Favourite Hillclimb?

[MIKE HEATH]

That hairpin was fun

[Mrs BlackX]

OK..... This is from a marshal's wife point of view....

For facilities etc, the best for me has to be Prescott..

Shelsley Walsh comes a very close second for it's atmosphere, amazing racing and the outstanding "bottom S" experience....

Loton Park, Gurston and Goodwood are all up there too...

ALL of them have a variety of people in the paddock, ranging from the young (Adam Fleetwood, Graeme Wight Jnr etc) to the grandad's (Roy Jones etc), and ALL of which are the nicest people you could wish to meet. We take our 2 young children with us every weekend and the marshal's, driver's and officials alike all treat them like part of a huge family.

We watch all sorts of vehicles race from Mini's to the big single seaters and love every minute of it....

I have posted this reply purely because I have yet to understand why Anuauto is posting some very scathing comments about Hillclimbing, and ask myself the question "Has/does this person actually attend the meetings???"

Hillclimbing (IMHO) represents "grassroots" motor racing, This is a sport where you can get close to the cars and drivers without hoards of "bodyguards" shooing you away.... The whole hillclimbing experience is (IMHO) what the motor racing enthusiast craves for.........

But then again, I am only a spectator, oh and a woman!!

[ss_collins]

Anuauto is a fixture at most hillclimbs in the south west and really knows his stuff (and I mean really!! - ie he is the online blue book)

I can see his point of view though... I'd love to do Walsh but the series I do don't get invited (we seem to be invited just about everywhere else though)

[Stuart Hill]

Originally posted by ss_collins
I can see his point of view though... I'd love to do Walsh but the series I do don't get invited (we seem to be invited just about everywhere else though)

But has anyone asked (or more correctly, answered!!) the question that is so obvious?????

If YOU (as an organising club) have the choice:

Use our limited days to invite:

Bitish and Midland rounds (which all attract good, even huge crowds) against some championship (NO offence meant here) that maybe the general (entrance money paying) public have not heard of, which would YOU choose as a club?

Shelsley (as in the Midland Automobile Club) have been trying to get more and more cars up the hill (during the set hours of a racing day) to increase their revenue from competitors. This I can understand, from an organising club's point of view, but it is sometimes done to the detrement of the marshals. ie, none or very short lunch breaks.

The problems that they have at Shelsley are set in history....

1) the venue does not (and won't in the forseeable future) have a return road and so CANNOT (even if they want to) run more than a certain amount of cars per day...

2) They only have a limited numder of days that they can run meetings and so HAVE to maximise their income from these days....

3) They (The MAC) have also been "dragged-into-the 21st-Century" by being made to realise that marshal's matter!!!
This was started by their last Chief Marshal (at Shelsley) and has since been carried on by the current Chief.

So the result is?

Then there is always the case of "over egging" the pudding. If they put on more events would it devalue the existing formats? Would the large attendance diminish per meeting and the MAC end up having the same gate spread across more meeeting? Not economic that last one is it really?

Just like all Motorsport Clubs, the MAC has to at least break-even and then hopefully make a profit!! This is just the way that the world works now.

I will be the first to say (IMHO) that the MAC could and should make changes to further encourage marshals but......

and this is a BIG BUT......

I will NOT put them down for chosing the most profitable route when deciding what championships or classes they decide to invite to their limited events!!

The MAC, just like H&DLCC, BOC et all, are NOT charities and should not be viewed as such.

I would love to see more cars, different championships, new classes but at the moment that is not a viable option at many venues these days.

And let's not forget Fireblade's comment:

The joke wears a bit thin watching a class of 27 Ginettas making four runs a day at such venues like Loton for example.

A very valid point because, venues not only have to attract competitors and paying public, they also need to attract marshals !!!!

[ss_collins]

true but an invite for the locals wouldn't go amiss would it?

Take my position, having to travel from South London all the way to Wiscombe, Porlock or even Scarborough to find a Hill when the nearest one is gone. If the South Eastern lot ran a hill in the MAC area and didn't invite MAC then they would get annoyed right?

