[LM24] Audi plans for 2010 revealed

[CTD]

Originally Posted by gwyllion

The R15+ features a new element on the front at Paul Richard: http://www.endurance-info.com/versio...bres1_A_14.jpg

Downforce element?. Seems weird on Paul Richard!

[gwyllion]

Perhaps it has to similar function as the horn winglet of last year.

[gwyllion]

Tom Kristensen’s Exclusive Le Mans Countdown – Part 6

[Mal]

Does this prove that Sportscars are better for marketing than F1??

http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsAr...llCars/248749/

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by CTD

Downforce element?. Seems weird on Paul Richard!

Nah, legality.

[porsche91722]

Originally Posted by Mal

Does this prove that Sportscars are better for marketing than F1??

http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsAr...llCars/248749/

I'm sure we are all hoping this heralds their return to a full time racing commitment in LMP1. With their marketing performance in China, I wonder what, if any, can be put down to their LMP1 past successes. It would be interesting to hear what Audi themselves think about this.

[Acid09]

Surpassing BMW, good luck with that

Audi seems to think that introducing new models is the way to archive that, within the next few years they want to expand their portfolio to over 40 different(!) models.

So look forward to the new crossover-SUV-convertible-stationwagon RS..whatever.

I guess if you can't beat your competitior in terms of quality you´ll try quantity instead...

[Aysedasi]

BMW fan eh?

[merlot brougham]

Originally Posted by Aysedasi

BMW fan eh?

If not him then me. And BMW isn't gar behind on inventing new segments to sell something in. You've got the 5-series GT and a rumored 3-series GT in the next generation. Then things like X5 and X6 M cars and $100K+ X6 and 7-series hybrids. They've kind of lost me, I just wish they would lighten up the cars to bring back more sensitive dynamics. I'm trading my '07 335i in on a used E46 M3 Competition Package because the 335 feels so dull to me from past cars. Off topic...

I don't think that until you start seeing sports cars on as many TV screens around the world as you do F1 will it ever come even remotely close. Mercedes is really reaping the rewards of it since the other factory teams bailed.

Oh yeah, they should probably also RACE the cars too. Audi at least has not felt that it has been necessary recently. Huh...they stop participating in as many races and they sell more cars. That's not the type of correlation I want to see

[fausto]

Audi (and Peugeot) testing @Monza, last thursday (very short clip) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=744eLxiMEFk

[gwyllion]

A huge amount of pictures of Audi Sport Team Joest taken during this weekend: http://www.motorsport.com/photos/sel...torsport&S=LMS

[Martin90]

Great photos!
Gotta say, now that I've seen it in a race I do think the new livery looks way better than the old one

[Aysedasi]

I have to agree!

[chernaudi]

Where did the Audi and the Pug collide--I can't see any damage on the Audi, so it must be fairly tough, at least by modern LMP standards. And it seems that the designation R15 Plus is only an internal/simplified designation, and the car's offical name is Audi R15 TDI, Model 2010(or Audi R15 2010 for short): http://www.fourtitude.com/news/publi...cle_5813.shtml

And it seems that the R15 is now like the R8 and even the R10 in that it responds better and quicker to minute set up changes-something the old R15 sometimes didn't do as well. Could it be that the emphasis is now on mechanical grip and the channel bodywork has basically been done away with?

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Where did the Audi and the Pug collide--I can't see any damage on the Audi, so it must be fairly tough, at least by modern LMP standards. And it seems that the designation R15 Plus is only an internal/simplified designation, and the car's offical name is Audi R15 TDI, Model 2010(or Audi R15 2010 for short): http://www.fourtitude.com/news/publi...cle_5813.shtml

And it seems that the R15 is now like the R8 and even the R10 in that it responds better and quicker to minute set up changes-something the old R15 sometimes didn't do as well. Could it be that the emphasis is now on mechanical grip and the channel bodywork has basically been done away with?

Why any doubt about the channel concept being done away with? For how long has Mulsanne's Corner been saying that was the direction and viola, that's what we have. I dare say the mechanical package of the car is little changed...

