FIA F2 2010 season discussion

[icemachine]

Any news on Robert Wickens - I heard he'd been talking to some F1 teams, but nothing concrete. The Toronto Star's Norris MacDonald also reported he had lost his Redbull backing.

[Mak]

Originally Posted by icemachine

Any news on Robert Wickens - I heard he'd been talking to some F1 teams, but nothing concrete. The Toronto Star's Norris MacDonald also reported he had lost his Redbull backing.

Red Bull timed telling Robert he was off the programme extremely well, the day before his last race. Its a fabulous scheme, but I wish they would be more consistent with their drivers. Out of all the drivers Robert certainly was not the one who should have been dropped on performance, and I could see him developing into a top line driver with continued support.

Intersting to see some good drivers testing in Portimeo next week, Smith, Summerton and Tappy. I expected most to defer until the upgrades were done in the new year.

[duke_toaster]

I wouldn't be surprised if Duncan Tappy stayed in SF to be honest.

[strider]

Originally Posted by Shaddix

Summerton twittered he is testing F2 next week at Algarve

Dean Smith is doing that test, too.

He's already had an F3 test, talks about targeting GP3 but, as far as I know has never been one of the well-funded drivers, so F2 may be where he ends up.

[kipper]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

I wouldn't be surprised if Duncan Tappy stayed in SF to be honest.

If Tappy were to stay in Superleague (although he only did two events in '09), then I would suspect that it would be in conjunction with an attack on another formula, such as F2. Although the profile of Superleague is growing, it has yet to be demonstrated that this could be a feeder formula for say, F1 or Indy Cars. Although, similar things could be said in regards to F2, it does have the benefit of the Williams test for the winner.

[sauber11]

New formula2 car will be presented at Lugo(Spain) roadshow 13 december , day after testing at Portimao.

[Mak]

Originally Posted by sauber11

New formula2 car will be presented at Lugo(Spain) roadshow 13 december , day after testing at Portimao.

Won't be the 2010 car as they still have not finalised the spec, and also they are re casting gearbox etc..

[sauber11]

22 drivers overall testing at Portimao 11-12 december.
http://www.formulatwo.com/
Renger Van Der Zande testing one day , also three 2009 f-master drivers arrived.

[sauber11]

Other series times at Portimao:
1.30.8 GP2
1.33.4 WSR
1.37.5 F3

Morning session
1. Dean Smith, 1:35.660s ( 1.35.137 also mentioned).
2. Johan Jokinen, 1:36.294s
3. Ramon Pineiro, 1:36.305s
4. Benjamin Bailly, 1:36.318s
5. Duncan Tappy, 1:36.522s
6. Jolyon Palmer, 1:36.704s
7. Kazim Vasiliauskas, 1:36.718s
8. Benjamin Lariche, 1:36.814s
9. Jack Clarke, 1:36.873s
10. Nico Muller, 1:36.927s
11. Mihai Marinescu, 1:37.352s
12. Alex Brundle, 1:37.354s
13. Kelvin Snoeks, 1:37.374s
14. Jose Alonso Liste, 1:37.656s
15. Ivan Samarin, 1:37.783s
16. Ricardo Teixeira, 1:37.900s
17. Paul Rees, 1:38.749s

Afternoon session
1. Kazim Vasiliauskas, 1:36.593s
2. Johan Jokinen, 1:36.627s
3. Dean Smith, 1:36.846s
4. Duncan Tappy, 1:36.956s
5. Jack Clarke, 1:36.965s
6. Benjamin Bailly, 1:37.046s
7. Jolyon Palmer, 1:37.048s
8. Benjamin Lariche, 1:37.158s
9. Alex Brundle, 1:37.395s
10. Nico Muller, 1:37.544s
11. Mihai Marinescu, 1:37.744s
12. Jose Alonso Liste, 1:37.845s
13. Ricardo Teixeira, 1:37.934s
14. Kelvin Snoeks, 1:38.123s
15. Ivan Samarin, 1:38.241s
16. Paul Rees, 1:38.287s

Andy Soucek testing new parts for 2010 - thus his times unknown , but reported he is the fastest man on track.

http://f2.gpupdate.net/en/news/2009/...ds-to-30-cars/
2010 Formula 2 grid expands to 30 cars

[GroupOfOne]

Races aso increased to 40 minutes in duration.

