USCC (leave your axe outside)

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by joeb

Who cares if the tudor cars are on track Wednesday, I'll be there and that's what's really important.

Well then, I guess I'll have to make sure I am there....

[Deleted]

Does the pre-PLM testing on previous weekend still exist or has that been axed as well? Foolish if so

One of the growing issues of Petit Le Mans now is umm, the lack of Petit Le Mans? It feels more like 'Continental Tire Road Atlanta 1000 Miles'. I'd say it's still my favorite North American event out there but it needs to head more back to it's roots as well as get some of the ACO recognition back. At least there is no clash with WEC now so that's something

[Maelochs]

Sebring as well as Petit would definitely benefit form more practice time, more build-up ... these are the biggest two races on the schedule from the fans' perspective. These are the events for which fans have been taking off a week of work for ever (or since 1999) to come see.

If TUSC is afraid they will overshadow Daytona ... well, they can cut off their collective nose to spite their confused-looking face when all three races suffer. or they can recognize what the fans want and try to supply that product--it's called "doing business." I realize neither ALMS not Rolex management had much experience with that.

BTW--when and where is the Joeb autograph session?

[LouisTheShark]

The shorter schedule was requested by teams as many of them are running out of money. This is the first year in many years that most teams had to content with 4 or 5 (if you want to include Le Mans) endurance races in one year. The event schedules and official tests at the beginning of the year were longer and money draining. I am hearing to expect big changes for 2015 to bring weekends and budgets back to a sustainable levels. Even the big boys, like Corvette, were complaining about the money drain.

[Deleted]

Yeah but at the same time with there now being NAEC-only teams that have huge gaps in the schedule and would gladly have extra track time I assume, this reduction isn't good news for everybody. You have loads of practice for Daytona and Sebring but almost nothing for PLM... also not exactly inviting towards European teams (not that we are expecting them, but old PLM was more friendly in that aspect)

I'd say that if nothing else to bring more Petit to Petit, IMSA should at least beg ACO to bring back the auto invites. LMP2 entry for P & PC winners, GTE for GTLM & GTD.

I'm gonna miss seeing Rebellion sweeping through the esses. Even running against no-one after Pickett melted down (and Dyson was nowhere) it was fantastic.

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Does the pre-PLM testing on previous weekend still exist or has that been axed as well? Foolish if so

Only thing I can find is here:
http://www.roadatlanta.com/images/pd...t-schedule.pdf
One day of support series testing on Tuesday.

One of the growing issues of Petit Le Mans now is umm, the lack of Petit Le Mans? It feels more like 'Continental Tire Road Atlanta 1000 Miles'. I'd say it's still my favorite North American event out there but it needs to head more back to it's roots as well as get some of the ACO recognition back. At least there is no clash with WEC now so that's something

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Sebring as well as Petit would definitely benefit form more practice time, more build-up ... these are the biggest two races on the schedule from the fans' perspective. These are the events for which fans have been taking off a week of work for ever (or since 1999) to come see.

If TUSC is afraid they will overshadow Daytona ... well, they can cut off their collective nose to spite their confused-looking face when all three races suffer. or they can recognize what the fans want and try to supply that product--it's called "doing business." I realize neither ALMS not Rolex management had much experience with that.

It was pretty cool that there was a solid week of focus on Braselton for this event. Now it appears to be just "another event" and they want to have everyone show up Thursday for a shakedown.

BTW--when and where is the Joeb autograph session?

you may be able to find the legend himself in T4 but not sure if that is the selected location for said autograph session.

Originally Posted by LouisTheShark

The shorter schedule was requested by teams as many of them are running out of money. This is the first year in many years that most teams had to content with 4 or 5 (if you want to include Le Mans) endurance races in one year. The event schedules and official tests at the beginning of the year were longer and money draining. I am hearing to expect big changes for 2015 to bring weekends and budgets back to a sustainable levels. Even the big boys, like Corvette, were complaining about the money drain.

