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19 Dec 2011, 17:02 (Ref:3001925) | #26 | ||
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Quote:
p.s id be suprised if the system was changed now with massive cost to the msa, even if we suggest the best ideas in the world and the cards get changed itd be a crying shame if all the books we have now or the same on es we are going to get for the 2013 season would go in the bins at training day because of misprints, its going to stay like this for years, maybe with loads of odd pieces of plain a4 added in for good measure! |
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19 Dec 2011, 17:17 (Ref:3001929) | #27 | ||
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Posts: 372
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I fully agree that it is impracticable to back-track now! Perhaps the new system should be been subjected to wider consultation before being implemented.
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Caterham Academy 2006, Roadsport B 2007 |
19 Dec 2011, 17:42 (Ref:3001941) | #28 | ||
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Quote:
though saying that i like many others appreciate the work Chris H and co. is surely doing everything in his power pulling the strings to make this system work. i think its a good book which i received this morning, saying that though im only a track grade marshal! |
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19 Dec 2011, 17:43 (Ref:3001942) | #29 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 199
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Just received mine.......all i can say is.......Great job to MSA!, VERY PROFESSIONAL, NICE LAYOUT, FAR MORE SUITED TO THE JOB THAN THE OLD CARD!....Ill shut up now................
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Life is a hell of a ride!........if it aint your doing it wrong.... |
19 Dec 2011, 18:13 (Ref:3001949) | #30 | ||
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 106
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I know that a lot of work has gone into the new PRC but just one little quibble - in the section for track to experienced track the space for comments is only 4mm x 49mm. (& I had to put on my reading glasses to measure it!) I know we have some fantastically talented, dedicated & supportive post chiefs out there but I'm not sure that's room for anything, even on an uneventful day.
I think I may photocopy page 6 and reprint at A5 size (the PRC is A6) so there is space for me to pre-fill all the boring bits and room for actual comments. |
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19 Dec 2011, 18:40 (Ref:3001956) | #31 | ||
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Join Date: Jul 2007
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Just received the new PRC
On the whole I think it is very good. it makes clear the Upgrade path and I like that the comments are actually associated directly with the actual day recorded (though the box is perhaps a bit small for many meaningful comments?) - this makes utter sense to me. It also looks professional and is nicely finished. I really like the plastic card (shame the photo is awful in my case) Like most on here my quibble is that there is nowhere to record attendance sigs that are not directly related to upgrade (for those of us that want to wait a couple of years and do many more meetings than the requirement for upgrade - which I believe to be the "norm" in marshaling circles). However I understand that there will be a "continuation sheet" online that you can download and print? Chris (H) can you let us know where that will be? I guess the other option has already been mentioned on here, which is to produce your own on Excel or similar to do the same. Presumably it would be OK to ask a PC or Acting PC to sign a home made form like that? I absolutely applaud the attempt to address some of the issues - and I think this goes someway to doing so - so well done those who actually spent their time doing this. Thank you. However, constructive critisism - Personally I still think the number of required sigs between Marshal and Experienced Marshal is still too low, going from 15 to 18. My belief is that it should be nearer 30 or perhaps even more. Also as someone else has said - I don't really think there was enough consultation with the guys on the ground - I believe this should have been driven from the bottom up, not the other way around. Still, a big thank you to those who have given up their own time trying to fix it. |
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19 Dec 2011, 22:28 (Ref:3002024) | #32 | |
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If you're not collecting signatures for an upgrade surely it doesn't matter which section of the booklet is filled in. There are plenty of sections that don't have a duty prefilled that can be used.
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20 Dec 2011, 07:22 (Ref:3002122) | #33 | ||
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20 Dec 2011, 07:34 (Ref:3002128) | #34 | |
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as good as it is slowing the progress of signature chasers i believe 30 would be too much a shock to the system and would put some off from progressing as a route to the top would be too long and dragged out! which is what we want but anyway the new requirement is just right, thankfully the grading scheme is easier to change than the books. in the years to come, the new scheme will hopefully in time have people warm to it and maybe we'll be happy with it one day!
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20 Dec 2011, 13:09 (Ref:3002215) | #35 | |||
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Quote:
Quite a lot of marshalling in this country goes on at venues which aren't the major circuits. If this is a genuine suggestion and goes ahead I'm sure plans are in place to cover all of those autograss, sprint, rally stages, etc, etc? |
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20 Dec 2011, 13:53 (Ref:3002230) | #36 | ||
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Join Date: Sep 2004
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Let me bring a modicum of fact to this discussion on bar codes.
