AMOC, Silverstone, 18th October.

[jellison]

Originally Posted by andy97

The AHM web ite quotes 320 Bhp at 9000 rpm. I guess its fairly light, no idea but it hs carbon fibre front wings.

It has only been supercharged in the last year or two, i think. n/a in 2007 when I think Tim won the ARCA chmpionship with it. The AHM website quotes 248 Bhp then.

I have taken the liberty of copying this link from the Silverstone AMOC race across from the ARCA web site.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVpOwqhuWII

Hope no one minds.

I have always been an Alfa Sprint fan since my second ever car was one but I actually prefered this particular car when it was n/a - I'm not a fan of adding blowers to cars that never had them in their original designed format. A great piece of engineering, though.

OMG - that is an Absolute weapon (the Alfa) not Ellis car (that should have been gone - either a problem / sand bagging or not that fast - the driver no the car).Back to the Alfa - where can I find out more aboout this amazing machine.Look very hard to handle, must have some front end setup / trick LSD etc.Got to read more about it.Makes me yern (is that right) for my old GTV6 (RWD). AWESOME.What time was it doing on the international?

[G.Walker]

Great Video of the superchaged Alfa !

Saw it at Oulton towards end of season in Alfa Championship, Last on the grid , but did not take him long to get to the front.

[Al Weyman]

Blimey that thing is quick, are they front or rear wheel drive, surely rear wheel with that power.

[R59]

It's front wheel drive Al, and Tim is a damn quick driver (and a pretty good instructor too!)

[Al Weyman]

Front Wheel drive, thats amazing who said they had a disadvantage in the dry? Nice to see I am not the only Camaro driver that has the odd wheel lock up. :-) Want a canvas print of that picture of your car? ;-)

[jellison]

they guy that owns the Green GTV6 Beast (http://www.ahmotorsports.co.uk/index2.htm) should bring that out in the SGT. I love that thing - seen it on the trailer a few time when driving about the country - Monster. Forgotten how much I loved Alfa's (GTV6 one of the best noises ever).

[jellison]

Whoa - i am wasting some time today looking at Alfas.

FYI - From Alfa website (380bhp FWD and must weigh bugger all) -

On board with Tim Lewis in his 2.0 Supercharged Alfa Romeo Alfasud sprint with approximately 380bhp (was 320bhp before fitting a smaller pulley) in the AMOC Super GT Challenge, starting 4th after breaking a gearbox in qualifying. The Yellow car on pole is the famous Ellis Aston Martin Virage GT700R with a dyno proven 700bhp. Tim managed to get into the lead and was pulling away when a gear linkage fell off and ended his race!

So he could have won. Like I said it shouldn't be able to, maybe Ellis should get someone in to drive his car! I'm sure Reidy in that thing would be alot faster.

The Sprint is (for me) a much bigger deal in getting the laptimes out of it that the Ellis thing. I.e. the Sud is very closely developeffrom a race car into the car we see in the vid (yep extreme version of the engine, lightened, big brakes, slicks etc), but you can see fairly easily where it came from.

HUGE Respect. Wonder what it weighs. Ellis must be poo'ing his pants that next time out (it the Suds gear linkage holds up he will be Whoopped), especially on a tight / more technical track, like Brands or Outon / Cadwell or funnily enough Thruxton.

Ellis's cars loks like it is waiting for ever before he dare get his foot into it!

[terence]

Monstrously quick car,is it really f.w.d? I had the Sprint version which was 1700,didn't know they could be stretched that far.As Al said,there must be some pretty decent diff in it to counter the torque steer after every gear change.

[jellison]

think 1.8 is easy - 2.0 more of a push but easily do able.

My 15 Cloverleaf had disc's all round but wen they went to the 1.7 they dumbed the brakes down to drums a the back (cost saving crap).

They did not handle great - well went road corner flat (boxer helped), but awful torque steer - mine EAT tyres ever few k miles - that turned me off it in the end (well and blowing it up) sold sold post rebuild and got a RWD Gtv6 - Yum.

