The never ending Toyota return to Le Mans (LMP1) Saga

[gwyllion]

You seem to be mixing up Shanghai and Bahrain

[Mal]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

You seem to be mixing up Shanghai and Bahrain

Ok my bad, sorry - bl**dy tilke tracks all look the same!

[TF110]

They do look similar. Youre right that Bahrain has an endurance layout, but curiously the World Endurance Championship doesn't use it.

[Dead-Eye]

Originally Posted by TF110

They do look similar. Youre right that Bahrain has an endurance layout, but curiously the World Endurance Championship doesn't use it.

That's probably because it's terrible

[TF110]

Autosport confirming the two car entry at Bahrain barring any incident to one of the cars in Shanghai.

[wewantourdarbyback]

Originally Posted by Mal

The track you show is the 'Endurance track' which strangely they did not use - they used the F1 track which is slightly reduced - see here:

http://www.bahraingp.com/AboutBIC/Ou...s/default.aspx

It would be a lot better if we used the outer circuit.

[Acid09]

Some of Pascal Vasselon's quotes in the newest Sportscar365 piece highlight how absurd TMG's financial situation is:

http://sportscar365.com/wec/toyota-e...s-for-bahrain/

He sounds like the principal of a small privateer outfit. They don't have enough parts for a full season with two cars? A works team of the world's largest car maker..

TMC obsession with keeping them underfunded is really starting to be rather damaging PR wise, aside from the obvious effect on their competitiveness. How they expect to beat both Audi and Porsche this way is beyond me.

[FstrthnU]

Minimize costs at the end of 2013, go all out in 2014

Not too different from every F1 team apart from Red Bull this year.

In both cases, the teams have already lost the championship. So no point to spend any more than necessary. And unlike F1, the money prizes for 2nd place in the manufacturer's title are miniscule/non-existent.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by Acid09

Some of Pascal Vasselon's quotes in the newest Sportscar365 piece highlight how absurd TMG's financial situation is:

http://sportscar365.com/wec/toyota-e...s-for-bahrain/

He sounds like the principal of a small privateer outfit. They don't have enough parts for a full season with two cars? A works team of the world's largest car maker..

TMC obsession with keeping them underfunded is really starting to be rather damaging PR wise, aside from the obvious effect on their competitiveness. How they expect to beat both Audi and Porsche this way is beyond me.

Well, as of now TMG is just a small outfit (with a giant facility). Seems like they set out a budget and resources for the year and may exceed it. Probably TMG running on their funds mostly instead of reliance from Toyota motor. Hopefully that changes. The autosport article seemed to show positive support from the big guys at Fuji.

If you pay any attention to Toyota outside of motorsport, you may have heard of the TMG Lexus LS (TS650)? According to car magazine, Akio Toyoda was behind the project initially and was set to have 10 made for himself and others in Toyota, but now it seems that car will go ahead and be part of the next generatiom LS in 2015. So more support to TMG from the CEO and Toyota seems likely, hopefully.

[Maelochs]

"TMC obsession with keeping them underfunded is really starting to be rather damaging PR wise ..."

How so? No onwe but a few fans on sites like these even notice, and not a lot of those even care.

Beyond that Toyota's reputation globally is unsullied, based as it is ... on success of the Camry.

We'd all like Toyota, not TMG, to go racing in P1, but that doesn't seem like it is going to happen. We either appreciate what we have ... or not.

[Félix]

Originally Posted by Acid09

Some of Pascal Vasselon's quotes in the newest Sportscar365 piece highlight how absurd TMG's financial situation is:

http://sportscar365.com/wec/toyota-e...s-for-bahrain/

He sounds like the principal of a small privateer outfit. They don't have enough parts for a full season with two cars? A works team of the world's largest car maker..

TMC obsession with keeping them underfunded is really starting to be rather damaging PR wise, aside from the obvious effect on their competitiveness. How they expect to beat both Audi and Porsche this way is beyond me.

