The R5 is built

[Kicking-back]

The R4 was apparently too hard on its tyres - so that hurt it in the race, but helped it in qualifying.

Incidentally, Webber and Jaguar's 2004 season was slightly flattered by the new points system.

After all, his best F1 result was in a Minardi, not a Jaguar.

[Mr V]

Which is why, imo, Button did the better job in 03 with 2 genuine 4th places

Hope that the Jaguar is up to scratch this year, and that Klien can take it to Webber a little (although i doubt it).

Still think BAR will have the upper hand for 5th place. Should be a good scrap for 6th between Jaguar and Toyota, but i fear that Toyota having 2 drivers more likely to get points over Jaguars 1 likely driver, might cost the green team badly.

[enemy-ace]

Originally posted by Glen
The R4 was a let-down in the races, but I agree it was impressive in qualifying - although perhaps that was the Webber effect.

While I agree that Webber is an excellent driver, I don't think a driver can put a car where it doesn't belong on pure driver skill alone. Sure maybe a few grid positions, but the inherent speed of the car must be there for a good driver to extract it.
As for BAR, they are new to the Michelin's so they may require a little time to extract the best from them. Even if the Honda engines don't grenade they (the team) may still struggle to find good race pace. I am also still not sold on Sato; I believe he's already had one pre-season shunt. Needs to be more consistent, which is something Klien has already been applauded for.
Either way, it should make for an interesting battle.

[Glen]

I think Sato has got a very hard job this year, because Button is now a very well rounded competitor. So from that point of view i agree that things are finely balanced - but on the other hand Klein (Klien?) has no experience at all.

I just don't think Jaguar have been adventurous enough - the top teams will always choose speed first and then try and find reliability.

[DriverT]

Originally posted by RWC
All the talk of budget is meaningless
The car will depend entirely on the tech director(and the ability of the team director to let him get on with it.Last years car was basic and had no stupid mistakes.they can easily do it again

Yeah it does depend upon the tech director. But budget is a very important factor. No money to develop car = no results.

[Gt_R]

Not forgetting that a bigger budget allow you to hire a better tech director?

[Mark Webber]

I think we have loss sight . Just because the Car is UNDER budget is not a bad thing it can be quite a good thing . and Why are we shooting the tech director ? because his name is not Brawn does mean his/he is useless .
Who Know how OR what the budget is set at , I say its a good start making a car for less money than plan opens more money for thing like development for example .
Jag has come out with some clear statements in the last couple of days . Yes on the face it may look like team cutting cost for life span but it could be a team with a agenda and cutting FAT away to focus more on results than looking like a wantabe F1 team . There are 2 sides to everything ie Klien's Redbull cash was reported to be $10-15 mil now is reported as 4.5 mil this now give more credit to Klien's signing consdier "THE BOSS" at less 6 mil suitcase .

I think the R5 will have race pace that the R4 showed early in 03 if not more . Every team manager has a small budget becuase all would love more . But I think its harsh at best to bag the Tech Director before the R5 has turned a wheel in anger . As some WILL look silly if the R5 is a rocket out of the box

[Glen]

Originally posted by Mark Webber
…some WILL look silly if the R5 is a rocket out of the box

As long as you're preapred to look silly if it's not!

Williams' chief designer Gavin Fisher
'You cannot stand still or relax your development pace for a single minute in Formula One,'

I just worry that Jaguar are acting like a team that know they are in their last year. I hope they aren't, but they are the only team with such a conservative attitude to innovation and advancement.

[enemy-ace]

I think Jag are still smarting from what was the debacle that was the R3. When the new management came onboard they stated that they wanted to get back to basics and be more of an engineering based team. It would appear to me (from the outside looking in) that they are heading in this direction. Parry-Jones recently stated that they were going to cut the BS and that coming in under budget on the R5 meant that they could work more on developing the R5 throughout the year. I don't think they have any illusions of winning it all in the next couple of years and are looking more into building the groundwork for a strong team in the long run.

