[WEC Race] WEC 2015 Round 2: Spa

[CyberMotor]

I liked the Hindyisms today...

"This is not like old fashioned racing, this is new fashioned racing!"

"Where the technology is relevant and the racing is real."

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by cokata

They could have used a scrubed set i believe.

No, the rule is only 6 tyre sets for qualifying and race. 6 hours = 8 stints of 45 min.

[tux]

Originally Posted by airbusA346

I wonder if Aston will be BOP'd soon especially in GTE-Am.

Didnt they change the AM driver ratings to stop one Aston team dominating all the time?

[airbusA346]

Originally Posted by tux

Didnt they change the AM driver ratings to stop one Aston team dominating all the time?

Doesn't seem to have worked yet, if they did.

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Imagine if Porsche hadn't double-stinted ... would they have made up the extra time and been in the lead for the final pit stop? And defending on fresher tires? I am sure some folks in Stutgart might ask the same.

I still don't fully understand why Porsche decided to double stint the tires. The previous stint provided enough proof that the 919 couldn't do it.

They were hoping that Audi's triple stinted tires would drop off dramatically but they should have known that the same would have happened to the Porsche with double stinted tires.

I really feel like Porsche gave Audi the win today.

As for Le Mans, it's still a 3 horse race. Toyota didn't perform well today but I still think they are hiding something for Le Mans. But as of right now, Audi are going in as favourites yet again.

[tux]

I feel we could see reliability just like last year having a massive impact at Le Mans. I mean it always has an impact but last year every LMP1 car had some issue.

[gert]

Originally Posted by Salamus

I still don't fully understand why Porsche decided to double stint the tires. The previous stint provided enough proof that the 919 couldn't do it.

They were hoping that Audi's triple stinted tires would drop off dramatically but they should have known that the same would have happened to the Porsche with double stinted tires.

I really feel like Porsche gave Audi the win today.

I think that last one was a stint and a half.

My guess is that they were hoping that the Audi's 2-and-a-half stint tires would be as bad as their own OR that the Audi would take on new tires and wouldn't be able to make up the time lost.

Once the Audi (Treluyer) got ahead, Porsche had to try something different.
Barring disaster, they had 2nd and 3rd place virtually assured, so why not?


What Porsche really needs is 2 cars in the hunt in the final hour, so they can split their options.
The good newes for Porsche is that
1. all 3 cars were running at the finish
2. the one car which had mechanical issues was fast enough to still beat the 2 Toyotas and the 3rd Audi (it might not have beaten the #8 without that car's problem)

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by gert

My guess is that they were hoping that the Audi's 2-and-a-half stint tires would be as bad as their own OR that the Audi would take on new tires and wouldn't be able to make up the time lost.

This is the logical conclusion that I got too. Although, if Audi came in immediately after the Porsche and got new tires, there would have been enough time to reel in the Porsche, especially at its slow pace.

The decision still disappoints me though. Porsche had grabbed the lead, extended it, and had around a 3-4 sec gap, I believe, at the time they came in. This was with around 35-40 minutes to go. If they took tires and Audi decided to triple stint, then there would have been enough time to reel them in. If Audi decided to change tires too, then Porsche would have likely had the lead with 30 minutes to go and it would have become a sprint to the finish. Oh well I guess, lesson learned for Le Mans.

[gert]

Or maybe there's something els they can try?

I may have misunderstood, but IIRC the reason they (and Audi, and Toyota) have to double stint at least one set of tires is because they have a limited set of tires available and they already use 2 of them in qualifying.

And what if they only used 1 of them in qualifying?
Would that save them from having to double stint?

It would maybe cost them pole, but it would be worth going down that route with 1 car, no?

[Salamus]

From what I understand, they only had to double stint once.

[canamman]

I have enjoyed these races greatly.
The P1 pass at Eau Rouge was a thing of beauty.
Thanks FS1 for airing these in the states live.

[EricS]

Regarding #18 pit strategy: Each car only gets 26 tires (6.5 sets) for qualifying and race. #18 pitted 7 times, that means they have to double stint at least twice and that's what they did. This also means they used the tires qualified on.

Audi did a double and a triple, so didn't have to use one of their qualifying sets of tires.

[Salamus]

Originally Posted by EricS

Regarding #18 pit strategy: Each car only gets 26 tires (6.5 sets) for qualifying and race. #18 pitted 7 times, that means they have to double stint at least twice and that's what they did. This also means they used the tires qualified on.

That explains why they double stinted the last set, thanks.