The car is 2 races away from retirement. They don't want to have extra spare parts lying around. One way to look at it is that it is good news because it means the car should be all new next year. And I'm pretty sure it's not unlike the last year of the R8 when spares were getting rare and they had to be careful not to crash... even though there were a dozen other cars built and it is Audi we're talking about.

[TF110]

Sounds about right. They all along planned for only two cars at Fuji after LeMans. Now pushing it to an additional round (bahrain as they did no racing in Fuji) seems to be the wishes of both Toyota and TMG. Theyre still Toyota, just left to do their thing with their money. So if two cars are throughout all next year, TMG has more money to spend or 'mother Toyota' increased it's support!

[Mal]

The 'big push' if it comes was always going to be with the 2014 car - we will have to wait and see.

[Simmi]

I can't in all good faith bring myself to complain when Toyota actually up their programme for the final races instead of scaling back.

That said if they turn around and cut corners in '14 I don't think anyone will be happy. That means two full season entries and a third at Le Mans.

[TF110]

Doubt we will see 3 cars at LeMans, but it would be great! Seems like Toyota is in a good position for a win in tomorrow's race, that should bring smiles to anyone in Japan or Cologne.

[FstrthnU]

http://sportscar365.com/wec/shanghai-notebook/
2 cars for the full season next year. No word on extra entry for Le Mans
Development of car on schedule, first tests will be next year
Production has begun, including tub

[chernaudi]

Interesting tech note for the TS030 in China: the serrations on the dive plans are gone. Toyota seem to have replaced them with "normal" dive planes either in Shanghai or maybe even Fuji.

[gwyllion]

Only on the car #8 it seems.

[MyNameIsNigel]

Video footage of the race shows that both cars raced with the more classical (non-serrated) front dive planes.

[TF110]

Both ran with the same package of non-split diveplanes...

#7


#8

[TF110]

2 cars for Bahrain confirmed. Should be a good sendout for the TS030. Bahrain is probably the best track for their hybrid power usage.

[Brownj]

Originally Posted by TF110

2 cars for Bahrain confirmed. Should be a good sendout for the TS030. Bahrain is probably the best track for their hybrid power usage.

Good news!

I guess this time I shouldn't go to bed while they are leading the race. Thought they had Shanghai in the bag! I would expect that it will be full attack from both Audi and Toyota for the win since the championship is decided. Should be a good fight!

[TF110]

Lets hope there isn't a puncture in the 5th hour or a suspension failure. Shanghai was setup to be an easy win for Toyota. Bahrain might be closer since not all hybrid zones turns that follow are under 120kmh.

[Félix]

In the December edition of Racecar Engineering magazine, there's an interesting piece about the new Super Formula car for 2014 and the new 550hp 2 liter turbo engines focused on fuel efficiency. There's a paragraph about how they experimented last year with half of a RV8K installed in a car with a turbo sticking out of the sidepod. The new engine is a brand new 2 liter block with direct fuel injection and spec Zytek hybrid system.

That's the most interesting and substantiated account of a new Toyota race engine I've read, and I can't help but think such an engine would be more suited for Le Mans - if Toyota really wanted to look serious about Le Mans. At least some of the developments might make their way towards Toyota's 2014 engine, whatever it ends up being.

[TF110]

Originally Posted by Félix

In the December edition of Racecar Engineering magazine, there's an interesting piece about the new Super Formula car for 2014 and the new 550hp 2 liter turbo engines focused on fuel efficiency. There's a paragraph about how they experimented last year with half of a RV8K installed in a car with a turbo sticking out of the sidepod. The new engine is a brand new 2 liter block with direct fuel injection and spec Zytek hybrid system.

That's the most interesting and substantiated account of a new Toyota race engine I've read, and I can't help but think such an engine would be more suited for Le Mans - if Toyota really wanted to look serious about Le Mans. At least some of the developments might make their way towards Toyota's 2014 engine, whatever it ends up being.

The same engines will be used in SuperGT next year. Toyota probably has reason in the engine route to take. There is Judd following the bigger engine idea and Rebellion staying with the Toyota engine. I think both could work. It will be cool to see differences between them like Porsche's engine. Toyota must see something in the V8, because theres plenty other options they already use or have used before.