[terence]

Any clutch prob's? Great car though,especialy with Koni's all round.

[andy97]

Originally Posted by jellison

My 15 Cloverleaf had disc's all round but wen they went to the 1.7 they dumbed the brakes down to drums a the back (cost saving crap).

Th later 1.7 Sprints were based on the running gear of the Alfa 33

Originally Posted by jellison

They did not handle great - well went road corner flat (boxer helped), but awful torque steer - mine EAT tyres ever few k miles - that turned me off it in the end (well and blowing it up) sold sold post rebuild and got a RWD Gtv6 - Yum.

My early 1.5 Sprt did suffer from torque steer but my old 1.5 33 racer handled fantastically well & no real torque steer.

[Al Weyman]

Hey Jelly you are being a tad hard on Mr Ellis possibly. He locked the brakes up several times with a real biggun when the Alfa caught him, I think some benifit of doubt should be afforded to the man with respect as the car looked like it may have had a problem and it only needs a flat spotted tyre to ruin your race.

[jellison]

Originally Posted by terence bower

Any clutch prob's? Great car though,especialy with Koni's all round.

Not on mine no - just the engine - big ends (had it reground and rebuilt) but want GTV6 after that (god that thing eat the mile - Aberdeen to London before Cameras - well many!) Plod did get me In the Sprint once in deepest Scotland - but then bugger all else to do up there.

Sprints are / were very light - think part of why they had crap traction. Needed a slipper (I stupidly used it as a tow car for about a year! Long time ago).

Lets hope he gets out next year and shows Ellis he just Ain't driving that thing hard enough

WOnder how much fat slicks are worth round Silve Int over 1B Ykoo type stuff?

[terence]

Probably three to four seconds.

[jellison]

That crazy Sprint is 10 sec's faster than my TR6 round there! Jesus.

Mind 150bhp more, likely alot lighter and on FAT slicks. Christ http://www.tsl-timing.com/?loc=club&...&eventid=94254

I might have to get supercharging my TR4!

[terence]

Dont bother,its already been done Jelly. Fantastic performance,till the box/diff let go big time!!

[jellison]

Originally Posted by terence bower

Dont bother,its already been done Jelly. Fantastic performance,till the box/diff let go big time!!

Who do you know that did this? I know Pete Cox (him of the All alloy body stupidly quick TR4) did one about 10-12years back with a G60 blower. That spank any TR8 it came across till problems.

I could not run my car in anything bar SGT if I did it (not consider for at least 8+years), and other things obviously on the go now. Mind it is in my garage now with an MOT and a fresh engine. Will make a Crazy road car in 2010.

I wonder what weight the Sprint is as I doubt I could bet mine below 800kg with a steel tub.

[terence]

No names but it was a TR specialist up here in Cambridgeshire. The Engine was built by Mass,cant remember exactly what it gave but well in excess of 270bhp! From a Tractor Engine,not bad!. Problems with the Box and Diff made the guy give up on it though.One of the few laps it held together,Silverstone club,it knocked out a 1:03.5,and not using everything that was available!

[jellison]

Originally Posted by terence bower

No names but it was a TR specialist up here in Cambridgeshire. The Engine was built by Mass,cant remember exactly what it gave but well in excess of 270bhp! From a Tractor Engine,not bad!. Problems with the Box and Diff made the guy give up on it though.One of the few laps it held together,Silverstone club,it knocked out a 1:03.5,and not using everything that was available!

That is Crazy fast - mind if it could only do a few laps (and see below)!

Does not sound like Petes as he did race it in Efi and Carbed form on quite a few occaisons in the TR Register. Petes was giving a bit north of 300 I think and his car was under 750kg (alloy tub and alloy panels (The Silver Bullet), before full cages).

