Legge confirmed at PKV according to Speed

[mountainstar]

You can debate whether people have a legitimate right to their race seat in any series. Look at F1 for instance. I can probably pick half the field and question whether A. they even belong there to begin with or B. whether they should retain their seat. It's true that there were quite a few "qualified" candidates who were vying for the PKV ride. Some may have even been faster than KL. But to me what it comes down to is desire and motivation.

The sport I competed in in high school, the 1st year I didn't even make junior varsity, but was picked as an alternate for the team beating out someone who actually had better scores, but didn't really care whether he was on the team or not. I was told they took me because I really did want to be part of the team. Within 2 years I was team captain and national champion. I see the same with KL. Maybe right off the bat she is a few tenths off, but she really wants to make a champcar career happen and is determined to do so. If you compare her to Briscoe for instance, who is only trying to keep his butt warm for a non existant F1 seat, who would you pick? I'd take the one who I know is going to work hard and make things happen rather than someone who is here to pass time.

I'd like to add that over the past year or so KL has copped heaps more criticism on this forum than any support(my opinion) and I have to say at least she got off her ass and made things happen and that certainly demands some respect.

[Tenoch]

Originally Posted by okeefe

Okay MacDaddy. Here's a bit of news though - apparently the source atodamakina.com is reporting that the team mate will be Michel Jourdain Jr. Anyone heard of that?

Yeah I heard about that, now that Jourdain got turned down at PPC racing he gots nothing to do and apparantly KK called him up and told him that they wanted him in a PKV car. atodamakina.com reported that this had been confirmed by Jourdain's people and that KK wanted him to bring at least some sponsorship.

[blueflagger]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

I'd like to add that over the past year or so KL has copped heaps more criticism on this forum than any support(my opinion) and I have to say at least she got off her ass and made things happen and that certainly demands some respect.

Hear! Hear! Thanks for that Mountainstar.

That's true about a lot of pro athletes in general. Why are we (posters) so critical of someone who is making it happen? Is it just because we don't agree with their style? Or is it because we want to bring them down to our level?

[okeefe]

I have not heard many complaints about St.James and Guthrie being there as publicity stunts, that's for sure. As for Danica - I don't think her NOT winning can even be compared - the competition in the respective series of where Legge did win and Danica did not win says much. I've seen many forums with talk that this whole method of Legge's advancement - especially given her difficulties in series prior thereto before Atlantics - compares to the old bias of CART; and that any wins she does get in Champ Car will be seen as being fixed for publicity anyway. I don't think open wheel racing fans seeing things that way does much for the promotion of the series already wracked by their own little civil war. Fans seeing things that way certainly doesn't do much for the promotion of women in the sport.
There was a time I was K.Legge's biggest fan - in the beginning - before all the pompom shows. As for doing something - the whole point is that it appears what she did do to get on Champ Car track was done off track - that's not a good presentation always either. As for people's levels - well, I'm a working woman raising three daughters and I pay attention to how women are perceived in many aspects because my daughters will live within that perception. As for being a fan - I go to a race to see competitive racing - not to hear about a long range forecast.

[blueflagger]

I was speaking generally o'keefe and did not mean to offend you. Mostly, I was thinking of some of the F1 forum posts that I read.

I, too, am a woman and have been in racing long enough to watch Lyn St. James come and go (and a heckuva lot more male drivers go over the horizon). I am a fan of Legge's because I think she has a powerful driving style. I feel that what she does/needs to do outside of driving to propel herself to the top is her problem. It's too bad that playing the girl card works (to a certain extent - and then it backfires) and don't forget that Lyn played that card too early on.

But perhaps women should use the same measuring stick that the guys do for male athletes. If a male athlete plays the hunk card, the guys just ignore it. They don't care so long as the athlete is good at their job. So why should we women care so much more than that? And why should guys care more about women athlete's reputations outside of their ability? Yes, a double-standard exists. But how do you stop it?