[chernaudi]

But the channel concept threw Audi a big curve at Le Mans, and it seems to be for the better that they've done away with it as the main aero feature of the car, seeing as how the R15 is now close to equalling the 908 in straight line speed.

Audi seems to favor a back to basics concept with the revised R15, and reverting back to simpler but still effective methods for producing downforce that are more adjustable, not to mention that the car does seem to still have a handling/braking advantage over the 908 with the aformentioned striaght line speed to match.

Also, this should answer definitively the reasoning for the front fender mounted wheel spats-they seem to be entirely for cover up the inboard sections of the wheel/suspension assembly in plan view as it goes through it's steering lock, as from the onboard, there's a small section under a compliance panel where the wheel can be seen.

However, as to the channel concept, I'm well aware that it's no longer being used, as the ducting in the side of the car can seemingly do little more than feed the rear brake cooling ducts. However, strangely, there've been reports that the stuff for the channels mounted alongside the engine block and gearbox casing remains-too difficult to get rid of, or have they been reconfigrued to assist in engine bay air circulation? Otherwise, with the channel concept seemingly being abandoned, wouldn't that stuff just be dead weight aside from maybe abosorbing energy in a rearward collision?

But then again, no one's seen the rear of the R15 with the rear deck raised, and of course the chances aren't that great that anyone from Audi will be overly forthcoming about such matters, though Audi should have little to hide if the R15 Plus fully suits the letter of the ACO's and IMSA's rules.

Also, Audi said in a press release that the R15 Plus responds to chassis and external/conventional bodywork changes in a more precise and easily understood measure than the old car did(and Audi did seem at times to struggle for the set up on the old R15). Could it be the channels no longer contribute to the areo on the car, or is it just simply that Audi has had about a year with the R15 irregardless of iteration to learn and undestand the car. It's also worth noting that it seems that the R15 Plus seems to be very easy on its tires as well.

[Javi]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Also, Audi said in a press release that the R15 Plus responds to chassis and external/conventional bodywork changes in a more precise and easily understood measure than the old car did(and Audi did seem at times to struggle for the set up on the old R15). Could it be the channels no longer contribute to the areo on the car, or is it just simply that Audi has had about a year with the R15 irregardless of iteration to learn and undestand the car. It's also worth noting that it seems that the R15 Plus seems to be very easy on its tires as well.

Well, nice words about the R15+ are expected from a official press release, aren´t they?
I don´t remember reading anything wrong from the R15 before Le Mans struggle. After that most everyone of us was discussing channel concepts, lack of straightline speed and set up problems. Had they won Le Mans last year (because Peugeot faltering or anything) we will probably not have been THAT aware of R15 shortcomings...
If there´s anything wrong with the R15+ (and i don´t think Audi will make mistakes twice!) we´ll know after Spa and Le Mans

[chernaudi]

Actually, Audi said that the new R15 was responding better to chassis and areo changes than the old car in a post-qualifying press release after not winning the pole and using the quailifying session as more race setup practice.

But another thing from the press releases is that Joest technical directory Ralf Juttner said that the tires on all the cars seemed to be extremely fast over one or two laps, but that they'd loose that sheer speed after that. But from there on in, the Audi was pretty consistant on older tires and seemed to hold more of it's speed during a run than most everyone else, namely Peugeot.

Audi seems to have worked on three things with the R15 Plus:
1--Tire durability and being able to use those tires without overly abusing them, and being able to use them to the full for longer.

2--Areo package, namely having one that's more adjustable and not restrained by some concept that now is questionable whether or not it was the right way to go.

3--Reliability. The basic R15 mechanicals are reliable, as it has the fewest mechanical problems of any LMP car Audi introduced, even the R8. I think the intercooler problems were due in part to the heavily louvred sidepods from last year and nothing to screen out the dirt and dust. That, and the areodynamic changes, have lead Audi to close up the sidepods and(it seems from looking at the top of the sidepods) mounting detachable screens behind the main intake screens. That, and the R15 has survived two 24-30 hour test at Sebring without difficulty, which 30 hours at Sebring definently makes Peugeot's 30 hout tests at Paul Ricard look like cakewalks, and one of the Monza tests was an endurance test.

