BTCC 2013 - Any thoughts?? - Page 6

redshoes · 6 Oct 2012, 08:28 (Ref:3146970)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigma

It'll make no difference if the BMW's are sold with the N/A or turbo engine, next year rules states you have to use a full NGTC spec car to be eligible for the championship.

S2000 will still be eligible and will still score championship points, however only an NGTC driver can win the championship. In theory an S2000 could score the most points but wouldn't be crowned as champion, although in practice that's not going to happen.

Look at the bigger picture though. Just because they are BTCC cars doesn't mean they have to stay in BTCC. There are plenty of places around the world where an S2000 chassis would be competitive - some with an S2000 engine, and some not.

medius · 6 Oct 2012, 11:05 (Ref:3147033)

Very true. With a bigger tank and a detuned engine, ex-BTCC machinery does well in Britcar-type endurance races.

Aunt Sally · 6 Oct 2012, 18:32 (Ref:3147164)

Quote:

Originally Posted by davyboy

He had it up for sale here over the summer.

It's sold.

Aunt Sally · 7 Oct 2012, 21:38 (Ref:3147866)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aunt Sally

It's sold.

And it's paid for his new NGTC car for 2013!

Alfa Fan · 7 Oct 2012, 22:20 (Ref:3147884)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aunt Sally

And it's paid for his new NGTC car for 2013!

Car, not cars?

Aunt Sally · 7 Oct 2012, 23:18 (Ref:3147910)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

Car, not cars?

Yep, Just the one!

OH! And it's not a BMW as previously mentioned!

ckBrenneke · 8 Oct 2012, 07:25 (Ref:3148019)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aunt Sally

Yep, Just the one!

OH! And it's not a BMW as previously mentioned!

Has he bought the Thorney Insignia? John Thorne said he wanted to sell the Insignia so he could finish the second one. Could that be why Stockton was supposed to drive at Silverstone, part of the deal to try out NGTC machinery?

Gloria LeicesterFan · 8 Oct 2012, 08:37 (Ref:3148042)

The more I watch the NGTCs the more I wish S2000 was back.

The body roll on those things is hideous.

BtccLee · 8 Oct 2012, 12:48 (Ref:3148200)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aunt Sally

Yep, Just the one!

OH! And it's not a BMW as previously mentioned!

Do you think we may be losing Honda next year, several seem to believe so...

Alfa Fan · 8 Oct 2012, 12:56 (Ref:3148210)

Quote:

Originally Posted by BtccLee

Do you think we may be losing Honda next year, several seem to believe so...

First year I'd say this in 14 years, but I actually hope so. The series is in desperate need of attention, but Alan Gow continues to maintain that all is fine. The WTCC is a very feasible option for them for the first time now Honda are going in with a semi-works entry.

crmalcolm · 8 Oct 2012, 13:43 (Ref:3148230)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

First year I'd say this in 14 years, but I actually hope so. The series is in desperate need of attention, but Alan Gow continues to maintain that all is fine. The WTCC is a very feasible option for them for the first time now Honda are going in with a semi-works entry.

I suspect that WTCC is a definite option for Honda/TD, even more so having seen AON move to international racing.

They would still retain a presence in BTCC through Pirtek (possible rebranding slightly), and may even look for buyers (HARD?) for their 2012 cars.

Les Dennis · 8 Oct 2012, 14:01 (Ref:3148242)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

First year I'd say this in 14 years, but I actually hope so. The series is in desperate need of attention, but Alan Gow continues to maintain that all is fine. The WTCC is a very feasible option for them for the first time now Honda are going in with a semi-works entry.

Honda is a Full works entry in WTCC

Les Dennis · 8 Oct 2012, 14:02 (Ref:3148243)

Quote:

Originally Posted by BtccLee

Do you think we may be losing Honda next year, several seem to believe so...

Honda are 1 year into a three year deal with Dynamics aren't they?

Alfa Fan · 8 Oct 2012, 14:15 (Ref:3148250)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Les Dennis

Honda is a Full works entry in WTCC

If they were full works they wouldn't have Tiago Monteiro driving and only two cars.

Aunt Sally · 8 Oct 2012, 14:21 (Ref:3148251)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckBrenneke

Has he bought the Thorney Insignia? John Thorne said he wanted to sell the Insignia so he could finish the second one. Could that be why Stockton was supposed to drive at Silverstone, part of the deal to try out NGTC machinery?

No he hasn't bought the Insignia.

Apparently John Thorne has said he has other buyers seriously looking at the car.

Stocktons car will be a car that has been seen on the BTCC grid so far this year and deifintley not in NGTC form!

I'm sure we will here something official soon.

auroan · 8 Oct 2012, 14:24 (Ref:3148252)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

If they were full works they wouldn't have Tiago Monteiro driving and only two cars.

It is a full works

Monteiro was running his SEAT via private sponsorship so could end his contract mid season. Tarquini couldn't. Next year there will be THREE cars. Honda have said on a few occasions that they haven't signed the third driver yet, but it's likely to be someone from the far east.

There will also be a pair of customer cars available, in the same vain as Bamboo run their two chevy's from RML.

