2011 Star Mazda / F2000 / Skip Barber season

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Depends on your perspective, I suppose. To me, this is not so much about specific developments in feeder series competition as it is the potential effect on the IndyCar Series.

Financial support and sanctioning is expected to come from IndyCar, so potential allocation of resources is relevant. I have been a proponent of establishing a top prize for Indy Lights, so that progression up the ladder has a more direct cause and effect.

Yes, if "developmental" series exist or are considered "ladder" series, the support should really leak down from the irl rather than expecting the ladder series to subsidize champions into another series it might not own or have anything to do with.

Instead the thinking has been ass backwards with expecting the ladder series to fund everything.

If the irl considers it in their best interest to grow new drivers based on merit, then it has to take a more proactive approach, something beyond just calling something "the road to indy".

However in the financial state of the irl, doubtful that will happen and the business model for teams has changed. Rather than teams being able to seek proper commercial sponsorship and then hire drivers on merit, teams are just service providers now that if you pay you get to play. So now it's a series of unknowns the fans could care less about and the circle of apathy and downward spiral continues.

[JagtechOhio]

Junior categories are viewed as developmental series by every kid who can convince has Dad to pay for the ride. IndyCar didn't invent that plan, now or before. Well, maybe Dave Wietzenhoff is the exception....

But your post is relevant, since it doesn't speak to the point I raised. Instead, you deflect and criticize obvious side issues.

Thanks for the confirmation.

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

Mazda markets themselves in motor sport here in the USA and part of their strategy involves supporting club and semi pro racing with NASA, SCCA, Rally America and IMSA.

Not to mention karting. Randy Bernard has an eye on that.

[Morris Dancer]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

Yes, if "developmental" series exist or are considered "ladder" series, the support should really leak down from the irl rather than expecting the ladder series to subsidize champions into another series it might not own or have anything to do with.

Instead the thinking has been ass backwards with expecting the ladder series to fund everything.

If the irl considers it in their best interest to grow new drivers based on merit, then it has to take a more proactive approach, something beyond just calling something "the road to indy".

However in the financial state of the irl, doubtful that will happen and the business model for teams has changed. Rather than teams being able to seek proper commercial sponsorship and then hire drivers on merit, teams are just service providers now that if you pay you get to play. So now it's a series of unknowns the fans could care less about and the circle of apathy and downward spiral continues.

Since you obviously know all about IndyCar's financials, please enlighten us whether these frontrunning IndyCar drivers bought their rides: Dario Franchitti, Scott Dixon, Will Power, Ryan Briscoe & Helio Castroneves.

[icemachine]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

Since you obviously know all about IndyCar's financials, please enlighten us whether these frontrunning IndyCar drivers bought their rides: Dario Franchitti, Scott Dixon, Will Power, Ryan Briscoe & Helio Castroneves.

Dario - Went up European series, Came to CART in 1997 as a Mercedes signed driver

Scott - Had a number of investors who bought shares in the driver to fund his career down under & then Lights, until he won Indy Lights with PacWest which then graduated him to their CART team in 2001

Will - Drove in various Euro series until signed to Team Australia in Champ in 2005

Ryan - Moved through various Euro series becoming Toyota's 3rd driver before signing with Chip in 2005

Helio - Karting, British F3 with Paul Stewart and Tasman in Lights in 1995

None of your leading drivers took part in the American junior formula except Lights. Most of them came up when sponsorship was more readily available and Open Wheel racing on OTA TV was a Sunday afternoon staple.

Will & Ryan came a bit later to the party but neither of them raced in American junior series, they made their mark in Europe before coming to American top level racing.

[JagtechOhio]

Justin Wilson, Dan Wheldon and Tony Kanaan would all fit into the same general categories (if I am getting the point).

[ptclaus98]

And the Indy Lights they took part in was basically F3000. AKA much better than anything we've had in the States, including Atlantics and Super Vee.

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

Since you obviously know all about IndyCar's financials, please enlighten us whether these frontrunning IndyCar drivers bought their rides: Dario Franchitti, Scott Dixon, Will Power, Ryan Briscoe & Helio Castroneves.

Initially they all bought rides when entering open wheel racing in the USA, backed either by investors, manufacturers or a combination of sponsors, some didn't pay full rack rate but brought something to the table.

Ganassi and Penske can afford to hire drivers outright, but most other teams cannot or if they can it's at a small wage. It's not like 15 years ago when prize money was good and sponsorship plentiful and teams down the order could hire who they wanted. The irl hardly has any prize money anymore except for indy.

[icemachine]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

Initially they all bought rides when entering open wheel racing in the USA, backed either by investors, manufacturers or a combination of sponsors, some didn't pay full rack rate but brought something to the table.

