Genuine vs non original

[zefarelly]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Fortunately in my bit of historic racing, I can use steel rods and cranks etc.

Doesn't make it less original or less historic.

so can we Peter, it was around in period, it'd be interesting to get analysis on modern vs period though . . .also I section forged rods are period correct, ultra lightweight H section are not. likewise crank design, piston design etc etc

[midgetman]

So where do we stand on rebuilding the crashed cars from the Revival then? Are they still genuine or not?

When I see the Revival the historian in me says "What a shame, a piece of motor racing history trashed". The racing driver in me says "These cars are meant to race, they're not racing cars if they're sat in a museum or on a parade".

But should they be allowed out to race again with new shells or panels from modern materials, we've got the photgraphic evidence they're not original anymore

[terence]

Bizzarini?New Shell???.The people who will be rebuilding it WILL build it as it should be.

[GBRM]

Originally Posted by terence bower

Bizzarini?New Shell???

Surely they built 100s, if not 1000s of Bizzarinis though Terry??

[terence]

They had after this weekend

[GBRM]

Originally Posted by terence bower

They had after this weekend

With all these spare panels now going around for ISOs maybe they can reshell the Mark Hales and Richard Attwood car that so gainfully met with Dad's Ferrari in 2004!!

[John Turner]

Originally Posted by midgetman

So where do we stand on rebuilding the crashed cars from the Revival then? Are they still genuine or not?

When I see the Revival the historian in me says "What a shame, a piece of motor racing history trashed". The racing driver in me says "These cars are meant to race, they're not racing cars if they're sat in a museum or on a parade".

But should they be allowed out to race again with new shells or panels from modern materials, we've got the photgraphic evidence they're not original anymore

Originally Posted by John Turner

2) Original cars with a documented provenance and history (but with maybe some gaps in 'known' history); have been subject to development, initially to keep them competitive in contemporary racing but more recently to respond to safety requirements and the demands of maintenance. Will obviously have had many components rebuilt or replaced over the years, which means of course that advantages will have been taken to utilise modern materials and tuning knowledge, for example, on the internals in an engine rebuild. May also have had to be restored after long lay off or major crash damage. These are the cars that we liken to George Washington's axe that Andrew Fellowes is concerned about. However, I suggest that this category is likely to represent a substantial proportion of cars in the historic racing scene today, along with category 3, below.

Racing cars have always been crashed. They get rebuilt, and if the damage is bad enough, they get reshelled. They have continuous, documented provenance; they were built to race; it is their raison d'etre and should be allowed to continue to do so until hell freezes over! This is a quite different situation from the issues over replica and, most worryingly, continuation cars.

[zefarelly]

most of the cars have been extensively reworked anyway haven't they ?

[terence]

Quite right John,There is no comparison to a continuation caa in instances such as this,Cars such as these often need the occaisional new panel made and fitted.Any Panel Maker worth his pay would only make a replacement in the correct fashion.

[GBRM]

And hopefully out of the original material too!!

[terence]

The original type of ally is still available so there would be no reason to use anything else,it,s that much easier to use.

[midgetman]

>>>>>>>Bizzarini?New Shell???.

Terence, I didn't say that! Or at least I didn't mean to...

I have a problem with the Washington Axe school of thought but I don't have any better answer.

[terence]

Perhaps the implication was misunderstood.

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by terence bower

The original type of ally is still available so there would be no reason to use anything else,it,s that much easier to use.

I recall some years ago when Neil Corner crashed the Mercedes W125 at Silverstone, there was consternation because the aluminium was a bit special. Until someone discovered that if you melted down a few Homebase garden chairs you got exactly the same material.

[terence]

Yes ,it was/is a mag alloy mix.Apparently they had built one or two planes in the same material.