[BTCC] BTCC 2021

[thetool]

Originally Posted by Craner Curves

I felt sorry for Jelley not getting to continue into 2010, just as he was getting to grips with touring cars. He'll do well with the support of WSR behind him.

It was rather odd that he didn't, given he was never at WSR for his talent alone. I know the family business took a bit of a hit around that time, but they were and remain incredibly wealthy.

[antnee]

Originally Posted by thetool

It was rather odd that he didn't, given he was never at WSR for his talent alone. I know the family business took a bit of a hit around that time, but they were and remain incredibly wealthy.

Probably down to cash flow - you can be very wealthy, yet have no cash.

[AmD Tuning]

Originally Posted by Millvi

I didn’t know that. So they could flip back and forth between Oliphant and Jelley meeting by meeting? Be interesting how than pans out and how quickly Jelley gets to grips with the 3 Series.

Or maybe Morgan or Chilton could be nominated?

[Craner Curves]

I have a fascinating Stephen Jelley fact. His mum designed the famous Admiral England kit from the 1982 World Cup 🤓

[Tja]

Originally Posted by AmD Tuning

Or maybe Morgan or Chilton could be nominated?

Would that be possible? Can anyone be chosen who is running the right type of car? Do they have to be technically identical or e.g. the FK8 - could Dynamics chose a BTC car despite them running a different engine? Interesting point you've brought up there...

[S griffin]

It depends if they are willing to be eligible for the manufacturer points. I think it could happen. It depends if BMW are fine with that of cause. To be fair there's nothing that Dynamics could do if Honda are happy for BTC to score manufacturer points. Just need to see what happens, we've got more than enough teams who could easily run with works backing should it be offered

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by S griffin

It depends if they are willing to be eligible for the manufacturer points.

Who are the 'they' you refer to?

Originally Posted by S griffin

It depends if BMW are fine with that of cause. To be fair there's nothing that Dynamics could do if Honda are happy for BTC to score manufacturer points.

Whether the car is a BMW or Honda have nothing to do with this part of the regulations:

For the purpose of this regulation, a 'Constructor' is defined as the entrant, company or individual who is the originating designer and builder of their own competing cars. Classification as a Constructor may not necessarily exclude their eligibility for any or all of the awards or prize money offered to Independent entrants. The final decision as to which entrants may be eligible to be classified as a Constructor and/or for any awards or prize money available to Independent entrants rests solely with the Administrator, whose decision will be final.

So for 2021, the only 'Constructors' are WSR, TD, Speedworks and PMR. BTC/Ciceley are not entering a car they designed and built themselves, so not eligible for Constructor points.

Originally Posted by S griffin

Just need to see what happens, we've got more than enough teams who could easily run with works backing should it be offered

Works backing is a thing of the past - it is highly unlikely we will ever see anything remotely near what could be considered a 'works' backed entry again.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by AmD Tuning

Or maybe Morgan or Chilton could be nominated?

Would that still comply with sporting regulation 1.6.3?

[billy bleach]

[QUOTE=crmalcolm;4035582]Who are the 'they' you refer to?



Whether the car is a BMW or Honda have nothing to do with this part of the regulations:

[I]For the purpose of this regulation, a 'Constructor' is defined as the entrant, company or individual who is the originating designer and builder of their own competing cars. Classification as a Constructor may not necessarily exclude their eligibility for any or all of the awards or prize money offered to Independent entrants. The final decision as to which awards

So for 2021, the only 'Constructors' are WSR, TD, Speedworks and PMR. BTC/Ciceley are not entering a car they designed and built themselves, so not eligible for Constructor

Who built the Fords, Hyundai's and Seats?

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

[


Who built the Fords, Hyundai's and Seats?

You're looking at it from the wrong direction.
BTC and Ciceley didn't design and build their cars, so not eligible to be entered as constructors.
Motorbase, Excelr8 and HARD. (I guess you're referring to the Cupras?) have opted to not enter as Constructors, so whilst they fit the definition, are still competing for Independent awards as per the regulation.