That's an interesting point and seems logical. However, I should complain about the money drain as I have just paid the same ticket price for less on track time than the year before.

[Deleted]

Lol support series test day and the main one is left in the dark.

I checked Sunday-Monday schedules (the traditional PLM test dates) from IMSA.com and there was zero track action, just supplier and trailer load-ins... and as said Wednesday is now for scrutineering instead of "promoter's test day" too

There's less actual official practice time as well, last year it was 5 hours, now it's 4½... well at least warm-up is still 25 mins

[Fogelhund]

The lack of testing in the week leading up to the event is really reflective of the lack of Audi, Peugeot, etc, and other big budgets racing. As Louis has stated, the budgets aren't there, the level has changed.

[Maelochs]

@Louis the Shark: yes, I know the rationale for cutting the running time, but I have also heard about teams complain that since they have to show up a day early anyway, and pay food and lodging, how big is the savings versus another couple tanks of gas and a set of tires to gain more data.

There is also the very real issue of fan satisfaction. Running time has been drastically cut, so how many fans are going to consider making Petit a Saturday-only event, or show up sometime Friday to see quali and then come back for the race? It's not like people are flocking to the track to see the Playboy Mazda cars.

For me Sebring and Petit were always drive no work Tuesday, watch racing Wednesday through Saturday. Now ... well, see above comments about Playboy Mazda.

Cost-cutting is a great idea, but when it leads to value-cutting it is self-defeating. offering less works okay the first time, but the second time, consumers feel cheated and don't come back, and everybody loses.

If TUSC expands its schedules a bit next season, seeing as the teams will have adapted to the new schedule (and DP teams won't have to drop several hundred thousand to be real cars) then TUSC will have made a wise decision. If the race weekend schedules stay compressed, at least for the key events ... TUSC will have further hastened its own failure.

Meanwhile ... time to pull out the track map and start thinking of vantage points ... I will have a lot less time to watch from different places so I need to plan better.

[Deleted]

Well putting less track time in general aside, if we look at the qualifying day

Mazda Race 2
Lites Race 2
USCC Practice 4
Porsche Cup Race 2
CTSCC Race (2h 30min ie in a way feature length itself)
USCC Qualifying
Lamborghini Race 2

I'd still say that's bloody great package for non-feature-event-day (whatever you think of the main series), and vastly superior to ACO series packages, other than at Le Mans and possibly Silverstone Tourist Trophy (because of ELMS) and CotA. The other events have like one local Porsche Cup series or Formula 3 running 30 minute sprint.

In fact, I'd say that apart from the awesome circuits they have on the calendar, IMSA support package is the best thing about this circus. The feature series itself might be... whatever and shadow of the ALMS, but they've got a good gang lined up around them.

[Maelochs]

I wholly agree, Chianna--which is why I suspect some folks might cut that Wednesday-Saturday trip to Friday and Saturday only.

I haven't checked the schedule yet--is the TUSC practice an hour or something more substantial?

[Deleted]

Thu P1 - 1h
Thu P2 - 1h
Thu P3 - 1h30min
Fri P4 - 1h
Fri Q - 4x15min
Sat Warm-up - 25min

Meanwhile in comparison to the 5h10min pre-race track time of USCC entrant, CTSCC entrant gets 3h30mins pre-track time for their race which is around 70-75% shorter

Btw if the cautions are as frequent and take as long as at Sebring AND taking the way-slower-than-LMP1 DP/P2 pace into consideration, we might just have to forget 1000 miles as they might get closer to 10 hours cutout than ever before (not counting 2009)

[Coach Ep]

Here's a detailed schedule for the Petit (probably not the most recent one but hey): http://www.imsa.com/sites/default/fi...s%20072814.pdf

The main show not having running time on Wednesday is nothing new, has been like that for a number of years, not sure if it was different last year but wasn't there.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

The main show not having running time on Wednesday is nothing new, has been like that for a number of years, not sure if it was different last year but wasn't there.

