[Official] Dutch Grand Prix 2021: Grand Prix Weekend Thread - Round 13 of 22

[bjohnsonsmith]

Congrats to Mad Max on winning his home GP. Just settling down to watch the highlights on C4, something I haven't done in a long time, to see how he did it and how the race unfolded.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Greem

It's a race that's being run by the strategists at the moment.



In surprising news, 45 laps in and serve only had one spin (Vettel) and no crashes. Mazepin pushed back into the garage a couple of laps back.



The first lap was *epic*. Two, three wide through the first few corners and only tiny bits of contact.

Very much so, until they strung out after the first 2 laps. Start was very clean and interesting. It did not seem like following was too tough here in the dirty air but many times the following car was on the softer of the tires

[Adam43]

Seems like Pirelli did a good job a again to give us a race.

[Lancsbreaker]

Only saw the C4 highlights, but a number of things strike me :


Pre-race there was much talk (not necessarily here) of how it was impossible to overtake, and how there would be a great risk of red-flags or Safety Cars......neither of which prognostications turned out to have much justification. I don't think I even saw a yellow flag, although Vettel's half-spin, only seen in the post-race wrap-up, probably caused one. Quite a few good overtaking moves, in unlikely places, sometimes....


Bottas is clearly history - a half-hearted attempt to play the team game, but no real defence against Verstappen to aid Hamilton, then querying the instruction to not go for fastest lap, followed by outright disobedience (although Toto claimed it was accidental......). However, Hamilton's response was a more emphatic "up-yours" than Bottas's had been Although the only other driver unlapped by Verstappen and Hamilton, Bottas was never really in the fight, irrespective of different strategies.


Really liked the circuit! May aim to go next year - it's likely cheaper to attend than Silverstone, and I can visit my Dutch mates.

[Adam43]

FWIW, Vettel’s spin did cause a brief yellow.

I think that Bottas did do it accidentally. I think it was pretty easy to go fast as the car was practically in qualifying spec. Maybe he wanted to show he could have, and he did ease off at the end of the lap. It was mentioned to the tune of 0.8s in the final sector, but it was still fastest! It did mean Lewis has no problem getting it back.

[Tourer]

Enjoyed the race - the cars and the commitment needed are so good to watch around here & the crowd input really added.

So after some swings and roundabouts we're back to almost even-stevens in the title race - game on there and with a completely different challenge to look forward to next weekend.

Looking forward to Monza after enjoying this one.

[Richard C]

A few last thoughts.

I don't think Bottas was really trying to get fast lap. He was purple in the first two sectors and was probably quick in the last, but did lift to not do a quick last sector. I think he was trying to make a point to show that he "could have done it", but it ended up being fastest lap anyhow! The one Lewis did moments later was 1.4 seconds quicker. I think Wolff and Hamilton was all smiles and downplaying it, but I am sure if somehow Lewis had not gotten the fastest lap, it would have been a different story.

As to why the brought Bottas in. I assume that they were planning on bringing Lewis in to improve upon the fastest lap given it was probably not that quick of a fast lap (see above about Bottas accidently getting it). But if they were to bring Lewis in, would that have not put him behind Bottas? Then they would have to both allow Lewis to get a quick lap AND orchestrate a pass on Bottas. Plus it created the potential of him running in dirty air behind Bottas?

So just bring Bottas in to push him back away from Lewis, but still safely in third. Then bring Lewis in. If they had brought Lewis in first and placed him third, that created a risk of something happening (red flag crash that stops the race, or maybe even Bottas ignoring orders and not pitting and keeping second) and putting the 2nd place for Lewis at risk.

Great drives from Gasly and Alonso. I think there needs to be more discussion on how well those two did. And interesting drama between the drivers at Haas. I think the track produced better racing than expected. I was not surprised by the qty of orange smoke.

Richard

[Taxi645]

I think Bottas was just ****ed off they were not honoust about it. Just say we gonna pit you to give Lewis space to also pit and go for fastest lap.

[P38 in workshop]

The fans might have been rather partisan but they certainly gave the event their enthusiastic support.I doubt the tifosi will make any more noise next weekend.Such a nice change from some of the more modern circuits with sparse attendances and no distinctive features.

[S griffin]

Certainly enjoyed the highlights. Great battle between Lewis and Max. Bottas once again doing the team job, quite funny seeing him briefly take the fastest lap.

Hard luck for Giovinazzi after qualifying so high up and then getting that puncture.

Great recovery from Checo, proof you can overtake at this circuit. Just like the old days, we saw plenty of action into Tarzan

Great drive by Gasly, started fourth, finished fourth

[ascarracinguk]

i wouldnt say an interesting race, but for some reason this weekend felt 'wholesome'...wierd to explain.

It was interesting to hear from Ziggo Sport and Dutch drivers saying the booing is mainly coming from football fans whove come across to motorsport since Max has started winning....which they dont approve of or like.

Even as a Hamilton fan, im glad Max won on home turf, he looked incredible in that car all weekend.

Tbh, after all the world has gone through, and the dutch cancellation last year, its good to see the home boy win.

Lewis did very well to recover a lack of track time and to minimise the points deficit by getting fastest lap was probably the best he could hope for, so maximised from that point of view.

