What are your opinions about sportscar racing???

[Francesco]

i like LMS and ALMS more than FIA for sure, you have so many "battles" in those series! just look at the past years... FIA is becoming too much "sprint" and the entry lists are not as interesting as the one of the other 2 champs

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by Danske

Fastest race laps:

Mid-Ohio:
GT1: 1:18.873
DP:1:20.711
GT2:1:22.720

Miller:
GT1: 2:36.650
DP: 2:39.006
GT2: 2:44.403

Noticed you did not put the LMP1 or LMP2 times. The DP cars are not or would not be ( unfortunitly) competive inthe LMS or ALMS in P1 pr P2.

Glad some one looked it up

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by JAG

Motors TV

ALMS and LMS are usually live if there are no scheduling conflicts, otherwise, same day, full, ALMS coverage, and 3 hour LMS highlights.

Le Mans, every session and scrutineering live.

1 hour FIA GT Highlights
1 hour FIA GT3 Highlights


Bravo/Player

Live coverage of FIA GT, plus highlights during the week.

That is great. Would be nice to have the scrutineering live on the western side of the Atlantic.

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by dj choc ice

for grand AM add the following "*******ised LMP cars which are slow ugly and rubbish, and a rip off of the ALMS and LMS

Yeesh, where could I start with this?

As Danske pointed out, the DPs are between GT1 and GT2 times. Up the power and they'd be between GT1 and P2. Slow? I don't think so.....

Ugly? Matter of personal opinion, but the Lister LMP is hideous, so its all a matter of taste.

[old man]

This was an interesting survey and I look forward to the final figures but think one topic was missed. I have been to all the series mentioned (sadly just one ALMS race) and regret that at FIA GT and LMS the general public are very badly served. The circuit commentary cannot be heard because of the beautiful noise of the cars and unless you have a radio to tune to it you have no way of knowing who is leading, who is chasing, what class battles are going on and so on. If you get into a pit garage the timing screen tells all but they don't want spectators in there of course. To watch on TV and tune the lap top to Live Timing is the best way way of watching, I shall do that for Adria. Why doesn't SRO or the other organisers provide real spectator info such as I saw at my one ALMS race using a palm computer screen?

[Svierge]

Originally Posted by Danske

That is an absolute, flat-out lie.

Fastest race laps:

Mid-Ohio:
GT1: 1:18.873
DP:1:20.711
GT2:1:22.720

Miller:
GT1: 2:36.650
DP: 2:39.006
GT2: 2:44.403

It'd be interesting to put DP cars on proper tyres, rather than those truly awful Hoosiers. They'd certainly be up to GT1 pace, which is pretty quick really.

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by Svierge

It'd be interesting to put DP cars on proper tyres, rather than those truly awful Hoosiers. They'd certainly be up to GT1 pace, which is pretty quick really.

The Hoosier Grand Am tires are a 'spec' tire ( tyre ) and yes a Mich, Dunlap or GY P1 or P2 tire would make a big differene.

The DP engines are still under powered compared to the P1 AERs or a P2 Courage. But given a proper power plant, diffent tires those DP cars could be great independent team cars. Maybe 'relativley' affordable too.

[Supercar]

I am mostly ignoring the ALMS forum because of the constant bickering of Grand Am. It is not my favorite series, and I rarely watch it, but it just makes me sick that otherwise normal guys at that forum turn into some kind of Sportscar Fascists when someone mentions Grand Am. They think that ACO cars are the only "proper prototypes" and only they have the right to exist, and others who do not share their beliefs should just elect to kill themselves for the good of all of us.

Then there are those Sportscar Nazis on the Grand Am forum who think that ALMS/LMES/Le Mans racers sold their souls the French and therefore should be shot for treason. What a bunch of bull.

I did not even know until today that there were sportscar fans in the rest of the world who cared or cheered for one or the other side. Face it guys, most of your favorite pro drivers race in both series. So get a life first, it will help you with your blood pressure, and then enjoy the sport.

[chocmonster7]

Something which has always puzzled me is why die hard ALMS only fans always insist on using childish insults & nicknames (Grand-sham, prototurtle, etc.) when non ALMS fans don't (you ever hear an insulting version of ALMS?).

I agree with your last point though - I will always cheer for Stefan Johansson whatever he drives and this year he's been on both sides of the fence!

[Truckosaurus]

Originally Posted by Supercar

...constant bickering ...otherwise normal guys ... Sportscar Fascists... "proper prototypes" ...just elect to kill themselves for the good of all of us. ...sold their souls the French and therefore should be shot for treason....most of your favorite pro drivers race in both series.
So get a life first, it will help you with your blood pressure, and then enjoy the sport.

