LM24 Race McNish and Rockenfeller Accidents - Page 7

**Aysedasi** · 21 Jun 2011, 17:34 (Ref:2902981)

Me too - I get quoted, after all....

nobster · 21 Jun 2011, 19:20 (Ref:2903052)

Looking at the aftermath of the Rockenfeller crash, all those flashlights and emergency vehicles at the side of the track, that still looks frightening to me.
I was at the ACO welcome when the crash happened, all of us there were silenced when we saw those images not knowing how the state of the driver was. For me it was probably the worst feeling I had at Le Mans since my first time there in 1991.

**Aysedasi** · 21 Jun 2011, 19:35 (Ref:2903065)

We were there shortly afterwards Nobby - well, maybe half an hour. Might have just missed you.....

nobster · 22 Jun 2011, 10:47 (Ref:2903390)

I was there till way past midnight, but I meant the ACO welcome weher you could only enter with your orange wristband ( just after Dinlop bridge ) I was taking night pictures there of the sweeping track.

**Aysedasi** · 22 Jun 2011, 18:59 (Ref:2904380)

Yep, that's the same place......

Splatz the Cow · 25 Jun 2011, 06:20 (Ref:2905583)

Hi guys.

What do you think would happen, if it wasn't an Audi, but a Delta chassis car?

dxk1 · 26 Jun 2011, 22:58 (Ref:2906593)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Splatz the Cow

Hi guys.

What do you think would happen, if it wasn't an Audi, but a Delta chassis car?

It would be well past moon orbit by now!

DK

The Badger · 30 Jun 2011, 16:16 (Ref:2908697)

Ok , another aspect , and possible scenario .

What would be said , if the roof had been so badly crushed , that they couldnt get the driver outta the car , with the fuel pouring from the chassis , as happened in the McNish accident .

Would we then have people saying that coupes are dangerous and if the car had been open , they coulda gotten the driver out quicker , like Ortelli in the Oreca at Monza a couple years back .

Just wonderin ?

**Aysedasi** · 30 Jun 2011, 17:14 (Ref:2908740)

But that's the whole point - it wasn't......

Audi Racer · 30 Jun 2011, 17:42 (Ref:2908763)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

But that's the whole point - it wasn't......

And it never will be. the design of the those monocoques gives them supreme strength. The cars aren't capable of going fast enough to really test the strutural integrity of the closed coupe monocoque.

Mal · 30 Jun 2011, 17:50 (Ref:2908774)

.. when was the last time a P1 caught fire as a result of an accident? The safety systems regarding fuel spill and fire must have improved massively as, thankfully, it doesn't seem to be the issue it once was.

Audi Racer · 30 Jun 2011, 18:00 (Ref:2908787)

nvm

**Aysedasi** · 30 Jun 2011, 18:02 (Ref:2908790)

For crying out loud don't start that running again - you don't want to see me when I get angry........

Audi Racer · 30 Jun 2011, 18:04 (Ref:2908793)

nvm

MitchZ06 · 30 Jun 2011, 19:12 (Ref:2908847)

If it were an open cockpit car like the R15 then I don't think we'd be talking about the incidents in this manor and I doubt this years Le Mans would be very well remembered for any of the good points it gave us.

92scotland · 1 Jul 2011, 08:32 (Ref:2909124)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

Ok , another aspect , and possible scenario .

What would be said , if the roof had been so badly crushed , that they couldnt get the driver outta the car , with the fuel pouring from the chassis , as happened in the McNish accident .

Would we then have people saying that coupes are dangerous and if the car had been open , they coulda gotten the driver out quicker , like Ortelli in the Oreca at Monza a couple years back .

Just wonderin ?

Roof would never be crushed due to the stength of the tub. Fuel wouldn't be able to pour out as it is stored within the tub and is made of a rubber/kevlar compound so it is incredibly difficult to rupture. Plus isn't the driver able to be lifted out of the car whilst still being strapped to the seat to reduce spinal injures? So coupes aren't anymore dangerous than open cars. If anything, coupes are safer due to there being huge amounts of protection for the driver's head. End of.

Splatz the Cow · 1 Jul 2011, 10:31 (Ref:2909211)

Not much in way of response to the Delta chassis issue.

I brought it up because it was proudly announced during the race that they were looking forward to the opportunity to flipping their car onto the tyre barrier in 2012 or 2013, or perhaps racing it.

But the fact is it must be able to perform safely, the crashes of McNish and Rockenfeller.

I imagine that there is a potential for it to dig the nose in to the gravel trap or tyre barrier, and cartwheel into the crowd or forest, in those respective crash scenarios.

