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28 Apr 2004, 18:27 (Ref:954890)
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 549
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The 2005 CCWS SCHEDULE ?!
from www.champcarfan.com
 ------------------------------------------ According to OWRS we shall know the 2005 schedule by the end of July. In the meantime there is a nagging question whether we're going to see ovals disappear or not. At Long Beach, the OWRS CEO Dick Eidswick had said that "diversity" and ovals will still play a major role, but the Champ Car Troika has a slightly different plans. Due to the planned "new engine/chassis formula" to come into effect in 2006 there is a strong possibility that Milwaukee and oval racing will be dropped in favor of lighter, narrower and nimbler cars suitable for best performance on road and street courses. Two months ago, Gerry Forsythe has stated: "We are working on seven (7) new venues for the 2005 schedule", he also added: "We are currently looking at races in Spain and the UK for 2005." Besides that, OWRS is also looking at other European venues, and lately it looks like F1 will ditch the San Marino GP next year, when asked about Imola Forsythe said: "We would have to talk to Bernie if he would bless us taking over for F1 at Imola, then certainly we would consider it." France and Germany are also being considered due to the possibility of attracting new engine manufacturers to the series. On the international scene: Emerson Fittipaldi and Kevin Kalkhoven are currently working hard in trying to secure new venues in Brazil and Argentina, Stephen Watson is still pursuing luring Champ Car to South Africa, so are the new tracks in Dubai and Qatar, and most of all - Ford is pushing OWRS to race in China. Adding it all up, there is much more chances of expanding internationally than domestically. According to Paul Gentilozzi there are plans to add a domestic race or two on the East Coast - St.Petersburg seems very likely here. There are rumors of a new Meadowlands, NJ project that may materialize. Houston street race is still being discussed, as is the St.Louis one. Even reconsidering Miami is given a thought. All in all, we will see an 18-20 race schedule next year that will be quite drastically different from this year's. Don't know which current venues will suffer axing, but there are a few that are questionable for next year: Milwaukee, Portland, Denver, and Road America. Here's a list of possible new venues, half of which we might see on the upcoming 2005 schedule - listed in order of probability: 1. SALTA, Argentina - road course 2. BRASÍLIA or SANTA CRUZ, Brazil - road course 3. ST.PETERSBURG, USA - street race 4. DURBAN, RSA - street race 5. JEREZ or BILBAO, Spain - street race 6. SILVERSTONE or DONNINGTON, UK - road course 7. DUBAI, UAE - road course 8. HOUSTON, USA - street race 9. ADRIA or IMOLA, Italy - road course 10. HANNOVER, Germany - street race 11. MARSEILLES or PAU, France - street race 12. BEIJING, China - road course 13. MEADOWLANDS, NJ - road course 14. ST.LOUIS, USA - street race 15. DOHA, Qatar - road course 16. MADRID, Spain - road course (or oval) This year we have a belated inaugural OWRS/CCWS season, but next year we shall see what Champ Car is really "made of" ?!... the saga shall continue... stay tuned...  zerO |
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28 Apr 2004, 19:54 (Ref:954959)
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,213
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Donington please....
 A great track...and currently having a shedload of money thrown at it in upgrades for the Bikes...but should also suit Champ Cars! I'd LOVE to see a Champ Car go through the Old Hairpin...and I'd LOVE to see them MAKE it through the old hairpin too! Although they should NEVER EVER lose Road America....surely all they went through last year should tell them what the fans want, in this regard!
Last edited by codename_47; 28 Apr 2004 at 19:55. |
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__________________
We need to win like you need to breathe.... |
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28 Apr 2004, 19:54 (Ref:954960)
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#3 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,213
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*edit*
Now it's my turn to suffer double post embarrasment...I always wondered what it'd be like!  Sorry! 