Not sure on that lap time - that sounds like VERY Wishfull thinking as way way faster than The TSCC C (mega fast TR6 which on weight should really be a D car), and no way is a TR4 with "only" going to be 3 sec's faster than Roy McCarthy Monster MGBV8 (370 odd bhp) - not a cat in hells chance.

Silverstone
National

(C)Simon Knowles TR6 1:07.702 09/04/2005 (D) Roy McCarthy MGB GT V8 1:06.434 10/04/2004

http://www.thoroughbredsportscars.net/wp/?page_id=80

Most if not all Lap records by class D will be beyond anything that was ever set by any of the cars that ran in the TR register (even the top TR8's).

I'd want way more than 270bhp. Mine make 216 at the wheels (around 230+) on an admitted (I think optimistic set of rollers) - don't know of a Tricker TR4 currently out there.

[John Turner]

Originally Posted by jellison

So he could have won. Like I said it shouldn't be able to, maybe Ellis should get someone in to drive his car! I'm sure Reidy in that thing would be alot faster.

Ellis must be poo'ing his pants that next time out (it the Suds gear linkage holds up he will be Whoopped), especially on a tight / more technical track, like Brands or Outon / Cadwell or funnily enough Thruxton.

Ellis's cars loks like it is waiting for ever before he dare get his foot into it!

You're being very harsh on a true club racer, Jon. David Ellis does this for fun; it's a hobby; it's his car, developed for him. Why would he put anyone else in the car whilst he continues to enjoy himself? And Reidy is a professional driver so of course he'd be quicker. It misses the point though surely?

Ellis put his car on pole and was probably surprised at the pace of the Alfa which had qualified 4th, over 2.5 seconds behind. I don't think David was on particularly good form early on but once Lewis had passed him, I got the impression that he was just playing himself in. I'm not convinced that Lewis would have won that race, since I suspect Ellis would have simply built up his pace and gone by at some point. His fastest lap was on lap 14, long after Lewis had retired, and I suspect he could have gone quicker still since it was done when he was not under pressure.

The Alfa quite possibly would be quicker at tighter more technical circuits (although I doubt these cars would get to run at Cadwell) but I don't see why Ellis would get too upset about it; he knows both his and the GT700R's limitations. Like the rest of us, he is getting older and probably drives with a margin. I remember some stonking racy drives from him, years ago, when in his earlier 'yellow peril' Aston, so he does know how to race. A true gent and enthusiast is David Ellis; I'm just pleased that he brings that beastie out, when he can.

[jellison]

JT - no offense mean't on Ellis or his car. Real Pity that someone like Reid is not out there peddling the Marsh V8.

Maybe he only ups the pace later on in a race as he has such a car advantage and has no need to push it unless someone shows unexpected speed (then just opens it up "a bit more"!).

Both the Ellsi thing and particularly the Sprint to do those time is amazing (Sprint in particular must be (and seems it from the vid) and animal to drive with that kind of power through the front wheels trying to rip his arms off.

Have to come and watch next year.

I don't See my Griff even with some Mental Power SBF in it and slicks being able to do what the Ellis (or even the Sprint can do in lap time) which is pretty annoying (not that my car will be ready to race for maybe 18 months).

[nyssa7]

Originally Posted by jellison

I wonder what weight the Sprint is as I doubt I could bet mine below 800kg with a steel tub.

Pretty sure the Sprint weighs in the 600-650kg range unless the supercharger kit added loads of weight

[rogerwills]

Historic racing today is the name of the forum.......

[jellison]

Originally Posted by nyssa7

Pretty sure the Sprint weighs in the 600-650kg range unless the supercharger kit added loads of weight

Whoaa - that is LIGHT!

[John Turner]

Hey Roger, I'm the moderator round here. You are right of course, but the discussion has flowed directly from the Super GT race review I gave, so I'm partly responsible, since it's a bit of a mixed bag race. However, guys, don't let's stray too far, and you can always start a new thread in a more appropriate forum, if you wish to develop the discussion further.