WTCC, 2006, Rumours, news, dates etc

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by Bramzel

They offer their models for sale as 4WD, but the 159 is a normal FWD. Afaik they don't have a RWD in their programme either at this moment. So basicly it's a way to trick the 159 to be RWD to be more competative against the BMW I think, and I can imagine very well that Seat is against this.

With the Brands qualification result in mind their main target is not BMW but FWD SEAT.

[E46]

Certainly it isn´t a fair move from Alfa Romeo.

[Alfa Fan]

Its BMWs fault. This could be the end of the WTCC - Just like it was the end of the old WTCC and DTM.

[E46]

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

Its BMWs fault. This could be the end of the WTCC - Just like it was the end of the old WTCC and DTM.

Why BMW? If you have a RWD street car, no problem to use it in WTCC. However Alfa Romeo tries other different thing.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by E46

Why BMW? If you have a RWD street car, no problem to use it in WTCC. However Alfa Romeo tries other different thing.

Besides that Alfa showed and now SEAT shows you can be succesful with a FWD car.

[Go_For_Pole]

Sure you can, with a flat bottom. And that's sucessful until the start of the races ;-)

[yellowsubmarine]

Don´t think flat bottom is a big improvement, just helps to balance the front and rear downforce of the car.
Remember that the Leon is a two volumes car, and its aerodynamics continues being a step below BMW and alfa.
We will see what happens tomorrow !!

[Bramzel]

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

Its BMWs fault. This could be the end of the WTCC - Just like it was the end of the old WTCC and DTM.

I find that a rather harsh quote if you don't have any arguments for it.

[Hazard]

I think it's just part of a long outdated concept that once was that the ETCC/WTCC couldn't survive without Alfa Romeo.

I think we can say that's no longer the case, though they're still welcome 'nice to have around's'

[Dani Filth]

i've been asking this last year too .. about Alfa 4wd into RWD .

i don't see the problem . the car is offered as 4wd ..si who's to say it's a FWD car ?? is the Lambo in GT's FWD cars ??
what if 3 versions were offered .. FWD RWD and 4WD . and they would homologate the 4WD . what should they use in racing ?? FWD ??

[Bramzel]

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

i've been asking this last year too .. about Alfa 4wd into RWD .

i don't see the problem . the car is offered as 4wd ..si who's to say it's a FWD car ?? is the Lambo in GT's FWD cars ??
what if 3 versions were offered .. FWD RWD and 4WD . and they would homologate the 4WD . what should they use in racing ?? FWD ??

If a RWD was offered in real life in a limited series it wouldn't be a problem at all imho. But tricking it like they want to do like now isn't fair imho. The Lambo's are a different story; those cars are 4WD only from the factory and need to be changed to fit the rules. But the nature of the 159 is FWD, not 4WD. And that makes it a different situation imho.

[Dani Filth]

what makes a car to be 4wd by nature ?? being offered only in 4wd spec ??

if 4wd was allowed in WTCC .. should they be allowed to race the 159 ?? and so be homologated ?? or it should still be FWD as by nature

[Hazard]

You'd be walking into the world of weight penalties putting together a 4WD entry.

Just think of the Audi A4 in the BTCC in '96. By '98, the car was forced to be 2WD against it's actual build because of the weight penalties not really working either.

I don't think it's that accepted that RWD is actually as much as an advantage as has been made out, it's just the BMW has developed to be better than the Alfa 156. The fact the Seat Leon, and even Chevrolet are giving the BMW difficulty, means FWD is a perfectly competitive package.

[Dani Filth]

of course it is . Alfa proved that already in the years they won ..
we;re already in the world of weight penalites .but that wasn't my point . i wasn't sugesting allowing 4wd cars

i belive they should be allowed to homologate whatever configuration they want .. it gives them more posibilities .. they could even race it in WRC

[Hazard]

Wouldn't they start building RWD & FWD cars then? And take the FWD's to Brands say, and the RWD's to Magny-Cours? Be a bit silly.

Alfa winning? Hmmm, guess I can't remember that far back

[Bramzel]

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

what makes a car to be 4wd by nature ?? being offered only in 4wd spec ??

No, being developed as 4WD spec. The Alfa was born as FWD car, the Lambo was born as 4WD car, the BMW was born as RWD car.

if 4wd was allowed in WTCC .. should they be allowed to race the 159 ?? and so be homologated ?? or it should still be FWD as by nature

Of course they would, because they build such a car. They sell the necissary numbers of 4WD cars, so then it'd be allowed for sure. But 4WD isn't allowed, so that's irrelevant.

[Dani Filth]

it was developed with 4wd in mind too .. it's in fact the same 4wd system that Audi uses .. it's not an after market thing ..

they built a 4wd car . so why not being allowed to homologate it ?
and then . as the rules say .. they need to use only 2wd .. that should be up to them to chose be it FWD or RWD

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

it was developed with 4wd in mind too .. it's in fact the same 4wd system that Audi uses .. it's not an after market thing ..

they built a 4wd car . so why not being allowed to homologate it ?

Because 4WD is NOT allowed.

Originally Posted by Dani Filth

and then . as the rules say .. they need to use only 2wd .. that should be up to them to chose be it FWD or RWD

Because there's a 159 FWD road car available. If they had only 4WD road cars probably they were allowed to change the car to FWD or RWD.
(correct me if I am wrong).

[Dani Filth]

i don't belive the homologation has anything to do with the WTCC regs .. correct me if I am wrong ..

only 4wd ?? . why ?

[TCD]

What's the problem with racing with a 4WD car but using it as a 2WD?? Coz it's not a 4WD anymore then...

[Bramzel]

Originally Posted by TCD

What's the problem with racing with a 4WD car but using it as a 2WD?? Coz it's not a 4WD anymore then...

In theory it would be possible perhaps and maybe a loophole in the regulations would allow it. But imho it's a unfair way of making a extremely large change to your car wich normally isn't allowed.

[FIRE]

According the Flemish Eurosport commentator next years season will start in South America (Curitiba & Puebla?) and will end at the new F1 circuit of Singapore (I didn't know they are building a F1 circuit). He mentioned races in Japan (makes some sense with Yokohama and trying to attract a Japanese manufacturer?), Moscou (makes sense with LADA) and....Pau. And according to him the KSO has said next year 6 manufacturers (Lexus, Dodge or Nissan?).

Don't know how many of this is fact or speculation but a race in Japan and rumours about Dodge, Lexus and to a lesser degree Nissan are mentioned before.

[Valker]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Moscou (makes sense with LADA) and....

Russians are building a new racing track near Moscow (Avtodrom Moskva). It will replace current Moscow-Myachkovo airfield track (Google map, current scheme). New track should look like this (pdf).

There should be two other circuit projects in Russia also. Kazan in central Russia and Togliatti (Tolyatti ). AvtoVAZ just got the building licence for their Lada Ring, but I know nothing about Kazan.

And according to him the KSO has said next year 6 manufacturers (Lexus, Dodge or Nissan?).

...Brilliance, Skoda? Or maybe someone doing a comeback (Peugeot, Ford)... or even Ford as Mazda? Full factory support for JAS Honda would be great too.

[FIRE]

World Touring Car Championship boss Marcello Lotti expects Alfa Romeo to confirm their works participation in the 2007 WTCC within the next three weeks.

Source: www.autosport.com

[Go_For_Pole]

Either true or Lotti is publicly "reminding" Alfa of its contract to "help" in the negotiations between them.