Bottas 'fastest lap'....yeh hes a man that knows hes gone. i dont think he intended to set fastest lap, but certianly intended to make a point by getting the first 2 sectors purple.

To those saying its not fair to compromise Bottas, stop him getting points etc, its a team game...people seem to forget Red Bull pulling in Perez at Silverstone, costing him championship points, just to get the fastest lap point taken off hamilton.


In the end, not the best grand prix.....but the 'right' result. Fair play Max, Red Bull and the Dutch fans.

Roll on Monza!

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

I love Turn 3, so strange watching the overhead view and seeing them run out so much. It looks like they've run wide and are going off the track!

There then follows a really nice succession of corners. Satisfying to watch and would love to drive it. The last corner seems an easy run in qually, but could provide something tasty in the race.
.

Which makes me think, would Turn 1 benefit from being banked too? there was a couple of good passes, but the extreme inside looked too dirty or not a sharp enough stop to promote overtaking....

...i wonder if they made it banked, if it would promote more overtaking....or a sharper stop in theory.

DRS zone didnt seem powerful enough, so i guess they will try to run wide open on the banking next year too.

[S griffin]

Tarzan is cambered enough and we saw plenty of side by side action, so I don’t think it needs massive banking

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

Which makes me think, would Turn 1 benefit from being banked too? there was a couple of good passes, but the extreme inside looked too dirty or not a sharp enough stop to promote overtaking....

...i wonder if they made it banked, if it would promote more overtaking....or a sharper stop in theory.

DRS zone didnt seem powerful enough, so i guess they will try to run wide open on the banking next year too.

Turn 1 is banked. Probably be easier to overtake if it wasn’t.

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

i wouldnt say an interesting race, but for some reason this weekend felt 'wholesome'...wierd to explain.

I can relate to that. After Spa, a full house, some Indian Summer sunshine by the beach. I was a chilled vibe that F1 needed after Spa.

It was interesting to hear from Ziggo Sport and Dutch drivers saying the booing is mainly coming from football fans whove come across to motorsport since Max has started winning....which they dont approve of or like.

Luckily, Jan Lammers and Guido van de Garde asked for some respect for the 7 time world champion, which in the end he got. Missed opportunity for Verstappen to rise above and ask his fans the same and teach them how it's done in motorsport.

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

DRS zone didnt seem powerful enough, so i guess they will try to run wide open on the banking next year too.

I'm not sure it is really necessary next year, with the new aero regulation. If you look at the Verstappen Bottas pass, you could see Verstappen using every milimeter of track in the corner before the banked one to stay as close as possible. He was already very close even before entering the DRS zone. If next year the cars can follow much better in corner 14 then everyone will be much closer going into the banked corner.

It would be a shame if they extended the DRS into the banking and then find out overtaking becomes TOO easy.

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

I can relate to that. After Spa, a full house, some Indian Summer sunshine by the beach. I was a chilled vibe that F1 needed after Spa.



Luckily, Jan Lammers and Guido van de Garde asked for some respect for the 7 time world champion, which in the end he got. Missed opportunity for Verstappen to rise above and ask his fans the same and teach them how it's done in motorsport.



I'm not sure it is really necessary next year, with the new aero regulation. If you look at the Verstappen Bottas pass, you could see Verstappen using every milimeter of track in the corner before the banked one to stay as close as possible. He was already very close even before entering the DRS zone. If next year the cars can follow much better in corner 14 then everyone will be much closer going into the banked corner.

It would be a shame if they extended the DRS into the banking and then find out overtaking becomes TOO easy.

Agree on all this.

Think the main reason Max could get close though was grip. new tyres v old around a high speed corner....not sure hed have been able to that on equal tyres

[Taxi645]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

Agree on all this.

Think the main reason Max could get close though was grip. new tyres v old around a high speed corner....not sure hed have been able to that on equal tyres

Agreed, but that might be compensated next year with the new aero which allows better following even on equal tires. We'll have to wait and see the first few races of next year.

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by Taxi645

Agreed, but that might be compensated next year with the new aero which allows better following even on equal tires. We'll have to wait and see the first few races of next year.

Yes I am looking forward to hopefully seeing cars battling closer next year

[FIRE]

Because the track was new on the schedule new it was interesting to watch the race but in the future normally it will be a boring race.

I was surprised there were no crashes.

[crmalcolm]

Formula 1 fan arrested after being mistaken for mafia boss

'A Formula 1 fan from Liverpool was arrested at gunpoint in the Netherlands after being mistaken for a mafia boss.

The 54-year-old, known only as Mark L, was blindfolded and led away by police in The Hague on Wednesday who thought they had captured Sicilian crime lord Matteo Messina Denaro, 59.

Mark L, who had attended the grand prix on 5 September, has now been freed, the Dutch Public Prosecutor's Office said.'

[Aysedasi]

Confused by the accent?

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Formula 1 fan arrested after being mistaken for mafia boss

'A Formula 1 fan from Liverpool was arrested at gunpoint in the Netherlands after being mistaken for a mafia boss.

The 54-year-old, known only as Mark L, was blindfolded and led away by police in The Hague on Wednesday who thought they had captured Sicilian crime lord Matteo Messina Denaro, 59.

Mark L, who had attended the grand prix on 5 September, has now been freed, the Dutch Public Prosecutor's Office said.'

This almost belongs in the Weird Local News Thread