[Jedi088]

I have to say I would not get annoyed if enthusiasts from the south east organised a hillclimb in the midlands (The proposed new venue in Herefordshire perhaps) or even at a venue in the south east if one can be found it's not that flat down there surely and it would be nice to travel to that area of the country for a change to watch or participate. As for the invite if I did not receive one and it was at a venue I really wanted to drive at then I would join the relevant club , enter the championship to improve my chances of getting an entry .
Meanwhile is Worcester the best place to live if your a Hillclimber I can be at Shelsley 20 mins,Prescott 30 mins Loton 60 mins Barbon, Harewood , Wiscombe under 3 hours and Doune a bit of a trek but under 7 hours all times approx and towing trailer.

[ss_collins]

Yes but if you had to join 7oaks (Kent) to do a hillclimb in Hereford it would be a bit irritating. Especially if the local class structure was not used. (thats a cue for Anuauto methinks)

[Jedi088]

Best find a venue in Kent then, shouldn't be to much of a problem plenty of people with lots of money large houses and suitable garden paths just need to talk them and their neighbours into it and job done.

[blackx]

3) They (The MAC) have also been "dragged-into-the 21st-Century" by being made to realise that marshal's matter!!!
This was started by their last Chief Marshal (at Shelsley) and has since been carried on by the current Chief.

Why thankyou kind sir.............I did try to help things along the way nut when you believe you are no longer making a difference it is time to move on

[blackx]

nut should read but.......

The perils of not previewing your reply eh??

[flagwaver]

can see the level of conversation at your house blackx, what with you and your nuts & mrs blackx talking about drivers with big b***s, on another forum.

[Mrs BlackX]

Originally posted by flagwaver
can see the level of conversation at your house blackx, what with you and your nuts & mrs blackx talking about drivers with big b***s, on another forum.

Oh dear we have been sussed!!.....

Just to show how bad we are, we also cyber fight using MSN as well......

[flagwaver]

we just fight!

[Fireblade]

Originally posted by ss_collins
Its a bitter pill to swallow when Walsh get 1.5 million (or is trying to) the nearest hill and local classes can't run, especially when three good hills have been lost to the classes.

I respect and take your point regarding grassroots racing and the viewing of those entry lists was interesting, especially the music and bands themed ones.

However Shelsley Walsh is a "power hill". A lot of those listed would not make for a stonking days viewing IMHO.
The hill is not cheap to run and as pointed out before it is limited to 5 weekends a year. 5 weekends of people falling over themselves to get an entry.
Their are 1600 members of the MAC,all of which pay a fair sum to be members. I myself pay £59 for a joint membership. I would certainly not be doing that if I had to put up with more of what is referred to as "grass roots" type classes. And I suspect other members feel the same way.

Maybe, when all is sorted regarding the lease at Shelsey, things might be different but as there are only so many weekends that can be run at present and I cannot see the format changing.

When John Jones' new track at Huntington, Herefordshire is up and running there should be plenty of room for that sort of thing. Don't forget to take your umbrella and wellies though. The umbrella for when it rains and the wellies for.....Damn...froze

[ss_collins]

Best find a venue in Kent then, shouldn't be to much of a problem plenty of people with lots of money large houses and suitable garden paths just need to talk them and their neighbours into it and job done.

and the response is - "oh no how awful all those noisy smelly cars...."


true some of the cars we have wouldn't be great - but others would...

[Stuart Hill]

Originally posted by ss_collins
Best find a venue in Kent then, shouldn't be to much of a problem plenty of people with lots of money large houses and suitable garden paths just need to talk them and their neighbours into it and job done.

Do I take it from this that you are volunteering then?

[ss_collins]

thats a quote from Jedi!

But actually myself and a fair few others a have been scouring kent high and low for a new venue...

[Jedi088]

Good Luck with the searching I hope you manage to find a venue as we certainly need more Hillclimbs not less far more pleasant tham featureless windy airfields

[JimW]

Loton Park for favourite venue and Hagley and District LCC for best organisers.

Hmm; Since HDLCC run the meetings at Loton I wonder if cause and effect are being confused here?

Grassroots motorsport (GR) debate raises interesting issues. We all agree that this needs/deserves support. But then we recognise that not everyone finds watching some of what comes under this description very interesting so they go elsewhere. This means fewer spectators to give a bit of gate money and atmosphere and fewer marshals to decorate the bank.

You could think of at least two ways to live with this. Meetings with all GR type entries (sometimes called "Clubman’s" but I think this confuses two different things). That way no one is there under false pretences and we would not have journalists making remarks like "decent meeting except for a group of people who were outclassed".