(nb, the Fords were built by Custom Cages, under a previous ownership of Motorbase, so possibly MB would not fit the definition)

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

You're looking at it from the wrong direction.
BTC and Ciceley didn't design and build their cars, so not eligible to be entered as constructors.
Motorbase, Excelr8 and HARD. (I guess you're referring to the Cupras?) have opted to not enter as Constructors, so whilst they fit the definition, are still competing for Independent awards as per the regulation.

(nb, the Fords were built by Custom Cages, under a previous ownership of Motorbase, so possibly MB would not fit the definition)

So in that case Willy Pool is the " constructor" of the BMW , Toyota and Hyundai?

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

So in that case Willy Pool is the " constructor" of the BMW , Toyota and Hyundai?

Not according to the registered chassis details.

[porsche962fan]

speaking of Ciceley do we know if those are old cars WSR passed on or brand new builds ?

and with them and a 3rd Infinity it means 8 RWD on the grid , a little over 1/3 of the grid

[redshoes]

WSR and Speedworks did the design but the initial fabrication was contracted out to Willie Poole. Don't know if Excelr8 did the design as well, but I assume they probably did.

The Toyota has a WPMS number on the cage (WPMS-NGTC-057) but Speedworks use their own chassis number.
The BMWs were WPMS builds 058, 059 & 060, but have WSR chassis plates.
The Hyundais just use the WPMS chassis number.

You could add the Infinitis to that list as they are also a WPMS build.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by porsche962fan

speaking of Ciceley do we know if those are old cars WSR passed on or brand new builds ?

Brand new builds

[Pdh]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

You're looking at it from the wrong direction.
BTC and Ciceley didn't design and build their cars, so not eligible to be entered as constructors.
Motorbase, Excelr8 and HARD. (I guess you're referring to the Cupras?) have opted to not enter as Constructors, so whilst they fit the definition, are still competing for Independent awards as per the regulation.

(nb, the Fords were built by Custom Cages, under a previous ownership of Motorbase, so possibly MB would not fit the definition)

Just because Motorbase is under different ownership it doesn’t mean it’s not the same company and as mb is run by Motorbase they would fit the definition perfectly

[touringlegend]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Brand new builds

Indeed, chassis’s 004 and 005 I believe.

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by touringlegend

Indeed, chassis’s 004 and 005 I believe.

Or possibly 05 and 06

[touringlegend]

Possibly, but just going by what Carl Mitchell (of WSR) put on Instagram - “WSR BMW G20 3 series chassis 004, the first WSR BMW customer car delivered. Fantastic work by all involved, now on to chassis 005.

[sceptic]

Originally Posted by Pdh

Just because Motorbase is under different ownership it doesn’t mean it’s not the same company and as mb is run by Motorbase they would fit the definition perfectly

But in this case it is not the same company. It has a different company number at Companies House.

Compare this with Red Bull Racing in Formula 1, which has the same company number as Stewart Grand Prix which is what it was originally formed as.

Or Mercedes Benz Grand Prix Ltd, which has the same company number as Tyrrell, BAR, Honda GP and Brawn GP.

[S griffin]

It's just a minor change. But both teams are operating out of the same stable. It's very different from F1, teams change ownership and change their names like Red Bull and Merc have done, but are still technically the same team with the same company number. Merc as we know has had many different previous guises. But although BAR was born out of Tyrrell and it is pretty much the same team with a different team, let's not forget that BAR didn't use the same factory as Tyrrell. Honda, Brawn and Merc all did use the same factory as BAR

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by sceptic

But in this case it is not the same company. It has a different company number at Companies House.

Compare this with Red Bull Racing in Formula 1, which has the same company number as Stewart Grand Prix which is what it was originally formed as.

Or Mercedes Benz Grand Prix Ltd, which has the same company number as Tyrrell, BAR, Honda GP and Brawn GP.

So has David Bartrum retained the IP?

[redshoes]

http://www.btcc.net/2021/02/18/pmr-s...ent-programme/
Jac Constable to be PMR 'development driver', whatever that means

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by redshoes

http://www.btcc.net/2021/02/18/pmr-s...ent-programme/
Jac Constable to be PMR 'development driver', whatever that means

I think it means that he can commit more testing time to the team than their existing driver(s)?

[redshoes]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I think it means that he can commit more testing time to the team than their existing driver(s)?

In other words, they need to put some pre-season test mileage on the car and won't have a second driver until much later.