An excellent Post. Whilst we might each have our favourite series, there's no need to be so anti other forms of endurance racing.

I'm no expert of things the other side of the pond, but are the ALMS and Grand-Am rearly competitors? Or, could both series co-exist and bring new blood into American Endurance Racing as a whole, the Grand-Am should bring in new drivers, teams and fans from the NASCAR community and ALMS bring in 'foriegners'

[Nick49]

Hello

Yes, I've got to agree

Supercar I am mostly ignoring the ALMS forum because of the constant bickering of Grand Am. It is not my favorite series, and I rarely watch it, but it just makes me sick that otherwise normal guys at that forum turn into some kind of Sportscar Fascists when someone mentions Grand Am. They think that ACO cars are the only "proper prototypes" and only they have the right to exist, and others who do not share their beliefs should just elect to kill themselves for the good of all of us.

Then there are those Sportscar Nazis on the Grand Am forum who think that ALMS/LMES/Le Mans racers sold their souls the French and therefore should be shot for treason. What a bunch of bull.

I did not even know until today that there were sportscar fans in the rest of the world who cared or cheered for one or the other side. Face it guys, most of your favorite pro drivers race in both series. So get a life first, it will help you with your blood pressure, and then enjoy the sport.

I enjoy all sorts of sportscar racing whether its LMS, ALMS, FIA GT, Belcar, Dutch supercar or whatever. I have my favourite, which just happens to be LMS because of the number of cars racing at each event and the proper (in my eyes) endurance format. But life exists outside of LMS and Le Mans or else we would all end up like those people who have absolutely no idea that motor racing isn't just Formula One.

And whats more we get far far more television coverage than we ever did when my all time favourite, Group C, was around.

You can't beat a good rant first thing in the morning.

Nick

[mirkob]

Now we decided to close the surveys (Italian and International)

The results are here :

http://www.racingworld.it/fiagt/noti...?idtitolo=2668

I know tha page layout and the quality of the graphs are bad, please give me more time to fix the problems .

In a few days we will upload an official document (PDF file).

Thanks to all (and to ten-tenths forum) for the appreciated HELP

[paul-collins]

Supercar, can't say I agree with you (or the others who piled on) about the bickering, as it's largely been eliminated. Sure, you get an occasional post, but I think you'll find that the ALMS forum much less antagonistic than you remember.

Oh, and choc, it's disingenious to say that one side uses childish insults while the other is angelic. Simply not true. Both sides of that particular war have their children, and it's grossly unfair to paint the entire group of fans with the comments of those particular silly people (and, yes, dj choc ice, I'm including you here). Fortunately most of their idiocy has been cut down, now.

[mirkob]

The results page was fixed;
now we are waiting your comments about these results.

Thanks again

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by Supercar

Face it guys, most of your favorite pro drivers race in both series. So get a life first, it will help you with your blood pressure, and then enjoy the sport.

You do not like their attitudes, so you tell them to "get a life", my, my isn't that a condescending attitude.

If you knew anything of the manner in which the France family functions, you would know why - some - have a great distaste for the Grand Am.

The language used can bury some's messages, but their attitude is generally forgivable as the Grand-AM exists for the good of the France boys, period.

Of course then if one is into NASCAR inspired hero worship, Grand-Am is just the thing for the one.

Bob

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by Bob Riebe

If you knew anything of the manner in which the France family functions, you would know why - some - have a great distaste for the Grand Am.

Bob

I agree here. It is the way the France family dictates how NASCAR is run and how it spills over into Grand Am ( Owned by the France Family as well ) that many ppl have a distaine for both.

Yes many of the pro drivers race in both, have to make a living you know. Non of them will say anything bad about the other series, if they ever want to drive in that serous again.

[Fogelhund]

Some people like Grand American only.

Some people like the American Le Mans Series only.

Some like both.

Many like neither.

The days where people should be bashing are past. If you don't like it, leave it alone. Both series appear to be well on their way to being well established, with decent entries. They don't particularly hurt each other, though there is some competition between them. The positive is that all these drivers, manufacturers, etc have MORE jobs. Even if you don't like what the other has to offer, or anything about them, you can't deny that more people employed is a good thing.

It's time to move past, and forget the mudslinging. If you don't like one, or the other, just leave it alone, and let this die.