Or you could put in a GR class in an otherwise "promoted" or championship event. (And risk the remark quoted above.)

Even if you find 27 Ginettas boring (and I don't) this seems a classic example where some enthusiasts are enjoying their sport and it is (relatively) cheap and hassle free. Sure for the people watching it may not be as attention getting as a big single seater but there are all sorts of things to be enjoyed in different ways. If we can't find some way of fitting these in (yes and Novas as well) we are ignoring a large chunk of the potential driver pool.

The other side of this is that the money to run venues/organisations has to come from somewhere. I think of this as being three sources:

Entrance fees
Gate money
Non-competition day events (school or corporate days for example)

(Yes, there are other factors like payments to championships to come to your venue, revenue from caterers etc.)

Many hill climb venues cannot get the third category of income. So we are left to balance entries against gate money. I really don't envy the organisers this part of their jobs.

Turning to the need to maximise the minutes of available tracktime in a day and the need to keep paying spectators amused and coming back with their friends. Breaks in proceedings don’t provide any spectacle, interest or excitement.

However marshals need a break at some time in the day. Not just for their comfort breaks or feeding habits but so they can have a natter and wander around the paddock. That way we retain marshals!

Some years ago there was a "Racing ahead" move at some circuits which tried to cut out all the faffing around which bored spectators and was unproductive "dead" time.

For various reasons most of the Racing ahead initiatives have fallen by the wayside.

Personally I think that we should look at ways to do both things. Lunch breaks are a pretty boring time for competitors and spectators. Perhaps a more concentrated attempt to find a way of providing a break for marshals in rotation without everything coming to a halt for 45 minutes? But this would mean we had to have more of them so as to be able to rotate the teams. Difficult to do and all sorts of practical problems.

Regards

Jim

[Dan Friel]

I've only ever done Gurston, so I guess that must be favourite - even though it broke my car once! Off to Wiscombe in April (any advice?), so that'll be interesting..

Having run in the MGCC championship and now going to do some ASWMC rounds, I'm a big advocate of grass roots motorsport. However, I understand that this level of motorsport may not be as exciting as watching Adam Fleetwood pip Wight Jr to the post (I wouldn't pay entrance money to come and watch me being slow!). But we need both, and thankfully it seems that most of the hills do seem to successfully cater for / balance the needs of every competitor.

[flagwaver]

Barbon Manor has to be my favorite. The paddock may be a bit naff but the views are just great, add some great cars & what else could you want?

[Fireblade]

Originally posted by Dan Friel
Off to Wiscombe in April (any advice?), so that'll be interesting..

Yes plenty, take a scuba suit!!!
Renowned for slinging it down there. Hence the Brtish Championship only runs in July nowadays. They used to have 2 slots, one in May and other in September.
But they lost one and moved other to mid summer.
Was a good move really.

Nice venue though and can be incident packed.

[Dan Friel]

Here's hoping that 'incident packed' doesn't include me!

[Anuauto]

In more recent years was April and September. Run by different clubs. The September went when enough people got fed up with being shouted at. The April changed to July because of the scandalous conduct of the contenders who refused to run after people had worked all winter (a day a week in several cases) to make fix up the track facilities.

[Fireblade]

Originally posted by Anuauto
In more recent years was April and September. Run by different clubs. The September went when enough people got fed up with being shouted at. The April changed to July because of the scandalous conduct of the contenders who refused to run after people had worked all winter (a day a week in several cases) to make fix up the track facilities.

You make it sound like the volunteers at Wiscombe are the only ones who work on a track in the off season. I can assure you that there are many others in the same position.
Loton Park for example has many work party weekends.
Even that old Grandaddy Shelsley has a working party every April. And some members can paint the fence without messing up their blazers or splashing their brogues, lol.
So its not just Wiscombe Park that relies on well meaning volunteers.
As for "the scandalous conduct of the contenders" from the competitors, well thats their choice. From what I see they didn't deprive many of much. 2 bystanders and a dog were all that was left to see the cars that didnt run. And talking of dogs. Why do Wiscombe allow dogs brought by punters in direct contravention of MSA rulings? Now an otter in the conditions I could understand.

I now know what you mean about "Grass Roots" motorsport having been there. More like "Tree Roots" in my opinion.