Nice to see Teixeira keeping up his previous single seater form.

[kerrmanningjarv]

Originally Posted by Mak

Red Bull timed telling Robert he was off the programme extremely well, the day before his last race. Its a fabulous scheme, but I wish they would be more consistent with their drivers. Out of all the drivers Robert certainly was not the one who should have been dropped on performance, and I could see him developing into a top line driver with continued support.

Intersting to see some good drivers testing in Portimeo next week, Smith, Summerton and Tappy. I expected most to defer until the upgrades were done in the new year.

How can they drop him? He has been winning races and showing great speed in A1GP, WSR, F2 and F3 for the past 3 or so years, bonehead decision from Red Bull.

[runshaw]

Originally Posted by kerrmanningjarv

How can they drop him? He has been winning races and showing great speed in A1GP, WSR, F2 and F3 for the past 3 or so years, bonehead decision from Red Bull.

I agree its bizarre. How can they drop him after he finished as vice-champion in F2, yet keep Brendon Hartley who has had a shocking season and completely under-performed!

[sauber11]

Day two results
1. Jolyon Palmer, 1:35.519s
2. Dean Smith, 1:35.599s
3. Renger van der Zande, 1:35.613s
4. Kevin Mirocha, 1:35.629s
5. Kazim Vasiliauskas, 1:35.635s
6. Duncan Tappy, 1:35.694s
7. Johan Jokinen, 1:35.712s
8. Alex Brundle, 1:35.952s
9. Benjamin Lariche, 1:36.040s
10. Tristan Vautier, 1:36.046s
11. Benjamin Bailly, 1:36.194s
12. Mihai Marinescu, 1:36.196s
13. Ivan Samarin, 1:36.289s
14. Jonathan Summerton, 1:36.305s
15. Jack Clarke, 1:36.438s
16. Ricardo Teixeira, 1:36.601s

Jonathan shows his worth , i hope Peter Windsor saw that.
And i bet Dean Smith forgets his plan to graduate gp3 and stays here - all sessions in top3.

[N.A-D.R]

I wouldn't conclude Summerton from that test. He will get quicker and quicker and i would definately put money on him to shine in 2010.

[jab]

Originally Posted by runshaw

I agree its bizarre. How can they drop him after he finished as vice-champion in F2, yet keep Brendon Hartley who has had a shocking season and completely under-performed!

Because Hartley got messed around between 2 different series with 2 completely different cars and had a poor F3 team, whilst Wickens was on a completely level playing field and got made to look vastly inferior by a driver who was mediocre in GP2. Add in his poor year in 2008 in the World Series, I can totally understand their decision - they've got to give Hartley another chance before dropping him, as he's been superb up until now, but Wickens' second chance was this year and he didn't do enough

[Mak]

Originally Posted by jab

Because Hartley got messed around between 2 different series with 2 completely different cars and had a poor F3 team, whilst Wickens was on a completely level playing field and got made to look vastly inferior by a driver who was mediocre in GP2. Add in his poor year in 2008 in the World Series, I can totally understand their decision - they've got to give Hartley another chance before dropping him, as he's been superb up until now, but Wickens' second chance was this year and he didn't do enough

Could also be that there is a bigger differences in the teams in GP2. Soucek did a very good job at F1 test. I think Wickens did very well in F2 but was unlucky with early mechanical issues. Red Bull have always been odd with their driver decisions.

[sauber11]

They dropped Mirko Bortolotti now - down to 5 drivers.
http://www.redbull-juniorteam.com/in...ng=eng&fresh=1

[runshaw]

Originally Posted by jab

Because Hartley got messed around between 2 different series with 2 completely different cars and had a poor F3 team, whilst Wickens was on a completely level playing field and got made to look vastly inferior by a driver who was mediocre in GP2. Add in his poor year in 2008 in the World Series, I can totally understand their decision - they've got to give Hartley another chance before dropping him, as he's been superb up until now, but Wickens' second chance was this year and he didn't do enough

But then you can just say Wickens got messed around between 2 different series with 2 completely different cars last year. He raced in WSbR and F3 Euroseries last year as well, and was a race winner in both, unlike Hartley this year. Wickens 'poor' season in WSbR last year was better than Hartley's this year anyway. So I don't see any logic in that. Hartley has been racing single-seaters since 2002, he's not exactly risen rapidly. Wickens has raced since 2005 and scored more wins than Brendon in a much shorter space of time. If Wickens didn't do enough this year to keep his Red Bull seat, I don't understand why you think Hartley did!