No it hasn't...
http://www.roadatlanta.com/2013/Peti...ule-7-2-13.pdf

And prior that from 2012 backwards on top of the Wednesday they also had Sunday-Monday pre-event testing

[Coach Ep]

Hmm, might be mistaken with Sebring then. Or just plain getting old!

[TF110]

Pretty soon it wont be called Petit Le Mans. It'll just be petit; petit entries, petit atmosphere, petit race. Im no debbie downer, but the grand events are losing their luster with tusc.

[CyberMotor]

Originally Posted by LouisTheShark

The event schedules and official tests at the beginning of the year were longer and money draining. ... Even the big boys, like Corvette, were complaining about the money drain.

If only they had listened to me and frozen all the specs for each class and got on with it. That would've saved 10's of millions of bucks, would've made it a MUCH more interesting year without all the manipulation, while lessons learned could be hashed out over the Fall of 2014 and the early Winter of 2015. Then, everyone could've come out shaking hands and getting on with it.

Tudor should be putting big bucks into sustaining and promoting the Petit Le Mans as it became either the first or second of the top sports car events in America. But, that pushed Daytona down the list and PLM out-shined Daytona, to a very large degree, for over a decade. Maybe, there is not an incentive to continue the PLM's success?

The pockets are deep enough. Is the desire to make PLM the gem that it once was still there?

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by TF110

Pretty soon it wont be called Petit Le Mans. It'll just be petit; petit entries, petit atmosphere, petit race. Im no debbie downer, but the grand events are losing their luster with tusc.

As they did with Grand Am. National events typically do...

[David Land]

Originally Posted by TF110

Pretty soon it wont be called Petit Le Mans. It'll just be petit; petit entries, petit atmosphere, petit race. Im no debbie downer, but the grand events are losing their luster with tusc.

Yep, yep and yep.

I was talking with some Tenthers last year at Petit, and we discussed how many people were showing up JUST to see the Rebellion Lola, I know their presence GREATLY affected my desire to go. It begs the question how many will go out of their way to see Daytona Prototypes likely stroll away with the race.

I certainly won't be there, and I was considering making the trip this year. I attended in both 2011 and 2013, fabulous event and second only to the Indy 500 for me personally. I am very happy to have seen it at its best, but sad that we may have lost a modern classic.

Petit attendance will be likely the most telling of where the series stands.

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by TF110

Pretty soon it wont be called Petit Le Mans. It'll just be petit; petit entries, petit atmosphere, petit race. Im no debbie downer, but the grand events are losing their luster with tusc.

We've already had that one, in 2009...

[TF110]

I know people criticize the track choice of the wec, but in order for the types of cars (lmp1 mostly) to remain in America or grow, people need to vote with their wallet. I hope the attendance is good at COTA. Ill be one of hopefully many.

[David Land]

Originally Posted by TF110

I know people criticize the track choice of the wec, but in order for the types of cars (lmp1 mostly) to remain in America or grow, people need to vote with their wallet. I hope the attendance is good at COTA. Ill be one of hopefully many.

Problem is that we ARE voting with our wallets. COTA is not a very inspiring track, and for a lot of us, don't want to see sportscars at a Tilkedome.

I would book my tickets tomorrow if the WEC went to Sebring, Road America, or Road Atlanta.

Such is the difficulty of being a US based sportscar fan... so frustrating.

[TF110]

I think cota is a great track. The runoff is excessive but imo, theres nothing bad in the layout.

[David Land]

Originally Posted by TF110

I think cota is a great track. The runoff is excessive but imo, theres nothing bad in the layout.

True.

The unfortunate reality of United States Road Racing is that we have all of these beautiful, relatively un-molested, race tracks with no proper cars or racing on them.

[LouisTheShark]

The complaints about money are real from teams and it wasn't until the paddock revolt at Laguna Seca that something was done about it. By then it was just too late, so while some changes to schedules happened, I hear for next year there will be a much more budget friendly environment. Hopefully that means that PLM can get some testing time back as those promoter test days are good income for tracks too.