FIA/ACO to create universal GT class

[skycafe]

Oh, whoa, wrong thread!

[urdragon]

Originally Posted by GT3.14

Another attempt to hijack the thread!

Epic, can a thread be hijacked? Leave no hostages alive xd!!!!

As Richard hammond said, the thread will have the "Helsinki syndrome".

[Pandamasque]

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/b...racing-is-gt1/

[MJ_N_09]

So, the article is claiming that they will try to work a GT1 class back in?

[MagVanisher]

Interesting article about the GT1 revival! Still, I don't think ACO and FIA would not allow to create two GT classes since they're unifying GTE and GT3 (with some other GT classes from Grand-Am and Super GT)

[MitchZ06]

All that article suggests to me is that they should return to a GT1 typre formula, not bring back GT1 (however much I'd love that...)

[rich07]

Originally Posted by Pandamasque

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/b...racing-is-gt1/

I had to double check the author of that blog post was indeed Cotton and not Ratel

[Mt. Lynx]

I still feel that GTE is the wrong way to go. Make the uniclass GT3. There are plenty of cars around for that, it's well established globally, and variety of MFG's are good.
If they want a factory driven class (and they do) make that GT1. And I mean proper GT1 , a la 1996 (no longtails) minus the one homologation car of course. Make that number depend on MFG capacity. Allow hybrids too.
If I could write the rules, I'd allow both active aero and suspension - infact every trick they can come up with, as long as the homologated car has it.
These cars would be immensely fast, so to slow them down, I would use an all weather tire. One kind of tire for all kinds of surfaces. And lots of tire manufacturers.

[MitchZ06]

And you sir would kill the class faster than you could say "Ratel". All the above, $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and that's money no-one would in their right mind spend to be slowed down by an all weather tyre no-one is going to produce...

GT3 with a more GTE focus on an actual set of rules is the right idea, not GTunlimited.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by skycafe

Oh, whoa, wrong thread!

Dont worry about it ..... we all make mistakes from time to time .

[gwyllion]

Some news about the ongoing “GT convergence” effort of the ACO and FIA: http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...-taking-shape/

[NaBUru38]

Originally Posted by John Dagys

it evolved into a concept that could see the continuation of two distinct categories but instead utilizing the same base car for both classes

embrace the manufacturers’ desires to provide suitable options as both factory entries and for privateers

Absolutely great news!

[broadrun96]

Think it does sound the manufacturers are bringing both accountants and motorsports people to the discussion and are learning from the Porsche model. Embrace all the different groups/series and sell kits for each to meet their needs. Think it can only add variety but may have the unfortunate for some end effect of adding to am classes but may make for more serious factory teams and sharp end dogfights.

[Speed-King]

So Group 4 and Group 5, essentially... I'd love if they had a group 3 with that for light sportscars, but it's not a bad proposal. Only question is if both groups will be sustainable in the long run... make "Gr.5" too expensive and not even the manufacturers can keep it alive forever, make it too affordable or attractive for privateers, and you bleed dry "Gr.4", which is pretty much what happened in the 70s.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Yeah, make GTE<>GT-1 unleash them a little and make GT-3 <>GT-2 with more natural progression upwards left. Allowing for the mfgs to have a devel class in which the Werks and Werks blessed teams still can run and not pound on the customers.

Not a fan of the single class concept here. I would be rather suprised if the mfgs were also. I can see them (mfgs) happy to see a 2 class system where the vast majority of the GT market was unified in a single (per mfg) base model that could easily be utilized across most of the GT series World wide though.




L.P.

.

[arakis]

Seems like there are two factions in the negotiations for the pro class, one that wants GT3 style no rules only BoP... and another that wants strict technical rules like GTE (pre BoP maham)...

[Salamus]

Seems the manufacturers are debating whether to go the GT3 route of BoP or the GTE route of tight regulations. I was hoping that they wouldn't go either route.

The GTE route of one rulebook doesn't make sense because the cars are so different.
The GT3 route of no rulebook doesn't make sense because it takes away the competitiveness of manufacturers making their cars better.

I think the best solution is to have 2 rulesets, one for big cars (Corvette, Viper, SLS) and one for small cars (458, 911).

Oh well. As long as they can create a class(es) that can survive/be affordable for nearly 10 years, I'll be happy.

[Danske]

The question to me seems to be that with the "common" base being the same between versions, what exactly will the manufacturers not want to be part of the engineered areas and carried over from that base for the GT+ version? I suspect the answer is "not very much", which rather defeats the purpose of having the base in the first place. Or perhaps they'd want to homologate for the base a lot of bespoke for GT+ parts, which runs counter to keeping GT less costly. But maybe they can build nearly a whole base car out of production and "lightly engineered" parts, such that everyone will whinge about it equally.

