FIA Announce 2013 F1 Entry List

[Bononi]

Originally Posted by bella

luck happens regardless of what pants you're wearing. i mean, seriously... you have to be pretty deluded to believe that a driver in another car will act differently because he subconsciously is aware of the secret fact that the guy in the other car is wearing lucky pants. or that a tyre won't pick up a puncture through the debris because the driver got in the car from the left side.

Exactly, but you know how they think, it happened that way because they have their lucky charm...

[bella]

Originally Posted by Bononi

Exactly, but you know how they think, it happened that way because they have their lucky charm...

being serious for a moment, if that's what they use as a trigger for their "race face" or focus, then so be it. but it's more than a bit unstable to do so without recognising that it's only an action or object to start the focussing process off. if the number 13 was really that unlucky you'd expect cars in 13th to retire in succession, one after another

[Bononi]

Indeed, no surprises if FIA jumps the 13th position in the race to be sure nothing happens...

[bella]

or offers bonus points for 13th position survivors

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by Ostrogothicus

What happens when two drivers have the same number?
There's only 99 possible two-digit numbers to choose from, surely in the F3 championships around the world there's more than 99 drivers?

That's easy: drivers would pick alternate numbers.

Originally Posted by Ostrogothicus

But 13 is 'lucky-for-some'.

Like me! I hate number 7 - my programs rarely have 7 in constant numbers. I prefer 1, 3, 5 and 8.

[numbersix]

Actually there's a fair degree of evidence showing that a positive mental mindset not only affects your own individual performance but also has an effect on machines near you.

A 20 year study carried out at Princeton University involving millions of experiments by students trying to affect a random number machine by thought alone, shows a significant statistical shift.

It seems scientifically accurate that not any can a driver's personal performance be enhanced by his belief in good (or bad) luck, but also the car itself.

Strange but true.

(Fade out to spooky music...)

[Mr V]

Can a drivers belief in good luck stop another from driving into the side of him?

[numbersix]

Originally Posted by Mr V

Can a drivers belief in good luck stop another from driving into the side of him?

Technically, yes. But it's more a question of statistics, not absolutes. Believing I will throw a six with a die will probably not produce a six in a one-off event. But over time, and a large number of throws, the number six will show up more than one sixth of the time, and with a greater variation than that due to chance. And this result is a direct cause in the belief this result will happen.

So, the answer to your question is no, but the probabilty of another driver T-boning him is slightly reduced.

In a sport such as F1, where thousanths of a second make a huge difference, if I was team principal of Red Bull I would positively encourage Vettel to bring his lucky teddy bear along. Perhaps he does!

[fourWheelDrift]

Originally Posted by numbersix

Technically, yes. But it's more a question of statistics, not absolutes. Believing I will throw a six with a die will probably not produce a six in a one-off event. But over time, and a large number of throws, the number six will show up more than one sixth of the time, and with a greater variation than that due to chance. And this result is a direct cause in the belief this result will happen.

I don't know why I am bothering to get involved but guys this is poppycock. The posts suggesting that superstitions can help drivers are equally obviously correct simply because If you think it will help or if it makes you more comfortable and relaxed it clearly will influence your confidence, attitude and behaviour.

Have a look at Ben Goldacre's article on the Golden Arse Beam effect which explains why superstitions can influence performance even though neither they, nor the "power of thought" can make one iota of difference to genuinely chance events.

http://www.badscience.net/2011/07/th...hod/#more-2485

If you want to know why people can find evidence for such an effect even though it isn't real look up statistical tests and null hypothesis then publication bias and you will have the answer. Alternatively ask Schummy

[bella]

Originally Posted by numbersix

Actually there's a fair degree of evidence showing that a positive mental mindset not only affects your own individual performance but also has an effect on machines near you.

A 20 year study carried out at Princeton University involving millions of experiments by students trying to affect a random number machine by thought alone, shows a significant statistical shift.

It seems scientifically accurate that not any can a driver's personal performance be enhanced by his belief in good (or bad) luck, but also the car itself.

Strange but true.

(Fade out to spooky music...)

i think that's whats known as a scientific proof of a religious or spiritual belief. in many religions, prayer is used to ask for good results in exams or a good outcome for a sick relative for example. that's reinforcing a wish for the outcome. in less god and prayer focussed faiths, the belief that the outcome will be the best one, or the one that's meant to happen results in the same kind of faith (though i think that depends exactly how its directed and the believers self-belief). it could be argued that without a specific outcome to fight for, the person achieves less but i don't think that's the case.

affecting the outcome of a random number is one thing, but a race with millions of potential outcomes is far more interesting. if you've ever had a "if i'd have left 5 minutes earlier like i meant to instead of *insert random task here*, i'd have been caught up in that accident on the motorway" moment, you'll get it. a belief in luck could be described as being similar to having an open mind, or a state of meditation - it's a faith that stops irrational thoughts and aggression from building up and interfering. it keeps the ego out of the way - to put it into buddhist terms. arrogance and desperation or insecurity are products of the ego, and as such get in the way.

ergo luck and faith are "clean" types of belief, though in the same way i personally disagree with the organised religions that go by a book, i disagree with the luck concept. it's fundamentally unstable to focus all your achievements and goals on a single item or concept. if the airline lose your lucky pants, you're still in serious bother

[HughGJohnson]

Originally Posted by numbersix

Actually there's a fair degree of evidence showing that a positive mental mindset not only affects your own individual performance but also has an effect on machines near you.

A 20 year study carried out at Princeton University involving millions of experiments by students trying to affect a random number machine by thought alone, shows a significant statistical shift.

It seems scientifically accurate that not any can a driver's personal performance be enhanced by his belief in good (or bad) luck, but also the car itself.

Strange but true.

(Fade out to spooky music...)

...so it wasn't Lewis' fault, he actually had a worse car then Jenson in the second half of the season. Though, to be fair, it would be because of his own p***y attitude. That would also explain a lot at Red Bull.

While we're on the geek trip; their are 90 positive two-digit numbers and 91 non-negative two-digit numbers (00). As 1-9 are single digit numbers. There are 101 possible combinations of numbers with a maximum of two digits. Or 110, if as with some numbers in NASCAR, you "duplicate" 1-9 by putting a zero in front of the number on a seperate car. So that you have a "one car" and an "oh-one" car, etc.

...so; by 2020 when F1 is completely green, cheap and road relevant we could have as many as 55 teams! Of course, you have to subtract all two-digit totals by one if you don't use 13, which would leave only 54 possible two car teams.

[Armco Bender]

I seem to have entered the Twilight Zone....


The announcement was a bit of a fizzer....only announced the bleeding obvious.
They may as well have announced the sun will come up tomorrow.