Women in motorsport (was F.Woman) - Page 4

TimD · 13 Jul 2004, 00:18 (Ref:1034846)

Train-wreck television...

I expected it to be a bit contrived, but nothing like this. I'm honestly surprised that Vicki Butler-Henderson and Tim Harvey have lent their names to what was not a very good reality TV show, let alone an informative insight into what it takes to learn racecraft. I have to confess to having lost a hell of a lot of respect for Tim Harvey in the last fifty minutes.

We were shown people being eliminated for not taking appropriate racing lines - did we have an on-board lap showing how it ought to be done? I'm sure that would be of interest to the man and woman in the street who might be wondering if they just possibly had the right stuff to go on a track.

The drama setups were amateurish - I can only assume the director was obliged to go through fire training and helicopter escapes at film school in order to prove he was worthy of holding a cine camera, because he certainly didn't have a clue about onscreen storytelling.

The thing that really irritates me more than anything else though is that there will be plenty of people who signed up for this in good faith, and whose enthusiasm for racing may well have been snuffed out in the name of such an arbitrary exercise. The racing scene is crying out for more female drivers: they would be good for the sport and good for the profile of the sport. I only pray that this doesn't do the sport the disservice I fear.

To those who didn't get selected, please please don't give up on the dream.

ActiveMS · 13 Jul 2004, 08:11 (Ref:1035015)

Didnt realise until I watched my video'd version that they are way behind the actual happenings. Eg at Cadwell Park the other week, they were actually racing rather than still doing the eliminations.

Also didnt realise most of their track time is being spent at Cadwell.... talk about being dropped in at the deep end.
Realised why R.Firman attended Cadwell the other week, as his sister seems to be in the competition.

Did think Mr.H was being a bit tough on racing lines as its not the easiest of places to get right fist time around.

Whizz · 13 Jul 2004, 08:30 (Ref:1035026)

With regards to the Katherine Legge incident I would like to make one point. I myself was a little worried about getting in a car with her, from hearing all the stories from the other girls. So much so that I asked to be with her to get it over and done with. However when I got in the car she was pleasant and helpful and gave me helpful info that some of the other instructors hadn't. Maybe she was harsh with other girls - I don't know personally but if you are to be a racing driver then there are a lot more obstacles than just a few harsh words to contend with(Correct me if I'm wrong). If you are going to make it you have to take everything in your stride and just get on with it.

foreversideways · 13 Jul 2004, 11:26 (Ref:1035177)

I think the program would have been more informative if as suggested above more time had been spent explaining the basics (Lines, braking and turn in points) with onboard footage of Tim Harvey then of the contestants. Also why were they not using a PI Data system to compare the girls. This again would have added to the program and given the viewers a further insight. Potentially this could have been a cracking piece of TV given a little more thought. The Legge incident was i think just a piece of theatre to spice up the proceedings. She probable got a payout and had to sign a confidentiality agreement. If they are going to do this again they need to think more clearly about what they are trying to achieve. I guess it was Glews/ Harveys idea but i think that proffessional presenters would have also made a difference as neither of them were big in the personality department.

Rache · 13 Jul 2004, 11:36 (Ref:1035188)

They have to be showing more footage of what we did at Cadwell in the other programmes, there was loads of stuff missed out. I was hoping to see more onboard footage too, and specially the instructors talking about how we had driven and our good/bad points.

Would have been interesting to see them discussing who stays and who goes and the reasons why too?

Derek Legge · 13 Jul 2004, 12:08 (Ref:1035238)

Katherine is currently in America and has been advised not to comment on Formula Woman.

Fortunately i can comment and fully intend that the truth is told.

Before i comment on here i would like to ask the moderators if they are going to allow me the opportunity to fully state my inside veiw of what went on or will they just remove the thread under pressure from mr Glew.As i understand it we still have free speech in this country and if 10-tenths are worried about any legal implications i will undertake full responsibility for any actions the Directors of Formula Woman ltd or the parent company Formula Woman Holdings Ltd may take.

So do i have your support 10-tenths ?

racingdad · 13 Jul 2004, 12:12 (Ref:1035241)

Mr. Legge, as the father of a driver (and instructor) myself, you have my full support - I did think it was slightly strange and apparently harsh to go in what appeared to be for public humiliation of one of the staff... The contestants (like Big Brother) have presumably signed up for that sort of thing, but the staf????

Russfeld · 13 Jul 2004, 12:14 (Ref:1035246)

Itd be interesting to hear another viewpoint, but it'd be somewhat one sided as we probably wouldnt get a clarification from the FWomen folks on what went on re:Legge

Neil Adams · 13 Jul 2004, 12:53 (Ref:1035301)

the btcc drive prize - dont know why they'd say it if it wasnt true!

instructors trying to control slides from the passenger seat - perhaps just trying to make it look more exciting or they're worried about wrecking the cars perhaps.

Keith Wheeler · 13 Jul 2004, 13:13 (Ref:1035341)

I got the impression it was said more as 'who knows, we might see a woman driver on the BTCC grid soon', rather than 'we are going to give a BTCC drive to the FW winner'.

spider · 13 Jul 2004, 13:28 (Ref:1035366)

Am I alone in thinking that Formula Woman has generated enough positive PR now, to be able to setup a single seater branch to the brand? A dedicated single seater category for women only, in F.Ford chassis, or F.Palmer Audi cars? Just a thought, but in its current format it will be difficult to see 'Formula' teams pluckin' out RX8 drivers and plonking them in an F3/Renault/F.Ford team?