Ganassi and Penske can afford to hire drivers outright, but most other teams cannot or if they can it's at a small wage. It's not like 15 years ago when prize money was good and sponsorship plentiful and teams down the order could hire who they wanted. The irl hardly has any prize money anymore except for indy.

Paul Tracy reportedly won't touch the earnings he socked away during CART's heyday to buy a ride. He only drives when he can get a sponsor that pays for the car and anything over that is his payday. This is an example of how drivers without contracts have to think about Indycar

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by icemachine

Paul Tracy reportedly won't touch the earnings he socked away during CART's heyday to buy a ride. He only drives when he can get a sponsor that pays for the car and anything over that is his payday. This is an example of how drivers without contracts have to think about Indycar

the irl has almost solely become a pay driver racing series. It doesn't have the commercial clout anymore to sustain "regular" sponsors.

As a driver, no question at some point in your career you'll need the backing of a manufacturer, patron, sponsor or your own money to keep your career moving up the ladder. But healthy series like F1 and Nascar, once you have demonstrated talent there is a possibility to get paid to drive.

the irl on the other hand has lost what existed 15 years ago when CART was a pro series.

So again how does that related to the ladder? Well if you start at the bottom and work your way through "the road to indy", you've invested heaps of time and money to make that happen. However, upon getting to indycar you are again likely going to be asked to continue to write checks ad nauseum.

Therefore, as drivers have been doing, divert over to the nascar or F1 ladder. At least you have a shot at recouping your time and investment. My advice to any driver that wants a real career, either go to europe or start racing stock cars.

[JagtechOhio]

Aren't there forums for that kind of stuff? Think of all those aspiring young professionals you could be enlightening.

[gomick]

NASCAR driver Mark Martin's #5 Chevy will have Quaker State sponsorship in 2011 - thats a good old CART/Indy Car sponsor there that never came back to the series....

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Skip Barber. Each national champion gets a USF2000 seat the next season.

Skip Barber to Star Mazda is too big a step, moreso if drivers are encouraged to stay just one year in each.

Conor Daly came 3rd in his "rookie year" of Star Mazda after winning Skip Barber...

[NaBUru38]

I'm not saying that drivers can't be good in one year, just that it would be better if they stayed in each step two full seasons.

[JagtechOhio]

Randy Bernard did a one hour interview tonight. Relevant to this thread:

He mentioned the award for the F2000 winner to fund a Star Mazda ride, but no Star Mazda award to get the champion into lights. Slightly sour tone to the comment, in my opinion.

Bernard is trying to raise funding for a "scholarship" to be awarded to the Indy Lights champion to help get an IndyCar ride. Vernay will get a check, if Bernard finds the money. That would be the gold ring.

Conor Daly will be testing a lights car.

A "scholarship" will be awarded to the USAC driver who wins the combined championship of Sprint/ Silver Crown/ Midget series. The money will be dedicated to put either Brian Clauson or Levy Jones in an IndyLights seat, with a well-established team, for all of the oval races in the Lights 2011 season.

"Experts" will select the team for whoever wins the scholarship. There will also be commercials and online videos to promote the program.

These steps are being taken to regain a foothold with the "Americana" audience, and promote American drivers.

[Chalk one up for Robin Miller.]

[JagtechOhio]

Well I don't know jack about feeder series, but Bernard doesn't seem to know all the details either.

This says Conor Daley scored $1.5M in valuable cash and prizes for winning the championship:

http://www.nationalspeedsportnews.co...y-lights-test/

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by JagtechOhio

Well I don't know jack about feeder series, but Bernard doesn't seem to know all the details either.

This says Conor Daley scored $1.5M in valuable cash and prizes for winning the championship:

http://www.nationalspeedsportnews.co...y-lights-test/

$1.5 million is the total sum value of ALL of the prizes given out in Star Mazda, not what Conor Daly got. Daly gets $100k and an indy lights test worth $12K plus a Mazda backed Grand Am drive if he wants it.

http://www.eformulacarnews.com/news_info.php?n=7856
http://www.indycar.com/news/show/56-...ion-in-prizes/
http://www.starmazda.com/news/series...%20Release.pdf

[JagtechOhio]

So now I know a little jack, and Conor Daly isn't getting enough of it.

And why Bernard doesn't talk about the Mazda subsidy in glowing terms.

[Morris Dancer]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

the irl has almost solely become a pay driver racing series. It doesn't have the commercial clout anymore to sustain "regular" sponsors.

As a driver, no question at some point in your career you'll need the backing of a manufacturer, patron, sponsor or your own money to keep your career moving up the ladder. But healthy series like F1 and Nascar, once you have demonstrated talent there is a possibility to get paid to drive.

the irl on the other hand has lost what existed 15 years ago when CART was a pro series.