[JAG]

The initial 'war' between fans was because ALMS fans believed Grand-Am would destroy the ALMS.

We now see both can co-exist, even trade teams (no longer a one way track from ALMS to GA, thankfully).

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

They don't particularly hurt each other, though there is some competition between them.

The people who ran the Copper World Classic know far better than they wish, what a France controlled group can do to the once premier outlaw race in the country. It is now, dead.
The France's would destroy the IMSA in heartbeat if they could, history has shown that.
If you think battle for control is over, you are an eternal optimist.
The France's assumed that road race fans were as gullible as NASCAR fans, fortunately that has so far been a miscalculation.

The positive is that all these drivers, manufacturers, etc have MORE jobs. Even if you don't like what the other has to offer, or anything about them, you can't deny that more people employed is a good thing.

That is odd, calculating road racing with employment statistics.
If road racing has just become another business stat. it deserves to die.
The drivers; like any sports person, either they had better makes a lot of money and put it in a retirement fund, or have a day job to fall back on.
Speed shops will survive as long as cars exist and, or, machining shops are needed.

Bob

[AU N EGL]

Still waiting on the 2007 fan demographics and the TV ratings. ALMS demographics are out.

For 2006 Gand Am was not too good. This year it apears better

ALMS is doing very well and going up. Sonsors exposure is going up.

Is this going to be another CCWS and IRL conflict?? Well we hope not. CCWS and IRL will each have a few races with the ALMS. And in Aug of 2007 all three, CCWS, IRL will be at the Road America ALMS races.

and there is a way to make a small fortune in motorracing, Start with a large fortune

[tux]

the results are intresting, it is good to see what fellow fans think about sportscar racing

[JAG]

Originally Posted by AU N EGL

Still waiting on the 2007 fan demographics and the TV ratings. ALMS demographics are out.

For 2006 Gand Am was not too good. This year it apears better

ALMS is doing very well and going up. Sonsors exposure is going up.

Is this going to be another CCWS and IRL conflict?? Well we hope not. CCWS and IRL will each have a few races with the ALMS. And in Aug of 2007 all three, CCWS, IRL will be at the Road America ALMS races.

and there is a way to make a small fortune in motorracing, Start with a large fortune

For the life of me I don't understand why the US cannot support IRL, CCWS, GA and ALMS.

I realise theres NACAR to deal with, but even so, Europe has F1, A1GP, GP2, WRC, LMS, FIA GT, WTCC, DTM, BTCC, and countless high level national series.

[AU N EGL]

Originally Posted by JAG

For the life of me I don't understand why the US cannot support IRL, CCWS, GA and ALMS.

GOOD Questions. Maybe it is we have American Football, Basketball, Baseball and Hockey to support too. But who knows?????

NASCAR has the Nextel Cup, Bushe, Craftsman Truck, all national, then ARCA, Bushe North, Bushe West, Hooters Cup plus who knows how many more regional Stock car series.

[Bob Riebe]

Originally Posted by JAG

For the life of me I don't understand why the US cannot support IRL, CCWS, GA and ALMS.

I realise theres NACAR to deal with, but even so, Europe has F1, A1GP, GP2, WRC, LMS, FIA GT, WTCC, DTM, BTCC, and countless high level national series.

Main reason, sanctions used to sanction; promoters-promoted; racers-raced.

The first of the three has forgotten its proper place, and fouled the the other two.

Depending what decade periods one looks at, there used to be four mostly equal stock car sanctions; USAC, SCCA and then IMSA professional road racing;four drag racing santions of various sizes; lastly open wheel series from Indy cars, down to midgets of varying scopes.
This does not include what are called special races, or outlaw races of all sorts.
Of the eleven non-open wheel numbered above, there are now, for practical purposes, five.

Of the above, while drag racing and short track ovals are not really hurting, the number of drag strips and 1/2 mile or larger ovals gone, if one really looks, is staggering.
Bull rings, tracks of less than 1/2 mile have stayed the same, or increased, partly because some larger tracks have been reduced, due to some bizarre insurance edict (or so I am told) that makes insuring tracks of 1/2 mile or more outrageously expensive.

Racing in the US used to be about building the fastest, quickest and bestest.
Now it is about dealing with arrogant, egotistic rules makers, instead of trying to build a better car.
Bob

[Supercar]

And here they came. But isn't it brilliant how this forum has an "ignore user" feature?! All you have to do is go to that user's profile and click on "Add this guy to Your Ignore List". Works like a miracle. After clicking a couple of times this thread is now suddenly sparkling clean!