Les Dennis · 8 Oct 2012, 14:24 (Ref:3148253)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

If they were full works they wouldn't have Tiago Monteiro driving and only two cars.

Why wouldn't they have Tiago Montiero driving?

It's a full works effort - could be up to 5 Hondas on grid next season.

Factory teams don't always run 3 cars.

Les Dennis · 8 Oct 2012, 14:28 (Ref:3148254)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aunt Sally

No he hasn't bought the Insignia.

Apparently John Thorne has said he has other buyers seriously looking at the car.

Stocktons car will be a car that has been seen on the BTCC grid so far this year and deifintley not in NGTC form!

I'm sure we will here something official soon.

That narrows things down somewhat!

Not a BMW you say? That limits it to the Golf?

Alfa Fan · 8 Oct 2012, 14:31 (Ref:3148256)

To me a full works entry is one that hires the best drivers available for the job.

So,

Honda and MG in the BTCC are not full works entry currently. The last full works entry was Vauxhall, back in 2009 when they had Giovanardi and Neal.

In the WTCC, Chevrolet has been the only proper works team in a long, long time, as each year they've run the 3 best drivers available (in their opinion).

In the mid 2000s, Alfa Romeo, BMW, Chevrolet and SEAT all had full works teams in the WTCC. Just look at the quality of drivers all those teams hired and compare them to the "works" teams in the BTCC and WTCC.

crmalcolm · 8 Oct 2012, 14:36 (Ref:3148258)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

To me a full works entry is one that hires the best drivers available for the job.

So,

Honda and MG in the BTCC are not full works entry currently.

On your view how is Honda not a 'full works entry', when they have the leading driver in the championship and a 3-times champion?

Who should they hire to make them 'full works', especially as Plato would be one of the drivers not available.

Les Dennis · 8 Oct 2012, 14:48 (Ref:3148259)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

To me a full works entry is one that hires the best drivers available for the job.

So,

Honda and MG in the BTCC are not full works entry currently. The last full works entry was Vauxhall, back in 2009 when they had Giovanardi and Neal.

In the WTCC, Chevrolet has been the only proper works team in a long, long time, as each year they've run the 3 best drivers available (in their opinion).

In the mid 2000s, Alfa Romeo, BMW, Chevrolet and SEAT all had full works teams in the WTCC. Just look at the quality of drivers all those teams hired and compare them to the "works" teams in the BTCC and WTCC.

So Honda dont employ two of the best drivers in the BTCC currently? You're deluded.

Tarquini is one of the best touring car drivers in the world. Whose to say there won't be another Honda in WTCC in 2013?

You say Vauxhall were the last true team in your eyes to be "works" - yet they had Gavin Smith/Erkut/Andrew Jordan in their third cars?

That's not employing the best drivers possible (At the time Jordan was only a youngster)

The Honda deal is a full works deal. The only "semi-works" deal in the WTCC is Aon.

Alfa Fan · 8 Oct 2012, 14:51 (Ref:3148261)

Quote:

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

On your view how is Honda not a 'full works entry', when they have the leading driver in the championship and a 3-times champion?

Who should they hire to make them 'full works', especially as Plato would be one of the drivers not available.

Someone who isn't the son the team owner and an employee of their sponsor?

And to the other post, did I say that Shedden and Neal were not two of the best drivers currently in the BTCC? no, I didn't. But are they two of the best choices of all drivers available. No. Nowhere near. You've got Fabrizio Giovanardi and James Thompson available for starters.

Vauxhall only ran 2 full works cars. They ran a customer programme under their name alongside if and when a suitably budgeted driver was available, such as Phil Bennett, Paul O'Neill, Luke Hines, Gavin Smith.

Nigma · 8 Oct 2012, 14:58 (Ref:3148264)

Just because Fabrizio Giovanardi and James Thompson are seemingly out of drives doesn't mean their main intention is to drive in the BTCC.

Let's not forget that James Thompson is tied up with Lada (and soon to be announced Aleksei Dudakalo with his LUKOIL Sponsorship...I assume) and the WTCC next year.

Fabrizio nearly did a one off this year at Rockingham and Matt personally called him and asked him if he'd drive the Civic if he couldn't race. Fabrizio turned it down saying Matt had a championship to win and he should race.

Les Dennis · 8 Oct 2012, 15:03 (Ref:3148267)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

Someone who isn't the son the team owner and an employee of their sponsor?

And to the other post, did I say that Shedden and Neal were not two of the best drivers currently in the BTCC? no, I didn't. But are they two of the best choices of all drivers available. No. Nowhere near. You've got Fabrizio Giovanardi and James Thompson available for starters.

Vauxhall only ran 2 full works cars. They ran a customer programme under their name alongside if and when a suitably budgeted driver was available, such as Phil Bennett, Paul O'Neill, Luke Hines, Gavin Smith.

So you are contradicting yourself. Saying that MG isn't a "full works" team because a driver part funds one of the drives, yet Vauxhall were, despite doing the same thing?

Honda entry is a full works effort. End of story.

Nigma · 8 Oct 2012, 15:08 (Ref:3148274)

Oh crap, just realised I was still on page one when I hit reply.. sorry.

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