Has there always been a tire cap in the WEC or is this new for 2015? Personally, I don't like it...affects strategy a bit too much. But I am a bit biased.

[Artur]

Originally Posted by J Jay

Even though Le Mans is a longer race the tyre loads aren't as high, hence the tyres going through multiple stints. All the factories will double stint the tyres at the bare minimum.

I'm thinking of a situation like Le Mans 2011, where IIRC Peugeot could do 12 laps on a tank to Audi's 11 but because the Pug wore the tyres more they could only do three stints (36 laps) on a set compared to Audi's four (44 laps).

Have anybody ever double stinted on the last 5, or so, years? I only remember them quadruple stinting, with a quintuple from Lotterer, once, and worst case, triple stints

As for Le Mans, these 3 would already provide more than enough interest given how fast and close(let's hope Toyota raises their game) they race each other. When you factor in all the inovation of Nissan's into que equation, it just get's mental

I'm so curious to see how GT-R LM will handle and corner, as well as their straight line performance.

@gert, Audi and Toyota chooses to double stint because the degradation is small for them. Mind you, Michelin provides special compounds for each car

[ger80]

Originally Posted by Salamus

That explains why they double stinted the last set, thanks.

Has there always been a tire cap in the WEC or is this new for 2015? Personally, I don't like it...affects strategy a bit too much. But I am a bit biased.

Its new - part of the "we copy the cost cutting ideas that didnt work in F1 into WEC" project

[Hingo]

I thoroughly enjoyed this race. I watched all 6 hours with much interest. I am only a second year WEC follower but been a huge F1 fan my whole life. The WEC is really filling the void that is being created by F1 being generally crap this year. That being said, I find the comparisons made during the coverage and the constant promotion of the series by RLM really irritating. I know how good it is because I am watching it with my own eyes, I don't need to be told it is the best racing series in the world. I love what RLM do but I think they need to tone it down a bit.

I was hoping to see Porsche win but Audi are always there to take advantage of any misfortunes so good on them. I think Porsche will go into Le Mans with confidence.

[Simmi]

Had to work yesterday so I started watching the race in the evening and ended up going all the way through to 2.30 in the morning. I couldn't switch it off. Even though it melted away to a two-car battle it was such an awesome race.

I thought it was a tactical masterstroke by Audi at the end of the race finessing that strategy. Made Porsche show their hand first and reacted accordingly. Shame some seemed intent on rubbishing it until it became clear Audi had absolutely nailed it.

The on-track product is supreme. I know it's not great to do comparisons but to me, rightly or wrongly it makes TUSC seem utterly irrelevant.

One point on the coverage:

I know it's maybe not feasible to have two pit reporters at every round but there has to be a better process to let fans (and the commentators) know what happens at each stop. When you have pit strategy routinely deciding the race, you need to do a better job of conveying it. When even the commentators aren't sure how are fans supposed to be? It shouldn't be a source of mystery what happened at a pit stop.

On-screen graphics would help. A fuel can, driver helmet, 0/2/4 tyres and delete as applicable. It sounds like there is information available which guys like Trussers have access to. Fans need that too. Or at least the guys calling the race. Then you wouldn't get Hindy yelling that an Audi is triple-stinting its tyres when it isn't.

That's not a criticism of anyone I just think the series needs to do a bit more, especially now they've added in an artificial element with tyre set usage. Not sure I like that but I'll give it time.

[EricS]

Originally Posted by Simmi

One point on the coverage:

I know it's maybe not feasible to have two pit reporters at every round but there has to be a better process to let fans (and the commentators) know what happens at each stop. When you have pit strategy routinely deciding the race, you need to do a better job of conveying it. When even the commentators aren't sure how are fans supposed to be? It shouldn't be a source of mystery what happened at a pit stop.

On-screen graphics would help. A fuel can, driver helmet, 0/2/4 tyres and delete as applicable. It sounds like there is information available which guys like Trussers have access to. Fans need that too. Or at least the guys calling the race. Then you wouldn't get Hindy yelling that an Audi is triple-stinting its tyres when it isn't.

That's not a criticism of anyone I just think the series needs to do a bit more, especially now they've added in an artificial element with tyre set usage. Not sure I like that but I'll give it time.

Yeah I agree. RLM's pit coverage is always superb at Le Mans, and TUSC/ALMS/GA always has multiple reporters from the pits to keep everyone clued in on what's going on. It's a shame that the WEC only relies on one person. And it's even funny that John was harping on how great it was to have Louise able to chime in without having to go to her video camera. Like pit-booth audio is ground-breaking technology...