[okeefe]

Not offended in the least - defines my interest more clearly to simply state I'm a single working mother raising three daughters. Now, we're getting somewhere!
The double standard will always exist I think - we could lie and say it won't but women and men are simply different and it will always exist if we're really into truth here. I think the best we can do is to promote good images within it. I think a little patience and getting there on one's own good time rather than at the speed of light to save or promote a series is the wrong approach to the cause of seriousness in women racers. Sorry, but I do. I don't even think in this case it's all K.Legge's fault - I think she got caught up in the fallout of a sort of civil war and a "weapons" race or something. I imagine when you get that close to something that big - it's pretty easy to want to get it anyway you can too. But when the two series - already bitter against each other because of the last few years- gets to trying to outdoing each other by the females they can bring in - I don't think that goes very far as painting the picture of seriousness in women racers. I think a lady always has the right to say "no thank you, not just yet". I think she knew PR was a way in - and I think she's there because of it. I think she would have gotten there on her own later anyway - and with less questions and doubt that way.

[rustyfan]

What you need are a couple of female drivers racing full-time and producing results at a regular basis. Until then female drivers (in circuit racing, anyhow) will remain a novelty, and something that gets a lot of attention.

I mean, just look at dragracing. These days it's no biggie that women are racing - and winning - against the guys.

[okeefe]

I think anytime women are in a sport or business mainlined by men - they are initially seen as a novelty and there seems to be little dispute of that fact at least. So then, the focus one would think would be to change that view- if one were worried about being seen as a novelty and wanting to be seen with more seriousness.
I think one's own presentation and how they go about things for themselves along the way CAN change their being seen as a novelty - if it is what they want.
If they WANT the attention that comes from being seen as a novelty - well I think they know what to do to get it too.
She's there in Champ Car. I don't expect her to win; I don't expect her to not win. I DO expect to see competition- that'd be what I was paying for to see, wouldn't it? To deflect from the competition we can expect - well, I think that takes a lot of the fun out of racing.

[littleman]

Good luck to the girl - despite all the odds she's made it happen. My only real concern is I think she's now way out of her depth and could hurt herself or someone else.

[macdaddy]

Danica to IndyCar.
Legge to ChampCar.
Tracy to NASCAR.
Dominquez to ChampCar.
The need for an American in F1.

All are being overseen from the highest levels, for different yet similar reasons.

[D.R.T.]

Originally Posted by littleman

Good luck to the girl - despite all the odds she's made it happen. My only real concern is I think she's now way out of her depth and could hurt herself or someone else.

McGee would not have her in the car if this was such a concern. She tested well, better than anyone would have thought.

Bremmer went to CC from 1 year in Atlantics and found his feet, a certain Andretti is heading into another championship with less experience and one Kimi Raikonen went into F1 after 24 car racing starts.

Lets not pre empt what Legge will and wont being able to do.

[perfectly_frank]

Bottom line: she's got the job at PKV.
It shouldn't surprise anyone that racing drivers are hired for a number of reasons; experience, perceived value to sponsors, racing speed, sponsors' demands, testing performance, salary demands, etc.

I'm more interested in who will be driving the other PKV car this year.

[Sato san]

Originally Posted by okeefe

But when the two series - already bitter against each other because of the last few years- gets to trying to outdoing each other by the females they can bring in - I don't think that goes very far as painting the picture of seriousness in women racers.

Surley with a remark like that , its going to do no good whatsoever to the seriousness of a female racer like K.Legge . That remark if ever read by a driver that puts so much into a career path must be very disheartning . Surley a driver like Katherine who works as hard as any one else at her career and takes her career so seriously and is extremely committed to acheiving her goals in Motorsport , this must be a real slap in the face that people can view her gaining a Champ car seat so badly .

I would like to see her comittment measured against other drivers and i would be sure that she would make many others look the weaker links . For sure i wouldnt deny that the fact she is female will grab more press column inches etc and is a very good sponsorship sweetner , but then look at Jacques Villeneuve for example or Al Unser jr , all the Andretti family or even Vanina Ickx ( the daughter of the great Jacky Ickx ) who is making a very good career for herself in motorsport . All these drivers had or have simular reasons why the press gave them more attention , but please , dont let that defect from the fact that they are all proffesional drivers with talant . Katherine is very proffesional , extremely committed and a worthy race winner in the 2005 Atlantic feeder series .

