Group A Ford Sierra RS500

[PAUL S]

The Pete Hall 87 car was turned into a thundersaloon later on in life, and then returned to btcc spec by its current owner a few years back.

[chunterer]

But could that mean that if it was the Dutch car, that it was then brought back into this country later on before being 'Looned'?

[Tim Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by PAUL S

The Pete Hall 87 car was turned into a thundersaloon later on in life, and then returned to btcc spec by its current owner a few years back.

Which thundersaloon was that?

[PAUL S]

looking back over my info I may be incorrect. The car I mentioned was in fact Guy Edwards 88 car in Kaliber colours, so not sure if this was the 87 car after all.

I dont know which Loon it became, I only saw pics of it after conversion back to a btcc car

[JAG]

Anyone know which RS500's used six speed gearboxes, was it just the last DJR and 'Peter Jackson' cars in Australia?

[Frank de Jong]

I didn't even know that a 6-speed box was homologated, but it is, although rather late (1/1/1991). It may have been initiated from Australia, in other countries the car had no opposition anyway or wasn't raced anymore.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by PAUL S

looking back over my info I may be incorrect. The car I mentioned was in fact Guy Edwards 88 car in Kaliber colours, so not sure if this was the 87 car after all.

I dont know which Loon it became, I only saw pics of it after conversion back to a btcc car

Thanks Paul, mind you I reckon even that car went overseas for a bit?

Without checking, does anyone know if all the 88 Rouse BTCC cars were new builds or were any carried over from '87?

[Tim Wilkinson]

Was that the one that went to Malaysia, ended up in an odd green / yellow colour-scheme?

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Frank de Jong

I didn't even know that a 6-speed box was homologated, but it is, although rather late (1/1/1991). It may have been initiated from Australia, in other countries the car had no opposition anyway or wasn't raced anymore.

I saw it on the season review, with a little research* I discovered the 'Peter Jackson' car used a 6-speed box so I assume the DJR cars used them to. With it only being homologated in '91 I guess that means only the Aussie cars used them.

*Currently making replicas of the major Group A RS500's in Forza 4.

[JAG]

Good info on the Seton car here.

http://www.ibcholdings.com.au/cars/sierra/index.html

[KA]

A few pics by Robert Clayson from the 1987 Silverstone GP meeting BTCC race- Win Percy guesting in Andy Rouse's BTCC ICS Sierra (think Andy was away at the Nurburgring race that weekend with his red WTCC Sierra)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertc...n/photostream/
He's lapping or passing one of the production saloon Sierras that appeared here- one of the Arquati cars, so either Mahony or Gravett

This is Gravett's prodsaloon Sierra...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertc...in/photostream
(I think the car in the other pic must be Mahony- note the BRSCC decal behind the fuel filler on Gravett's car, which is absent on the car in the Win Percy pic)

...and Mike Smith's Mobil car
http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertc...in/photostream

[davyboy]

I wonder what the history of this lot here is.

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by davyboy

I wonder what the history of this lot here is.

Well, the black one in the picture clearly has a sunroof aperture, so that's obviously a road car shell.
Ford did re-manufacture a batch what was known as the Group A shell (basically a standard shell, no sunroof or body sealer), and I think that whoever made the order was a little over enthusiastic as after a while they were sold off dirt cheap as they were taking up space. (I think the story at the time was that any not sold by a certain time would be sent to the crusher!). If only I'd had the space and cash at the time to have bougt all of those...

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

Well, the black one in the picture clearly has a sunroof aperture, so that's obviously a road car shell.
Ford did re-manufacture a batch what was known as the Group A shell (basically a standard shell, no sunroof or body sealer), and I think that whoever made the order was a little over enthusiastic as after a while they were sold off dirt cheap as they were taking up space. (I think the story at the time was that any not sold by a certain time would be sent to the crusher!). If only I'd had the space and cash at the time to have bougt all of those...

Very interesting... maybe Ford were targeting them at the Scandinavian rallycrossers who seemed to be voraciously 'consuming' RS500 shells in the late 80s, early 90s.

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by davyboy

Very interesting... maybe Ford were targeting them at the Scandinavian rallycrossers who seemed to be voraciously 'consuming' RS500 shells in the late 80s, early 90s.

Sadly I don't think it was that well thought out, but more along the lines of "Can we have 'x' many 3 Door Sierra shells re-made please without sunroof apertures or seam sealer?"
"Certainly sir, will that be a 50 - 50 split between left & right hand drive?"
Thought ("Bugger! Hadn't thought of that, er...")
"No, I mean that many of each" he said trying to sound confident...