BTCC initiative is a good addition too BTW.

TimD · 13 Jul 2004, 13:48 (Ref:1035390)

I'd like to see the instructors try grabbing the steering wheel in a single seater...

Mr A Pie · 13 Jul 2004, 14:11 (Ref:1035427)

if they'ed fit in!! literally. With the exception of Kathrine she was pretty handy!!

ss_collins · 13 Jul 2004, 15:46 (Ref:1035525)

derek could you PM me with what you would like to post before you post it - it would be for the best

AussieV8 · 13 Jul 2004, 16:40 (Ref:1035574)

Well since I started the original thread about Formula Women many months ago and then it got shut down...I might as well join in.

I hope we get to see some of this racing down here but I'm not going to hold my breath...as an owner of a RX8 and have been a Mazda fan for over 25yrs, good luck to all the ladies. As to the rumour about Mazda back in BTCC, well why not another manufacture wouldn't hurt. Mazda 6 or 3 BTCC car might look prettier hot don't you think.

Derek Legge · 13 Jul 2004, 17:07 (Ref:1035604)

derek could you PM me with what you would like to post before you post it - it would be for the best

ss_collins I sent you a PM about an hour ago and isee you are still online, have you decided yet as to whether i can post or not ?

foreversideways · 13 Jul 2004, 17:38 (Ref:1035636)

Go on we wanna hear it !!!

johnw · 13 Jul 2004, 18:26 (Ref:1035679)

Perhaps you should PM all on 10/10ths Derek? It would get round the problem

Watched the show last night. Poor TV in my opinion.
Was the public sacking staged? If so, no problem. If not, unbelievably poor judgement on the part of the director and ITV.

Still it's getting lots of air time here, so somebody's winning.

ss_collins · 13 Jul 2004, 18:43 (Ref:1035690)

sorry the - online thing isn't that accurate - I was long gone! got your PM will respond shortly.

calm down you lot - its going to be few hours yet.

I saw the show last night and enjoyed though as everyone says the diving bit - totally pointless and its seems to be very much TV by numbers at times. But all said it was watchable.

TimD · 13 Jul 2004, 19:03 (Ref:1035715)

Quote:

Originally posted by johnw
Still it's getting lots of air time here, so somebody's winning.

I'm not sure I agree with the adage that there's no such thing as bad publicity. I'm really not sure the organisers are going to benefit much from this in the long run. Certainly I've heard today from someone that on the evidence of the humiliations and peculiar setups exhibited in the television programme that she will not be considering any involvement in any future season of this.

From my perspective, that first 50 minutes of TV has enhanced Katherine Legge's standing in my book. On camera, the alleged flippancy following the Cadwell off looked more like reassurance to put a candidate back at her ease as quickly as possible. The following footage displayed spectacularly poor judgement on the part of the producers, as John W says.

Knockhill TVR · 13 Jul 2004, 19:39 (Ref:1035752)

Didn't a James Crofts predict all this last year? How did he know?

Chris Y · 13 Jul 2004, 20:00 (Ref:1035770)

I don't remember Crofts predicting anything. I remember him whinging and prattling on about how all these competitons were fixed, and only he had the 'answer'.

Derek Legge · 13 Jul 2004, 20:01 (Ref:1035771)

ss_ collins

Unfortunately i dont have time this evening to call you.

Could you possibly reach a decision by tomorrow. If it helps i would be happy for you to post my PM directly on to the board.

If you cant make the decision please put me in touch with someone who can.

Thanks

redshoes · 13 Jul 2004, 20:02 (Ref:1035773)

Quote:

Originally posted by TimD
Certainly I've heard today from someone that on the evidence of the humiliations and peculiar setups exhibited in the television programme that she will not be considering any involvement in any future season of this.

I think you'll be surprised. Anyone whose watched any of the Pop Idol/PopStars shows will have seen some of the humiliation suffered by some contestants, yet every year there's queues round the block of would be hopefulls.

One thing we all seem to be forgetting here - this is not a motorsports series with a bit of TV coverage, it's a TV series first and formost. If I know Tim the sort of people he has been talking to are those who already have motorsports connection or at least know a reasonable amount about motorsport. Look at where the series was originally advertised. The target audience was Womans Weekly, not Autosport readers.

I was having a conversation with someone at work today who is an F1 fan but doesn't really know that much about motorsport outside of that. He thought the show was very good, especially the instructor getting sacked, but then again he has no idea who Katherine Legge is and probably no idea what F3 is either. That, I'm affraid is the intended TV audience.

redshoes · 13 Jul 2004, 20:09 (Ref:1035779)

Quote:

Originally posted by Knockhill TVR
Didn't a James Crofts predict all this last year? How did he know?

I don't remember James, did you?

I do remember you being banned. I remember you asking to be banned and have all your previous posts removed due to the damage you were causing to other people's careers. I also rememeber you later re-registering with numerous other IDs only to be banned again.

James, please get the message. You overstepped the line last time on more than one occation. You are not welcome back here.

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