Its not like she was a tail end runner or a back of the grid driver from last year who has wrote her own cheque to drive in Champ Car or got her drive just because she is female and she can take her clothes off for press shoots , it needs to be remembered here that she drives with agrression and is a racer . I think the ( female ) fact here is getting so far exagerated , its detracting from the fact she can win races in motorsport , gives it 110% all the time and is giving her everything to hold her own at this very high level at International motorsport . I dont deny that by being a female makes her very marketable , or course it does , but you have to be able to drive at a extremely high level , that is the important factor here . Im sure being the the son of a legend like Gilles Villeneuve gave Jacques many press column inches and the sponsors of Williams F1 team must have been rubbing their hand together in 1996 when he moved to Formula 1 , but he had to get the job done too . People like Jim Mcgee and Vasser are not there for a theatre performances , she got the job because she got off her backside and convinced people she could cut it , with her pace , quickness to learn , feedback etc etc .

Now we get to see what she can do and if she can cut it over the next 2 years in the same way as we have been able to do over the rest of the grid in the past years.

[okeefe]

Alrighty then - no talk of gender. So then:
1. The comments she's made to media - we should not hold her accountable for or judge her by them.
2. The ride she's attained - we shouldn't expect too much from her this year-it's the long range forecast that's important here.
3. Her team mate - well they're looking for someone who will help her and not be all out for himself. So, we should not look to that racer for all out competition either.
4. She has limited experience which we hear about continually - at the same time as being praised for aggressive driving. Is limited experience and aggressive driving a good mix?
5. She had not a whole lot of success in previous times prior to the Atlantics - but in the Atlantics she had 3 wins - doesn't matter how competitive that series was or was not.
6. She tested on the tracks alone and that's largely how she earned her ride.
7. 4, 5 and 6 should not pose any concern that she may be out of her depth and pose any safety risk to either herself or other racers - because why; oh yes, the people who put her in that ride are not concerned about it - therefore it should not concern anyone else.
8. The people who put her in that ride are not out to counter any Danicamania; any announcers or anyone else who thinks that is wrong.
9. There's already talk that some will not believe any wins she does get - largely because of the questions surrounding her even getting the ride but it'll all be good for the series in the end.
10. Anyone who questions any of the above, should just not do so.

Is that about the way of it then, gender aside? Well, thank goodness she is there so we can get on with racing soon, but please, you can't expect the general public, fans, or media to not notice and not question the above - irregardless of the racer's gender. God's Speed and Safety to her.

[macdaddy]

A little redundant, perhaps?

[okeefe]

Sorry if so. No worries though, even though I've only been watching Champ Car for the past year or so, already I think I'm too much a realist to be a very good fan of Champ Car and enjoy the races anymore. So, I'll stay tuned to F1 and Atlantics; take a closer look at Indy, and maybe even catch PT in Nascar some! You all keep fast and safe now!

[speedreader]

As a fellow female racer, I too am concerned that she is being chosen for the right reasons but for sure she is not the first racer (of any gender, race or religion) nor will she be the last who has been promoted into a class of motorsport for other reasons than straight speed and race results. However, her recent results do certainly point toward the fact that she is capable of stepping up and given time she may well prove her doubters wrong, I sure hope so.

Her biggest problem is she will have to contend with learning her trade in the spot light whereas if she were male, the spot light would only really start to shine when the results start coming in......

I do note I cannot recall seeing as much negativity or questioning of team owners decisions when '$' drivers have made it into Champ cars, Indy cars and even Formula 1 when some have been very obviously well out of their depth and a definite danger to others - she does have a good record and genuine, competitive single seat race experience which places her in good stead in my books.

The way I see it there are definite 'ups' and 'downs' if you are 'different' when competing in motorsport whether it be by surname, bank account or gender -

Up - If you can prove yourself you are marketable and funding will assist in obtaining better rides and ultimately - success
BUT
Down - You first have to prove yourself to a much higher level of capability in front of a larger and more critical audience before you will ever be accepted and considered successful in your own right....

Good luck to her, lets give her a chance and if she shines - great. If she doesnt, she has done no worse than a lot of others who have tried and at least she earned the right to try with her Formula Atlantic results

PS - How does she compare with other rookies (if any) stepping up this season ?

[Mosport67]

Katherine got her ride through a combination of circumstances which included her gender. While she doesn't have a lot of experience I would say her credentials are better than Nelson Philippe's were (there was lots of negativity regarding his career when he started). After a difficult first year he did ok last season.