[davyboy]

Nah... it would have been much simpler than that. Having worked for Ford in Warley in the early 1990s, this kind of thing would just be a matter of having one of the [nice] Essex girl secretaries filling out a purchase req on a typewriter [to indent through the triplicate] and having it signed by a VP. A few would evaporate in Dunton and the rest would get stored up in Boreham. If I'd known at the time, I probably could have gotten some for free from my mates in Dunton... Ah... those were the days

[DAVID PATERSON]

Originally Posted by VIVA GT

Well, the black one in the picture clearly has a sunroof aperture, so that's obviously a road car shell.
Ford did re-manufacture a batch what was known as the Group A shell (basically a standard shell, no sunroof or body sealer), and I think that whoever made the order was a little over enthusiastic as after a while they were sold off dirt cheap as they were taking up space. (I think the story at the time was that any not sold by a certain time would be sent to the crusher!). If only I'd had the space and cash at the time to have bougt all of those...

The ad says that the black one is a road car shell and one of the primer shells is also road car, but the other one in primer is a motorsport shellm with no sunroof.

On the same page they also list a 1988 Dave Brodie Group A race car, fully restored, in white.

[PAUL S]

Ford produced a batch of new 3dr cosworth shells in 1989, 3 years after the last car was built, basically because they ran out of the original spare stockpile due to its popularity in motorsport and the fact that so many were stolen and damaged.

All manufacturers have a duty to supply essential components for at least 10 years after the model is sold, so they had no choice really. They are known as the "909" shells as thats the start of the part number Ford allocate to motorsport parts.

The problem was that the assembly line was broken down and reconstructed straight after the 3drs were originally built in early 1987 in order to enable the facelifted Mk2 sierra to be built, so Ford had to incorporate a number of mk2 parts into these mk1 shells so these 1989 "909" shells are slightly different to the originals in a number of areas.

They made 4 types in 1989 these being:-

LHD road spec
RHD road spec
LHD motorsport
RHD motorsport

The motorsport version was essentailly a set of thinner panels welded together and thats it, as it was meant for group A, where as the original 1986 motorsport was more a group N shell so much heavier.

Very few of the later motorsport shells actually ended up as racers as not soon after the rules got changed and they were no longer needed.

Simpson salvage bought up most of them and stored them for years, selling them off on exchange and mart. They went as low as £600 at one point but now command 2k plus.

I have owned quite a few of the 909 shells over the years, I sold my last new one quite recently. Oakfields ones are all from the 1989 batch

Below is a copy of the Ford advert from Autosport August 1989.

[Alex E]

If anyone has interest in an original Sierra Gp N rally car please send me a PM.

[rallycrosscraig]

nice story here, the long lost Group A racer, ex Dick Johnson then Mike Smith has re-surfaced and will be restored (having been long ago turned into a rally car and not used for many years).

http://passionford.com/forum/general...-piccs-up.html

[KA]

Now that's some find! Good to see another one coming out of the woodwork...

[RS 500 Registrar t]

I submitted a reply to this post but its gone ??

[RS 500 Registrar t]

Originally Posted by rallycrosscraig

nice story here, the long lost Group A racer, ex Dick Johnson then Mike Smith has re-surfaced and will be restored (having been long ago turned into a rally car and not used for many years).

http://passionford.com/forum/general...-piccs-up.html

Hi All

I am the lucky fella who has been asked to do the resto on this missing DJR2 car

Ill post some pics as i go along

Paul

[KA]

A few 1988 BTCC shots by Kevin Gutteridge.

Thruxton- Jerry Mahony tangling with Guy Edwards:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...n/photostream/

Brands- Chris Hodgetts in the Brooklyn car:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...in/photostream

Mike Newman, Robb Gravett and Laurence Bristow
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...n/photostream/

Andy Rouse, Steve Soper & Karl Jones on lap 1- this is the beginning of the famous Rouse v Soper duel that would continue for the entire race...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...n/photostream/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxFjyMUWLF8

and 1987- Andy Rouse at Silverstone
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...57629435991339

[VIVA GT]

Originally Posted by KA

A few 1988 BTCC shots by Kevin Gutteridge.

Thruxton- Jerry Mahony tangling with Guy Edwards:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...n/photostream/

Brands- Chris Hodgetts in the Brooklyn car:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...in/photostream

Mike Newman, Robb Gravett and Laurence Bristow
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...n/photostream/

Andy Rouse, Steve Soper & Karl Jones on lap 1- this is the beginning of the famous Rouse v Soper duel that would continue for the entire race...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...n/photostream/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxFjyMUWLF8

and 1987- Andy Rouse at Silverstone
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hard_dr...57629435991339

A great set of pictures there young man, well found.
(Funnily enough I was looking through this old thread late last night and was sorely tempted to just bump it back into sight. Glad I didn't bother now as your post is far more interesting...)