So again how does that related to the ladder? Well if you start at the bottom and work your way through "the road to indy", you've invested heaps of time and money to make that happen. However, upon getting to indycar you are again likely going to be asked to continue to write checks ad nauseum.

Therefore, as drivers have been doing, divert over to the nascar or F1 ladder. At least you have a shot at recouping your time and investment. My advice to any driver that wants a real career, either go to europe or start racing stock cars.

The 'Road to Indy' is a lot more attractive financially than most European 'entry', 'development' and 'feeder' championships. Barber and USF2000's next-level scholarship drives and Star Mazda's end-of-series prize fund have already been mentioned, and Indy Lights has fairly decent round-by-round prizemoney.

By contrast, most comparable European championships, such as British FF and F3, have little more than trophies and bottles of bubbly. Some, like F2 and FR2.0, have end-of-season tests, but that's about it.

And F1 still has its share of pay drivers, not just in the tail-end teams but in some of the midfield ones too, as today's report in autosport.com shows.

There will always be pay drivers in motorsport, but the exceptionally talented ones can carve out a career if they have a professional attitude and the determination to stick at it through thick and thin.

[NaBUru38]

2010 Williams F1 driver Nicolas Hülkenberg said he won't find a financial backer to find an F1 seat in 2011. That meas he probably won't get any.

[ptclaus98]

which means he won't have a ride.

[NaBUru38]

a => a

You are genius!!!

That's because mid-pack F1 teams also need serious backing. Actually, F1 is much more expensive than IndyCar. So drivers with deep pockets will usually have an edge. Checo Pérez and Pastor Maldonado are very good and deserve to be in F1, but it's Telmex and PDVSA giving them the final push to their F1 seats over others.

[NaBUru38]

2011 F2000 / F1600 Championship Series calendar:

April 8-10 - Virginia (with vintages)
May 6-7 - Road Atlanta (with Formula Drift; F2000 only)
June 3-5 - Watkins Glen (with Grand-Am)
June 30-July 2 - Mid-Ohio
July 22-24 - Mosport (with ALMS; F2000 only)
September 16-17 - Lime Rock (with Nascar Modifieds)
October 14-16 - Watkins Glen (with vintages)

All dates are double-headers for both championships. This new F1600CS is for SCCA Formula F cars.

[NaBUru38]

2011 Star Mazda calendar:

March 27 - St. Pete (IndyCar)
April - TBA
May 28 - Indianapolis (IndyCar)
June 19 - Milwaukee (IndyCar)
June 25 - Iowa (IndyCar)
July 23 - Mosport (ALMS)
August 7 - Trois-Rivières (NASCAR Canada)
August 27 - Sears Point (IndyCar)
September 4 - Baltimore (IndyCar / ALMS)
September 17 - Laguna Seca (ALMS)

Three ovals! That's good news! On the other hand, losing Sebring (12 Hours) and Road Atlanta (Petit Le Mans) is logical but sad, since they attract top teams and sponsors from around the world.

I'm truly surprised by the lack of any Mazda weekend.

There doesn't seem to be time for another class in Long Beach (IndyCar, ALMS, SCCA World Challenge, Toyota All-Star), and it's sponsored by Toyota. And Honda backs the IndyCar / Grand-Am race at Barber. What else could the April date be?

[NaBUru38]

The USF2000 race at Autobahn has been dropped and won't be replaced. So it's Sebring, St. Pete, Indy, Milwaukee, Mid-Ohio, Road America and Baltimore.

[Tim Northcutt]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

2011 Star Mazda calendar:

March 27 - St. Pete (IndyCar)
April - TBA
May 28 - Indianapolis (IndyCar)
June 19 - Milwaukee (IndyCar)
June 25 - Iowa (IndyCar)
July 23 - Mosport (ALMS)
August 7 - Trois-Rivières (NASCAR Canada)
August 27 - Sears Point (IndyCar)
September 4 - Baltimore (IndyCar / ALMS)
September 17 - Laguna Seca (ALMS)

Three ovals! That's good news! On the other hand, losing Sebring (12 Hours) and Road Atlanta (Petit Le Mans) is logical but sad, since they attract top teams and sponsors from around the world.

I'm truly surprised by the lack of any Mazda weekend.

There doesn't seem to be time for another class in Long Beach (IndyCar, ALMS, SCCA World Challenge, Toyota All-Star), and it's sponsored by Toyota. And Honda backs the IndyCar / Grand-Am race at Barber. What else could the April date be?

Side Note:

The May 28 date in Indy is at Raceway Park...the 5/8 mile oval that is a few miles west of IMS.

USF2000 and USAC Midgets also will race...this is the new edition of annual "Night Before the 500" program at O'Reily Raceway Park that has been a tradition for decades.