flag marshals on my post

Quite popular is it, then?

[Bodysnatcher]

Originally Posted by White flag man

But that's the problems with meetings, like the BTCC meeting at Brands Hatch this weekend, when they'll porbably be 20 incidents marshals per post.

but from what I heard post chiefs in short supply
Looks like some of you flaggies or IOs will have to act up No problem for some, I seem to remember one of my flaggies from the last BTCC spent a lot of time doing just that.

[TwoSheds]

Originally Posted by White flag man

I'll be flagging this weekend with the other 6 flag marshals on my post

You may have posted that in jest, but many years ago at a BTCC meeting there really were 6 flaggies on one post (Post 3 Brands Hatch in the old days when we had a raised platform and no big debris fence). We split into two teams of three and rotated teams as well as flag duties).

[Woolley]

Can't see the point. It's not as if BTCC take any notice of the flags. Maybe if you all waved them at once...



Sorry, back to topic.