[urdragon]

What i would do is a the same car with no kits out of the style of the car (Promotional reasons) for the costumer racing and then, periodic technological updates for the PRO class like now.

Regarding to the base struture of the car, i don't think the GTE ruleset is achievable by the 15+ brands currently at GT3, simply i would make the maximum "GTE ruleset effort" inside the GT3 class but i suspect is impossible to make a comoon ruleset for 15+ cars.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by urdragon

Regarding to the base struture of the car, i don't think the GTE ruleset is achievable by the 15+ brands currently at GT3, simply i would make the maximum "GTE ruleset effort" inside the GT3 class but i suspect is impossible to make a comoon ruleset for 15+ cars.

I fail to see how a single base GT model is not achievable! That a mfg does not have a current car that would be eligible in GTE does not necessarily mean that they can not have GT-3 entries.





L.P.

[Pandamasque]

IMO they should loosen the GT+ rules to allow a wider variety of cars to participate and have a change at being competitive, and then actually stick to those rules! BoP-based GT class should be reserved for Am and Pro-Am teams only and should be a clearly a lower category. I'd like to see GT+ competing for the overall wins at N24, Spa24 and the like.

[Koenigsegg]

Originally Posted by urdragon

What i would do is a the same car with no kits out of the style of the car (Promotional reasons) for the costumer racing and then, periodic technological updates for the PRO class like now.

Regarding to the base struture of the car, i don't think the GTE ruleset is achievable by the 15+ brands currently at GT3, simply i would make the maximum "GTE ruleset effort" inside the GT3 class but i suspect is impossible to make a comoon ruleset for 15+ cars.

It's not 15+ cars anymore when you take away all the none manufacturers effort, in other words the private efforts.

Ferrari, Porsche, Aston Martin and BMW already have a GT3 and GTE car of the same model. Bentley want to do Le Mans again, in GT. It will be clever from Corvette if they team up with Callaway. Lamborghini just teamed up with Reiter. McLaren is very interested in GTE, just as Mercedes. Wouldn't surprise me if Nissan is also looking at it. Even VDS expressed feelings to go to Le Mans.

What do we have left? Not much. Ford GT3, Camaro GT3, Maserati GT3 and Emil Frey Jaguar are all private efforts with few to none (official) manufacturer funding/backing. I'm not sure about the old Dodge Viper. There's a new SRT Viper now anyway and they said they'll be looking at customer cars if it's a doable option.

Honda/Acura will be there with their new NSX. Toyota/Lexus already have a GTE, most likely change of plans prevented it from racing (except at VLN this year). Ford has a close eye on GT racing. Lotus will be everywhere anyway! :P

I don't see this not happening. I believe this idea/plan has a bright future.

[TheNewBob]

Originally Posted by Salamus

Seems the manufacturers are debating whether to go the GT3 route of BoP or the GTE route of tight regulations. I was hoping that they wouldn't go either route.

Why not have the GT3 cars with BoP, as we have now, and the upgrade kits for them (whatever parts they may feature) can be the bits with the more detailed GTE-style technical regs?

Best of both worlds, perhaps over-simplified but it would be nice to know which parts of a GTE car are more expensive than GT3 (I would imagine the engine is the biggest cost here). Then it can be decided which parts would be on the GT3-base car (to keep it relatively cheap) and which parts could be on a GTE-upgrade kit so the manufacturers have some more detailed regs to work with on those sections only.

Probably much easier said than done, I admit!

[Pandamasque]

Originally Posted by TheNewBob

Why not have the GT3 cars with BoP, as we have now, and the upgrade kits for them (whatever parts they may feature) can be the bits with the more detailed GTE-style technical regs?

It's like making an upgrade kit for Lola-Aston Martin B09 LMP1 car to turn in into a DB9 race car. I'm exaggerating but... or am I? The Lola at least had the right engine block.

[KingKenny04]

I think the key is to have a definitive set of regulations, but to keep those regulations as open as possible. It's pretty simple. Cars overall must conform to stock dimensions (length, width, height, maybe allow a slightly wider track). Must keep stock engine configuration and displacement (not necessarily the stock engine itself). Just come up with a formula based on displacement and induction type for calculating weight (minimum weights for given displacements + a modifier if turbo'd or supercharged). Require stock mounting locations for suspensions components. THAT'S IT. If any further BoP is required, nerf quicker cars instead of buffing slower cars to discourage manufacturer and team whining.