Spa, LM and anyother race Peugeot enters will be tough if Audi has their sums right.

[Lola T70]

[QUOTE=chernaudi;2671864]That, and the R15 has survived two 24-30 hour test at Sebring without difficulty, which 30 hours at Sebring definently makes Peugeot's 30 hout tests at Paul Ricard look like cakewalks, and one of the Monza tests was an endurance test.

Sorry I thought they had a big accident before the endurance test even started in Sebring. Hate to see a difficult one if that is an easy one.

[Aysedasi]

Testing will never be the same as racing though - that was the big criticism of Audi pre Le Mans last year.....

[chernaudi]

As far as racing last year goes, it can be argued there wasn't really any relevance to be gained from Audi running the full ALMS season before Le Mans, and even the Spa 1000K last year. I doubt that Audi could've learned much from 2 ALMS sprint races that the longest that one lasted was 2:45 and two of which were on street courses and the other in a glorified motorcycle track. It could be argued that even at Spa that Audi couldn't have learned much, since Spa is a high downforce track that would've suited the R15.

How did Audi learn or at least confirm that the channel concept probably wasn't the direction that they wanted to go in retrospect? Most likely, it was during high speed testing at Paul Ricard. However, Mulsanne Mike has stated that during the R15's development, that the designers were leaning more towards a concept similar to the current car, but got sidetracked with the channel concept when the wanted to design a car to do double duty at LM and the ALMS.

Paul Ricard got added to the LMS schedule and Audi took full advantage, and they'll do the same at Spa to prepare for the LMIC, since Spa is a high downforce track like Silverstone and Road Atlanta.

And yes, Audi did damage a R15 during a test at Sebring, but a month before Audi did a 24 Hour endurance test there with an old R15 to test suspension, chassis setups and mechanicals, and it went off without a hitch. And the accident happened during the post 12 Hours of Sebring test and on the Monday after Sebring during a simple set up/familiarization test. Even one of the Monza tests(if not both) were high speed endurance tests.

So far, the R15 2010 hasn't has a major reliablity problem in a test, or, more importantly, a race so far, while the Oreca Pug hand grenaded an engine during a 30 hour test, and had the air jack problems that cost 20 minutes for a problem that Audi fixed at Sebring in '09 in about 20-30 seconds during a pit stop.

If a factory 908 was at Paul Ricard, we'd have a clearer picture, but I doubt that head to head with the same driver that the factory Pugs would be much faster than the Oreca car, which was on average slightly slower than the new R15 at Paul Ricard in race trim.

[Lola T70]

Did anyone hear from Hindy when Kristensen would be back? I was surprised he was not driving after the positive news he had given on his Le Mans countdown about it getting better.

A footballer is 6 months for this injury and other sports a similar time apparently.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by Lola T70

Did anyone hear from Hindy when Kristensen would be back? I was surprised he was not driving after the positive news he had given on his Le Mans countdown about it getting better.

A footballer is 6 months for this injury and other sports a similar time apparently.

He will be ready for Spa .
He says his foot is good, but unfortunately not strong enough to push down the clutch, yet.

[Martin90]

Originally Posted by Lola T70

Did anyone hear from Hindy when Kristensen would be back? I was surprised he was not driving after the positive news he had given on his Le Mans countdown about it getting better.

A footballer is 6 months for this injury and other sports a similar time apparently.

I believe he mentioned the 19th of April as a date when Kristensen would be driving the car again.

[chernaudi]

Not neccessarily the best photo, but the Audi R15 2010's front diffuser is now sporting vortex generators(think mini-stakes) in the splitter section, due to it's one piece nature, and above all else, the higher angle of attack that it's being run at to take advantage of it's asymmetrcial shape(assumed) and to regain front downforce: http://www.mulsannescorner.com/newsmarch10.html

Also, the R15 is still using the same tires(and, presumably, wheels) as last year.