[joeb]

Originally Posted by canamman

I have enjoyed these races greatly.
The P1 pass at Eau Rouge was a thing of beauty.
Thanks FS1 for airing these in the states live.

It is still weird for me to be able to watch wec races on TV. It is great though with John and Graham on the commentary.

[wewantourdarbyback]

It was an incredible race, watched the first five hours live before going to a beer rest. When we got back I couldn't help myself but watch the last hour. The whole thing drew you in. Not the same type of race as Silverstone, but both utterly, utterly gripping. Le Mans will be immense.

Only downside for me was a few problems with officiating. A minute penalty for the 51 for a tyre being slightly in the live lane, yet barely a fraction of that for what was quite frankly dangerous actions by Hartley to drive through a marshall post. First time I've had an issue with Eduardo Freitas.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by wewantourdarbyback

Only downside for me was a few problems with officiating. A minute penalty for the 51 for a tyre being slightly in the live lane, yet barely a fraction of that for what was quite frankly dangerous actions by Hartley to drive through a marshall post. First time I've had an issue with Eduardo Freitas.

I agree whole heartily on this.
Hartley's drive through the marshall post is completely unforgiven and without any respect. There was nothing keeping him from turning around and rejoining the track where he went off. The marshalls were clearly surprised and disturbed in their work. A disqualification or a conditional one race ban for Hartley would, in my mind, be in order.

[TF110]

I thought the race was good. Not great though. They need a few things in the broadcast to help people keep track. Things like # of laps from last pit, # of pit stops, laps per stint, maybe a split screen start so we can see what happens in the classes that arent lmp1? If you dont follow live timing, you can get lost. They focus so much on just a couple of battles they miss out on strategy that ends up winning the race. But overall Im happy to watch it live on my big screen.

[Spyderman]

Originally Posted by CTD

I agree whole heartily on this.
Hartley's drive through the marshall post is completely unforgiven and without any respect. There was nothing keeping him from turning around and rejoining the track where he went off. The marshalls were clearly surprised and disturbed in their work. A disqualification or a conditional one race ban for Hartley would, in my mind, be in order.

Why go the whole hog and have a public hanging?

[Akrapovic]

I thought it was an extremely interesting race.

Once again, penalties need discussed. Hartleys move was completely unacceptable. To deliberately move through a marshal zone like that and force them onto an active race track was not what you expect from a professional racing driver. He made zero attempt to rejoin the race track where he should've done. Given AF Corse was handed a 1 minute penalty for a tyre rolling around an active pit lane, Porsche should've been given a minimum of 1 minute for the #17 car given the immediately danger that Hartley put the marshals in.

Hartleys comments afterwards were also not really on. "I didn't lose time". Perhaps not, but this was not through lack of trying. Once he was off the road, he made no attempt to rejoin and got back on the throttle to accelerate over the run off. This alone, even without the marshal issue should've been more than a 15 second penalty.

The 91 penalty was also very odd. Not to have a go at Nick Tandy, because in the interview he clearly felt very bad about the incident, but GT drivers are very quick to complain about LMP drivers dive bombing and making dangerous moves, and then the first time he's in a P1 (second time ever racing a LMP?) he throws it down the inside of a GT car and takes him out. And then the GT car is penalised..for what? Being on the same race track?

So where were Toyota? And where did the Porsche speed disappear to? I'm surprised at just how fast Audi was at the end, and how slow the Toyota was. We can sit here and make excuses and reasons as to why Toyota were slow, but the fact is they wouldn't have brought this package to Spa if they didn't think it was the best option (unless it was forced by lack of parts or preparation), and to be 1 lap down after 2 hours, every 2 hours, and qualify 3 seconds off the pole is not a good thing. And whilst they may be able to take some comfort in the fact they out-qualified the #9 Audi, that was an old aero kitted car...and they still lost to it during the race.

Audi was surprising with just how well the car treated the tyres whilst being fast. The Toyota was surprising in just how slow it was.

[Creep89]

Originally Posted by TF110

I thought the race was good. Not great though. They need a few things in the broadcast to help people keep track. Things like # of laps from last pit, # of pit stops, laps per stint, maybe a split screen start so we can see what happens in the classes that arent lmp1? If you dont follow live timing, you can get lost. They focus so much on just a couple of battles they miss out on strategy that ends up winning the race. But overall Im happy to watch it live on my big screen.

Thanks, looks like I am not the only one who is missing such fine details, which can make following the race over the whole distance much more enjoyable. They should really expand the live timing.