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3 Jul 2020, 21:09 (Ref:3985403) | #6601 | |||
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from Jordan
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and we have this claim Quote:
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3 Jul 2020, 21:23 (Ref:3985406) | #6602 | |
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Sensible decision by TOCA in my view. As teams and drivers are struggling to get their budget together, it’s going to tough for some drivers to string a whole season together
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4 Jul 2020, 05:13 (Ref:3985446) | #6603 | ||
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Quote:
WSR will miss AJ as he and Turks pushed each other which in turn pushed the whole team forward. Sometimes that dynamic can be destructive, but managed well, with respect on both sides, it can be hugely beneficial to the team and car. |
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4 Jul 2020, 07:31 (Ref:3985453) | #6604 | |
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4 Jul 2020, 07:36 (Ref:3985455) | #6605 | |
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Gow is hopeful they can run in front of crowds
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He who dares wins! He who hesitates is lost! |
4 Jul 2020, 07:56 (Ref:3985462) | #6606 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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Thanks for that. I see businesses doing what they can to improve their positions on a pretty much daily basis. On this planet. So don't be condescending. If you think they are spending much less then fine. But I put it to you that by standardising all those bits it hasn't made things cheaper.
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4 Jul 2020, 08:25 (Ref:3985467) | #6607 | ||
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Quote:
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4 Jul 2020, 08:47 (Ref:3985471) | #6608 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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So, if a driver has to bring (say) £200k to a car just to run it who pays for the organisation to run it? Who pays for the maintemance, engine and gearbox rebuilds etc. Yes living the chassis for 5 years helps but development costs an arm and a leg. So I stick by my original thinking that these are not cheap low cost vehicles.
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4 Jul 2020, 09:19 (Ref:3985477) | #6609 | ||
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Quote:
then i will be condescending. you live on cloud cuckoo land im afraid its not even 20% of the cost of ST when top teams were spending 3-4 million per car! but i cant be bothered arguing the point anymore. if you want to think that the cost of btcc is now nearly the same as the 90's ST then i will leave you to it. |
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4 Jul 2020, 09:21 (Ref:3985479) | #6610 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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Ok, Carry on.
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I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead. |
4 Jul 2020, 09:46 (Ref:3985485) | #6611 | |
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4 Jul 2020, 09:46 (Ref:3985486) | #6612 | ||
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Quote:
the thing that reflects that for me? no real cost cutting efforts from the organisers for this season, even though there's several drivers dropping out for financial reasons. i guess as the lead series they have a lot of contractual obligations, but have a look at the minis - they've realised a lot of their competitors are running on far less money than they'd projected, and have reduced the number of rounds accordingly. that's had the effect of spreading the cost of competing across the year more evenly when competitors (and their sponsors) are likely coming out of a period where they've been earning far less than usual, if anything at all. toca have created this issue themselves. teams in all series have reasonably steady cashflows, albeit irregular compared to a lot of businesses. lockdown has meant they've had very little coming in, and now they're expected to pay for almost half the season in one month? |
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devils advocate in-chief and professional arguer of both sides |
4 Jul 2020, 09:50 (Ref:3985487) | #6613 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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Yes, I'm willing to accept that my sums may be exaggerated but not by that much. As an amateur in historics I know how much it costs to run a small team and prep and build a historic touring car for a season. And I'm not paying for the driver!
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I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead. |
4 Jul 2020, 10:06 (Ref:3985490) | #6614 | |||
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Quote:
20% of 4 million is £800k. A driver who was looking to pay for a seat in one of the lower order cars in 2016 was offering a range of sponsorship packages which, if they were all taken, would amount to nearly £1.4 million. Given that that was just to pay for one season's drive in a car not expected to break into the top ten regularly, do you still think teams at the front of the grid run their cars for between £600k and £800k? |
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4 Jul 2020, 11:33 (Ref:3985503) | #6615 | |
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Join Date: Jun 2020
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Did he really expect them all to be taken though? If they were all taken how much would he give to the team and how much would be his own wages?
I have no actual idea of the running costs of a BTCC team but from what a BTCC driver has said on other forums recently ("it’s not orders of magnitude above even Clio’s or Ginettas") I would be surprised if it's really seven figures per car in the midfield. |
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4 Jul 2020, 11:52 (Ref:3985507) | #6616 | ||
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Quote:
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4 Jul 2020, 12:12 (Ref:3985513) | #6617 | ||
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Quote:
The Super Tourer engines were £50k each at one point, probably a lot more by 2000. NGTC engines were around £25k at the beginning and probably not much more now. Super Tourers were built with a lot of expensive, specialist materials such as carbon fibre and tungsten for strength and lightness. NGTC does not allow for the use of such materials. I have an aluminium suspension component from a WSR Mondeo, that would have taken a lot of expensive in house design and manufacturing. NGTC cars require none of that. All suspension is built from off the shelf items and mounted on off the shelf subframes. Basically the teams are restricted to the shared items as far as development is concerned. Where as the Super Tourers were free to develop as much or as often as they liked. Todays costs are nothing like the expense of the Super Touring days. |
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4 Jul 2020, 12:24 (Ref:3985518) | #6618 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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I think I was referring to overall expenditure but as you wish.
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4 Jul 2020, 12:34 (Ref:3985522) | #6619 | ||
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Given the amount of scrutiny BMR's finances received on this forum, then some of the experts here must surely know exactly what it costs to run a car at the front of the grid?
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4 Jul 2020, 12:47 (Ref:3985525) | #6620 | |
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£600k per season in the BMR Subaru days. Plus testing!
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4 Jul 2020, 12:59 (Ref:3985531) | #6621 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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So, that's £1.2M plus the driver fees? Add in overheads and you are coming back to serious wonga.
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4 Jul 2020, 13:16 (Ref:3985538) | #6622 | ||
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Quote:
A drivers budget will pay for their seasons racing, any testing they may take part in and possibly crash damage. It will pay for all the teams costs. Take out everything and the team should make a profit. |
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4 Jul 2020, 13:17 (Ref:3985539) | #6623 | |
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I see Jordan has been enlisted to do some running in the hybrid.
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4 Jul 2020, 13:24 (Ref:3985540) | #6624 | ||
The Honourable Mallett
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I've decided to stop reaching out to people. I'm just going to contact them instead. |
4 Jul 2020, 13:27 (Ref:3985541) | #6625 | ||
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