The technology now exists to enable the use of bar code readers at sign on, with a bar code printed on the marshals' plastic registration card. However - this is only at discussion stage at present. As far as I am aware, no plans have yet been put in place for a project to deliver this to the venues. The hope is that it will be cheap and portable enough to be used at all venues for all types of motorsport. I would envisage a trial or pilot will be carried out first and then rolled out depending on the results. Timescale? Nothing set yet, but don't expect anything before end 2013 - we need to get the plastic registration cards correct and in full use first. So please do not start having bar codes tattooed on your backsides (or anywhere else) yet! Let's allow the MSA to walk before they try to run! |
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20 Dec 2011, 15:25 (Ref:3002270) | #37 | |||
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Quote:
As for the new PRCs - still waiting for mine so can't comment! |
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I used to be with it, until they changed what it is. Now what I'm with is no longer it. |
20 Dec 2011, 17:32 (Ref:3002332) | #38 | |
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In my opinion, 30 days is about right for those who are actively seeking upgrades (will enforce a longer time period = more experience) and actually, for those who 'upgrade by accident' (i.e. just go along to marshal, and then find that well, they have 30 days and may as well upgrade)
For those who have no interest in upgrading, then whether it is 20, 25, 30 or even 100, it makes no difference. |
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20 Dec 2011, 18:00 (Ref:3002346) | #39 | ||
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20 Dec 2011, 18:06 (Ref:3002348) | #40 | ||
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It can also work out at little more than 10 weeks. I did 5 3-day meetings in a row this year.
Time period aside, 30 days can basically be done in 10 meetings, whether it's back to back, or across 3 or 4 seasons. As I've previously said to Chris, IMHO, this is not enough. I did upwards of 80 days, before I was comfortable in going for Experienced, and I don't consider myself to be a slow learner. Even now, with hindsight and a further 100+ days experience, I'm not entirely convinced that I didn't rush it a little, for the sake of. While I imagine the assessment is more rigorous, in principle, someone in my position, could quite probably have gone for PC by now if they were so inclined to "badge chase" |
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"Sometimes, I just want to tell them 'it's not a race!'" - Guinness2702 |
20 Dec 2011, 18:24 (Ref:3002356) | #41 | ||
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Well said Chris
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20 Dec 2011, 19:14 (Ref:3002377) | #42 | ||
Rookie
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 94
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I think the small increase in days required should be welcomed before being eligible for seeking an upgrade. If people think they have the right experience and knowledge for an upgrade after the minimum of events then surely the actual assessment should identify those who are ready or those who may benefit from a few more meetings at their current level. Could it be that the actual number of events will always be a red herring and the important issue is whether the individual is thoroughly assessed to see whether they meet the higher criteria regardless of doing 10, 15 or 50 days at their current level. Some will be capable after the minimum whilst some may not even after doing 50. Just a thought...... and retreats to a sensible distance.
In reality my experiences from colleagues going for upgrades this year is that the minimum number of events is only a guide with the majority seeking an upgrade after doing around double the events. Can I also add my thanks to all those who work hard and give up their time to help our lot as marshals. |
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20 Dec 2011, 20:13 (Ref:3002406) | #43 | |||
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Quote:
unless of course we went to retina scans or fingerprint recognition instead of individual signatures |
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Richard J |
20 Dec 2011, 23:08 (Ref:3002475) | #44 | |||
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Quote:
Tattooing it in other places can have the opposite problem |
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21 Dec 2011, 08:39 (Ref:3002557) | #45 | ||
Pie On 'ere
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Why is there no such thing as cat-flavored dog food? |
21 Dec 2011, 08:50 (Ref:3002561) | #46 | ||
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Barcodes are of course increasingly an obsolescent technology.
Subcutaneous RFID anyone? |
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Paul Norris |
21 Dec 2011, 09:56 (Ref:3002589) | #47 | |
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<weak TV reference>
with all this talk of numbers and barcodes instead of names, I am surprised that Numbersix hasnt run around shouting "I am *not* a number" </weak TV reference> Carry on....nothing to see here... |
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21 Dec 2011, 11:03 (Ref:3002613) | #48 | |
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21 Dec 2011, 11:10 (Ref:3002615) | #49 | |
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21 Dec 2011, 11:21 (Ref:3002623) | #50 | ||
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The sort of identity chip that's used with pets.
I jest (no really, I'm not serious here) |
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Paul Norris |
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