Simmi · 1 Jul 2011, 10:34 (Ref:2909213)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Splatz the Cow

I imagine that there is a potential for it to dig the nose in to the gravel trap or tyre barrier, and cartwheel into the crowd or forest, in those respective crash scenarios.

Same as any Formula 1 car then.

Gingers4Justice · 1 Jul 2011, 11:19 (Ref:2909256)

This debate is needless, IMO. LMP1 cars are ridiculously safe. I'd even go so far as to say the drivers are more likely to receive a serious injury when driving to the circuit...

The advances need to be made in GT cars. The Middle East Aston and the Am Febermahyr cars did not have absolutely massive shunts, but both drivers sustained injuries I certainly would want to avoid.

The other area that needs improvement is the safety of photographers. McNish was NOT the luck one in his accident. There was no doubt in my mind that McNish was alive immediately after the accident, but I feared for the photograghers and the spectators there, they had a far bigger chance of serious injury.

The Badger · 2 Jul 2011, 15:31 (Ref:2913948)

Quote:

Originally Posted by 92scotland

Roof would never be crushed due to the stength of the tub. Fuel wouldn't be able to pour out as it is stored within the tub and is made of a rubber/kevlar compound so it is incredibly difficult to rupture. Plus isn't the driver able to be lifted out of the car whilst still being strapped to the seat to reduce spinal injures? So coupes aren't anymore dangerous than open cars. If anything, coupes are safer due to there being huge amounts of protection for the driver's head. End of.

What was drippin gout from Nishys chassis , water possibily , or fuel , we wont know . Maybe true about the crash structure not collapsing , but what would happen if something had come through the cockpit glass ?

You have to open the door first , what if you cant ?

I say you dont have any basis to suggest that Im wrong , as you dont know what to expect from an accident .

In Nishys case , yes this Coupe design certainly looked to protect him well ..... but all accidents dont happen the same , and another scenario will happen in the furure , so to say the Coupe's are safer ..... crap .

If they are so safe , why dont F1 have them ?

The Badger · 2 Jul 2011, 15:35 (Ref:2913949)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

The advances need to be made in GT cars. The Middle East Aston and the Am Febermahyr cars did not have absolutely massive shunts, but both drivers sustained injuries I certainly would want to avoid.

The other area that needs improvement is the safety of photographers. McNish was NOT the luck one in his accident. There was no doubt in my mind that McNish was alive immediately after the accident, but I feared for the photograghers and the spectators there, they had a far bigger chance of serious injury.

The accidents in question all had massive G force , crash structure absorbes a lot of that , but its an accident and anything can happen .

Never mind the photographers , they are there at their own risk , as we all are . I happen to know a lot of Le Mans photographers , big ones , and they dont want any restriction . As long as it is realised that its what they want .

More bloody knee jerk reactions again !!!

Gingers4Justice · 2 Jul 2011, 15:35 (Ref:2913950)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

If they are so safe , why dont F1 have them ?

Probably because the most important part of single seater racing is that the cars are single seaters.

The Badger · 2 Jul 2011, 23:38 (Ref:2914090)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

Probably because the most important part of single seater racing is that the cars are single seaters.

Oh ..... so safety is out the door ..... just cuz its single seaters

I suggest with that arguement ..... rethink it , and im being plesant with my comment .

Ive seen a lot more busted people from single seaters , than any other class .... even more than rally .

Oh ..... just to point out that a single seater can be a coupe ..... many sportscar protos are single seaters ..... sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander .

Probably because the most important part of single seater racing is that the cars are single seaters

Audi Racer · 3 Jul 2011, 08:15 (Ref:2914190)

Whaaaah? Why dont F1 have them?

Were uninvolved with the FIA. What are you trying to achieve. your not going to get a definite answer from here...All we can do is speculate. Even that won;t given you the answer your looking for..

a coupe f1 car sounds silly. There;d have to be a wiper system. Good luck with that.....A/C system your kidding right. where do the doors go. The car is soo narrow.....Its not even practical...... As far as i'm concerned F1 cars of this time are safe.....rememebr Makr Webber and Robert Kubica's crashes..........Walked away with minimal injuries......

The worst open wheel accidents are the freak accidents such as that one where Massa got hit by a spring and where that young driver got hit by a tire..... And the FIA has done things to prevent this such as adding the wheel tethers. Quite frankly Brawn Racing hould have been heavily fined.....what kind of F1 car has springs falling out of it. that is silly and ridiculous.

Logic x iRacing · 26 Jul 2011, 13:08 (Ref:2931327)

They said that the GT Cars have to keep on the racing line and it's the Prototypes job to get round them safely... But with Rockenfeller it was the Ferrari's fault and Rockenfellers.

Since the Ferrari should of seen the bloody great lights flashing lighting up his cockpit and Rockenfeller shouldn't of really gone for the gap x

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