Katherine has potential. I wish she had spent another year to get more experience in Atlantics but the risk was that she would not win races in a very competitive series. Some of this season's Atlantic drivers may see their reputations hurt due to a lack of success in what promises to be a very tough series. There was nothing to gain in terms of publicity by taking that risk for Katherine and KK.

I don't think Katherine was the best choice in terms of driving ability but in terms of balancing that with the marketing aspects of running a race team (and series) she moves into first place. In other situations it is a driver with bags of money that tips the scales in his favour.

I hope she does well but clearly it will be a learning experience. From what I have seen though she seems open to learning and I think that ability will serve her well.

[enemy-ace]

Originally Posted by okeefe

compares to the old bias of CART; and that any wins she does get in Champ Car will be seen as being fixed for publicity anyway.

This might be slightly OT but I would be interested in what possible bias you may be referring to that CART might have shown in the past. I find it a little far-fetched that the current ownership would fix the series and gift Legge a victory, which to my eyes seems to be the implication here.

[rustyfan]

Originally Posted by enemy-ace

This might be slightly OT but I would be interested in what possible bias you may be referring to that CART might have shown in the past. I find it a little far-fetched that the current ownership would fix the series and gift Legge a victory, which to my eyes seems to be the implication here.

Seeing how many sophisticated open-wheel diehards seem to think NASCAR rigs just about every race in one way or the other (whether it's giving stock car regulars order to crash newcomers on purpose, especially if they come in from Champ Car, or telling drivers to crash willingly to set up green/white/checkered finishes) you can't blame people for thinking Champ Car will try to rig some races to give Legge a top finish eh?



Joking around aside, I seriously doubt Legge will get any 'unofficial perks'. Sure, she might get some preferred treatment within the team (even though I highly doubt that as well), but overall she'll have to deal with it like any other rookie. Not to mention the other teams wouldn't just sit back and take it up the tailpipe if it became blalantly obvious Legge was indeed getting 'special treatment' from Champ Car - they are way too professional to go along with something like that.

[enemy-ace]

Originally Posted by rustyfan

Seeing how many sophisticated open-wheel diehards seem to think NASCAR rigs just about every race in one way or the other (whether it's giving stock car regulars order to crash newcomers on purpose, especially if they come in from Champ Car, or telling drivers to crash willingly to set up green/white/checkered finishes) you can't blame people for thinking Champ Car will try to rig some races to give Legge a top finish eh?

You will be happy to know that I heard an interview with PT on 'raceline radio'
in which he recounted his Busch race at Daytona. It would seem that he was running at the back, playing it safe, when he saw Carl Edwards (a Cup regular) motion out his window for PT to hook onto his bumper. PT and Carl then proceeded to work their way to the front and were both running in the top ten.
It would seem Mr. Edwards gave PT a rather warm welcome to NASCAR.

Sorry to go OT.

[rustyfan]

Originally Posted by enemy-ace

You will be happy to know that I heard an interview with PT on 'raceline radio'
in which he recounted his Busch race at Daytona. It would seem that he was running at the back, playing it safe, when he saw Carl Edwards (a Cup regular) motion out his window for PT to hook onto his bumper. PT and Carl then proceeded to work their way to the front and were both running in the top ten.
It would seem Mr. Edwards gave PT a rather warm welcome to NASCAR.

Sorry to go OT.

Doesn't surprise me one bit to hear that, considering Carl Edwards is an absolute class act

Sure wish I could get the Busch races on TV.

(No more OT on this matter from me.)

[N I Tram]

Originally Posted by enemy-ace

This might be slightly OT but I would be interested in what possible bias you may be referring to that CART might have shown in the past. I find it a little far-fetched that the current ownership would fix the series and gift Legge a victory, which to my eyes seems to be the implication here.

I think what she was saying is that the more cynical members of the publicwho don't believe that women are good enough to win might assume that, especially given her comparatively easy ride to the top and her connections to a series owner.

[Born Racer]

Why keep harping about it

You have to remember that quotes you may read are often going to be in response to a multitude of questions in interviews. It's not necessarily her trying to bang on about it to anybody. She's asked a question and she'll respond.

[Russ-Turner]

Originally Posted by okeefe

Wow http://www.sarahkavanagh.com[/url].

Check out the gallery. Is she a distant relative of Schuey's?