[jab]

Originally Posted by sauber11

They dropped Mirko Bortolotti now - down to 5 drivers.
http://www.redbull-juniorteam.com/in...ng=eng&fresh=1

Now that is strange decision, given that he has only just tested for STR (which doesn't even get mentioned in the article announcing the new RBJT). Must be something going on there

Juncadella's gone too. So that's just the 2 Antipodeans and Vergne being joined by Sainz Jr and Kyvat (token Russian to replace Aleshin?)

Originally Posted by runshaw

But then you can just say Wickens got messed around between 2 different series with 2 completely different cars last year.

Yes, he did. So they gave him another chance this year, as they are doing with Hartley. And he didn't do enough, so he's gone. It's fair cop - you have one not-so-good season, then fair enough, but 2 and you're out. Hartley's only had one duff year so far so it would be unfair to kick him out over that

F2 was Wickens' last chance in the same way that WSR next year will be Hartley's last chance. And unless Hartley wins the series, he'll be gone - I get the impression he's already slipping out of favour, as seen by him testing for STR and Ricciardo jumping straight in at Red Bull

[WSR Fan]

Originally Posted by sauber11

They dropped Mirko Bortolotti now - down to 5 drivers.
http://www.redbull-juniorteam.com/in...ng=eng&fresh=1

As jab said, that is a weird decision. For his first year racing outside Italy, I thought finishing fourth in F2 with a win and five podiums was a great job by Mirko and he certainly deserved a second year on the RBJT IMO.

Red Bull have slimmed down the Junior Team to only five drivers next year, which is the fewest they've ever had, so I can only assume that perhaps they are focusing more of their money and resources into the F1 team given it's success this year?

[GroupOfOne]

Yeah very strange, I saw the releases (or rather the sudden disapperance) of Wickens, Aleshin & Juncadella and presumed Bortolotti would definitely stay being a) Italian b) having tested the STR and c) being of the same 'cohort' if you like of Wickens.

As you say WSR, another season in F2 and he could and should have been a title contender for Red Bull, or do they not have the spare 300,000€ anymore? Considering the relatively low sum it does seem strange not to keep him on.

Wonder if Ferrari may be interested in helping him, as they've mentioned a young driver scheme, so could be in their interests to sign him up. Badoer won't be young forever

[ivanalesi]

There is absolutely nothing strange when you consider who's the head of this program. Thank god they managed somehow properly Vettel(though I think BMW had their influence too), otherwise this program has little to brag about. Herr Marko could have picked easily more than half of the F1 grid, instead he managed to reject some of the best drivers on the grid.
May be for well-funded drivers it's better to reject Red Bull backing considering that they would have such odd career paths. I mean, Wickens had fantastic debut races in WSbR, could have had a fantastic debut season, but he was sent to F3ES the next year, only to be sent back again to WSbR and then to F2 which is about as fast as F3!?!?!?

[miniman]

I get the impression, that over the years, Red Bull look more at marketing opportunities in countries for their product than at the drivers as individuals. So, all may be good drivers, but if they need to plug the product, then the driver from that country keeps sponsorship.

[jab]

Oh absolutely. I don't think it's a coincidence that Red Bull's juniors generally come from countries that haven't produced many F1 drivers, such as New Zealand, Australia, Russia and Canada. Plus Klien was token Austrian to start with. They also made a push to sign Bourdais to Toro Rosso for the French market. I'm surprised they haven't backed a Japanese driver, though - they've struggled out there

[Go_For_Pole]

Generally I agree jab however in the case of Kvyat he is hardly token because the kid has even better karting CV than Sainz. He is a good choice regardless of nationality. Also it is true that this year at least two excellent drivers rejected Red Bull contracts exactly because they had the funds anyway and of course they were concerned with the way the junior program is handled. As for Mirko, I hope for his sake that he was picked up by Ferrari because he is a very good driver. Turns out that F2 was a low cost dumpster for Red Bull, that's not good for the series.