[Mark Webber]

Originally posted by Glen
As long as you're preapred to look silly if it's not!

like enemy-ace I'm not make wild calims I'm just saying you can not bag a car before its turned a wheel in anger as you can not bag a tech director before his car has hit the road .
I agree with enemy-ace. Winning is a pipe dream at this stage foward movement is what counts at presant . I think 5th is this years goal and that maybe a streach with a big "?" over Klien's performance .
Being a progression of the R4 is a safe bet as it was a good car in general

[GTRMagic]

So whats the best race position Webber will achieve in 2004?

[Mark Webber]

who knows? how do you answer that ?
his best tracks would have to be Monaco/ Monza /and I know he is a fan of Spa as per driver preferance . But I can only hope for a podium result . But for me anything ahead of Button .
But which track will the car suit ? is just as important

[Teretonga]

IF the Jag is a better car than last year a 4th or 5th is a possibility. If its VERY good maybe a third or a 'freak' second but I wouldn't count on it. If Mark can park it in the top 5 three or four times during the year he'll be doing well.

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Teretonga
IF the Jag is a better car than last year a 4th or 5th is a possibility. If its VERY good maybe a third

Never going to happen (much to Adam and Mark [the posters] annoyance ) imo, the will struggle to get 5th off BAR, would be a miracle if the beat Renault to 4th and the world will end before they reach the dizzy heights of 3rd or above

[Mark Webber]

JAG has a shot at 5th just as much as BAR does . I think 4th/3rd are not an option for both teams . This year 5th is a hot spot I think Toyota well have a big say in 5th place
but one thing is for sure JAG v BAR is the fight to watch

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Gt_R
Not forgetting that a bigger budget allow you to hire a better tech director?

Didn't work when they tried to bag Adrain Newey

[enemy-ace]

Ron Dennis "Hey Adrian, wanna see my really BIG budget?"
Mr.Newey "Oh yes please, and can I play with your boats too?"

[Gt_R]

Jaguar is kind of fighting with a hand tied behind their back. Like it or not, budget does help you in many ways if used wisely. However, i believe that with cost cutting measures, the budget Jaguar have is suitable for them to do a decent job.

They made good improvements last year, seemingly heading the right directions. Their recent performance showed that they are slowing gaining the right attitude (not let's-sack-a-guy-every-week) and the stability of the team is growing. Mark Webber is a consistent performer and looks like a complement to the team, hence, barring everything else, things look good. Or at least, doesn't look bad.

[enemy-ace]

It would seem that Parry-Jones would like to see the rest of the grid budget themelves as Jag are.
http://www.autosport.com/newsitem.asp?id=25751&s=54

[Super Tourer]

Certainly Jaguar's approach is now much more workmanlike, but they are in the tightest battle in the field, with BAR now on Michelin's, they may lose some of the tyre advantage they had in certain races.

This is not to condemn the car before it turns a wheel, but picking a 5th place team out of Toyota, BAR, Jaguar and Sauber is not an easy task.

In Jaguar's postition it's very hard to 'innovate' an advantage, so simple but effective has to be the route to take with the car.

[Mr V]

Originally posted by enemy-ace
http://www.autosport.com/newsitem.asp?id=25751&s=54

Ford VP and GPWC director Richard Parry-Jones has repeated his concern over cost escalation in F1, and is pressing for an immediate review of the Concorde Agreement to remove the current requirement for unanimous agreement over the introduction of new regulations.

Can't see this working. Say for instance he managed to get this rule changed, and the 4th - 10th placed teams agreed, and got the rule of limited budgets accepted, whats to make Ferrari, Williams and McLaren adhere to them as they didn't agree in the first place?

[Spudgun]

I've just stumbled across this and I don't like the look of it.

http://www.f1racing.net/news.php?ID=67392

If this is true then it's a real shame and I hope they can sort it before Melbourne.

[Mark Webber]

weird that ! so what is the fault ? IF there is a fault!
methinks some comments have been taken out of context

[Mark Webber]

and here quite the opposite

http://www.motorsport.com/news/artic...D=144029&FS=F1

[Kicking-back]

I think what he means is they've identified areas for improvement, but that developing will take then longer than it would the teams in Maranello or Woking.