Safety issues

[terence]

Why not,they are very comfortable.

[GBRM]

Originally Posted by terence bower

Why not,they are very comfortable.

I don't want to be considered as a Brazilian ****, I'm more of a "Hertfordshire" **** as my Dad used to call me; I had no Harrow accent, just a Herts twang!!

Anyway Terry, where were you today??

[terence]

Trying to sell these bloody Healeys,!They seem to be just "Hanging" at the moment,I thought there was more interest in them than I anticipated.

[LYNX]

Race licence standards in other countries - can the differences betwen other Natioanlity standards affect safety? For example in Germany in a FIA race I saw a car with a black cross, on asking I was told that it was the driver's first race. At that level one expects the people around them on the grid to have reached a certain level of experience and rely on the other competitors in tight situations to stick to their line etc.

[Eddy V]

You probably mean the novice (UK) cross, as far as I know there is no such thing in Germany.

[terence]

After watching the Brit Gts this morning,I think most of them should be carrying one!.Driving standards? What Driving Standards?

[GBRM]

Originally Posted by terence bower

After watching the Brit Gts this morning,I think most of them should be carrying one!.Driving standards? What Driving Standards?

I have only done one BRSCC ecent this year and admittiedly it was the PowerNIGHT event which is a little differant to the usual but the driving standard was very differant to the the BARC CTCRC I'm used to, I certainly wouldn't recommend it but then I know the people involved in the PowerNIGHT have much bigger budgets than those incvolved in the CTCRC so they can "afford" to be a bit more ruthless.

[Al Weyman]

Playing up for the TV probably Gregor, all budding BTCC drivers!

[LYNX]

Safety should also include the fitness of the driver. How many people do you think should not have passed the medical and are a positive menace on the circuit. The worse case I heard of was "next week I'm having my cataracts done"; said at the last race of the season.

[terence]

There is a serious discussion going on at the moment concerning the validityof the Stress Related.There are various Cardiologist,s who say that it proves only one thing,and that is that the person being tested is OK at the time of the test!.Eyesite is another case,do we all stand in front of an eyetest board at signing on?These things are down to the individual,s own judgement.

[GBRM]

I think health is a bit of a grey area to be honest and not wholly relevant to safety. I'd be interested to know if anyone could produce any figures on a driver not being "fit" to drive and causing a problem for those around him.
Obviously there are health concerns but modern medicine is better than it was even ten years ago and as long as there is a degree of common sense applied.
I know of a British hillclimb champion (in ex-F1 cars, so nothing slow!!) being refused his race license in about '95 because he had had a heart bypass (and he'd never had a heart attack) and was infinitely fitter after that then he was before but the MSA wouldn't grant him a license after that.
I also know of an extremely fit historic racing driver who had his medical at a Harley Street consultant the week before he had a massive heart attack and crashed extremely badly at Silverstone and he was the fittest person you'd probably ever meet.
As I said, grey area, you only have to look at the two/three 20-something football players who have recently had heart attacks, in every walk of life something can happen unexpectedly.

[LYNX]

Originally Posted by terence bower

There is a serious discussion going on at the moment concerning the validityof the Stress Related.There are various Cardiologist,s who say that it proves only one thing,and that is that the person being tested is OK at the time of the test!.Eyesite is another case,do we all stand in front of an eyetest board at signing on?These things are down to the individual,s own judgement.

Having a cardio-thoracic background I would agree that the stress related test does not give a comprehensive indication of cardiac health as has been shown by a number of research studies. As far as eyesight is concerned in a lot of cases the individual is unaware of a gradual deterioration over a period of time. Eye tests should include visual fields as well as an eye chart. The example I gave re cataracts is extreme but true, the driver concerned did not realise that in order for a cataract operation to be performed his vision, in his case both eyes, was seriously compromised. I do not consider that to be safe nor should the responsibility lay solely with the driver to retire him/herself from racing as they are a potential danger everytime they drive onto a circuit, let alone the road. The medical should have highlighted it BUT how many drivers have a 'sympathetic' doctor to sign on the dotted line.

[GBRM]

I can only speak from personal experiences but I know how much motor racing meant to my Dad and luckily when he passed away it was just him by himself but there was no other way I or he would have wanted to go and I think most people would agree with that. To be fair the coroner said it could have happened at any time and the fact who was on a race circuit at the time was meaningless but that's not to say it was right or he was fit but he did have to have an interview with the MSA each year, so maybe the problem lies a bit higher up the chain??
I think eyesight problems is a very differant issue and I'd like to know what the MSA in the UK do about that, I assume it's not a tested thing??

[terence]

I entirely agree with you Lynx on the eyesight thing,but,as you say,it is something that creep,s up on us.Peripheral vision in some respects is the most important,something my Doctor checks every year,as indeed is requested on the License Application form.I,m sure that any Examining Doctor would be conscious of the importance of this though.Most Drivers can stand in front of the chart,perhaps even remember the bottom line!,read it off,and get through the test.The only way to ensure that all is well during the Season would be to have a three monthly test,can you imagine the fallout if that happened!

[terence]

Just had a thought! When we sign on,there could be a couple of post,s leading to the desk,if they were placed in such a way that those with poor peripheral vision crashed into them------

[zefarelly]

good idea . . . My doc checked my peripheral when I last had a medical.

he said I was like a barn owl . . . which you need to be with some of the cars/drivers out at the moment!!!

[terence]

One thing thats needed for Spa!

[LYNX]

In single seaters it's difficult to see anything in the mirrors even with perfect vision - which is why I feel so strongly about this particular issue and hoped you would add to the discussion.

[GBRM]

Originally Posted by LYNX

In single seaters it's difficult to see anything in the mirrors even with perfect vision - which is why I feel so strogly about this particular issue and hoped you would add to the discussion.

There should be some sort of eye test but then it's the same with drviving licenses too, from a safety point of view there should be more testing. Tricky one really.

[Eddy V]

Reading all this about eyesight makes me realise why drivers never see the flags.

[LYNX]

Especially blue ones!

[JimW]

Originally Posted by zefarelly

good idea . . . My doc checked my peripheral when I last had a medical.

he said I was like a barn owl . . . which you need to be with some of the cars/drivers out at the moment!!!

I'm sure your doctor meant to be complimentary but in fact, compared to humans, owls have "tunnel" vision.

http://www.owlpages.com/articles.php...y&title=Vision

Now if he had said vision like a woodcock, his point would have been better made. (Except that you would lack much depth perception.)

Regards

Jim

[GBRM]

What about the African Swallow's eyesight; any good?

[LYNX]

Better ask Michael Palin! Think it's mentioned in a Monty Python sketch possibly 'MP and The Holy Grail'?

[terence]

Originally Posted by JimW

I'm sure your doctor meant to be complimentary but in fact, compared to humans, owls have "tunnel" vision.

http://www.owlpages.com/articles.php...y&title=Vision

Now if he had said vision like a woodcock, his point would have been better made. (Except that you would lack much depth perception.)

Regards

Jim

Have Woodcocks got long beak,s though Jim.

Lynx,I fully appreciate and agree with you,r view,s.I,m all for added Driver Safety,but there is only so much the authority,s can do.The onus for individual drivers safety rest,s on thier own shoulders,I realise that there are quite a few out there who tend to be very hard charger,s.It,s simply a case of recognizing who they are and staying out of thier way.As for the restricted rear view with Single Seaters,yes ,I have experience of them,if they create a problem,then maybe that,s the area that need,s addressing?As said ,I,m all for improvement in safety and back it 100%.