Last edited by codename_47; 28 Apr 2004 at 19:54. |
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__________________
We need to win like you need to breathe.... |
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28 Apr 2004, 20:15 (Ref:954977)
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,748
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Quote:
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__________________
"I have a tendency to let my mind wander a bit during some of the yellow flag conditions; I look around, check out people in the stands, things like that" Darren Law - Lizard Extrordinaire and he's gonna be GT Leader and Brumos Porsche driver! |
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28 Apr 2004, 22:43 (Ref:955205)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Quote:
I belive that the "Save It" campaign has to do with the "original" circuit, that was actually raced on county roads and streets in and around Elkhart Lake itself. The "original course' was a little over 5 miles long, and it went around Elkhart Lake itself.... Ultimately, racing on the streets was banned, and they built what is now known as "Road America was built as a permanent facility a few miles up the road from the town of Elkhart Lake... I can't remember where I read about this, but it has something to do with re-grading and widening those county roads that were a portion of the old street course... However, I don't think it has anything to do with the "Road America" facility being torn up..... But because they have such close ties to the tradition of the race up there, The Road America people want those roads to become part of the National Historical Registry, and thus protected from being changed since they were such a big part of the racing, tourism, and economic history of the area because they comprised that original circuit... They are spearheading the fight due to those ties... There are plenty of "Racing Circuit" sites and such on the web...I'm sure that many of them, if not all, will distinguish between the two courses.... I could be wrong...wouldn't be the first time...but that's what I remember reading.... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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29 Apr 2004, 18:02 (Ref:955946)
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#6 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 549
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The problem with Road America is that IRL is pushing hard to get a date there - they'll most likely get it since TG will throw any $$$ amount neccessary to make GB happy... then comes a question of whether CCWS will fit in or want to ?!
zerO |
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29 Apr 2004, 20:14 (Ref:956078)
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,065
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Medowlands would be great because CART always talked about getting into the New York market. But it has to be a really cool course, or no one would go.
Wasn't Houston suppossed to be in the schedule this year? Maybe they are coming back again. As great a city Houston is, I remember it being not a particulary thrilling race. |
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__________________
Cuz trucks need love, too! |
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29 Apr 2004, 20:28 (Ref:956090)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Quote:
Excuse me, but didn't they TRY the Meadowlands once...and didn't it fail miserably???? Suggestion: If this Series wants to go to the "Big Apple," try to work a deal with the City and with the Sports Commission there to hook up a deal to race at Floyd Bennett Field near Brooklyn.... It is an old military airfield that is still in decent shape, has plenty of room for parking and grandstands, and is 10 minutes away from JFK Airport and the support industries (hotels, restaurants, etc) that surround JFK....the place once did host races at one time.... you can look it up on a site called www.airfields-freeman.com I've even looked at "zoom in" aerial images of the place...and hav drawn up possible courses there... It would work....and would be much better than a race in a parking lot.... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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29 Apr 2004, 21:50 (Ref:956157)
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#9 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,677
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i think we are more likley to see champcars back at brands rather than silverstone or donnington due to the fact between justin wilson & john palmer
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__________________
The race track and the human body, both born of the earth, drive to be one with the earth, and through the earth one with the car, drive to the undiminished dream, single moments of pleasure, an eternity of memories. |
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29 Apr 2004, 22:28 (Ref:956190)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 8,125
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I remain surprised that Ford still hasn't "suggested" a new GP in Detroit.
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__________________
Don't make a fuss, just get on the bus! |
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29 Apr 2004, 22:50 (Ref:956213)
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Racer
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 448
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They shouldn't even THINK about coming to Houston for another street race unless they can design the course so it doesn't disrupt a lot of traffic and upset all the businesses in the area, which happened with the first.
Fl*ming_W*zzle... Did I do a good job of dodging autocensor there? Last edited by macdaddy; 29 Apr 2004 at 22:55. |
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__________________
Eagles may soar, but BRMs don't get sucked into jet engines. |
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30 Apr 2004, 07:44 (Ref:956503)
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#12 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,065
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Flaming_Wuzzle
[B]They shouldn't even THINK about coming to Houston for another street race unless they can design the course so it doesn't disrupt a lot of traffic and upset all the businesses in the area, which happened with the first. Is that what happened in Houston? Interesting... that would defeat the entire purpose of a Champ Car race bring in business, doesn't it? |
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30 Apr 2004, 08:00 (Ref:956512)
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#13 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,512
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What originates such a probability standings?
In particular, why should it be more likely a Cart venue in one of the less populated area of an underpopulated country like Argentina, than say, a place like Imola, which, expectably, will lose the F1 race? BTW the Pau option wouldbe very interesting |
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__________________
You got to learn how to fall, before you learn to fly P.Simon |
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30 Apr 2004, 08:04 (Ref:956518)
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#14 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,065
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Climb, you're right. I guess the one thing that is for sure is that Champ Cars will go wherever there is money to be made. So, if Salta, Argentina will make more money for the series than New York City, then a race will probably happen in Argentina.
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__________________
Cuz trucks need love, too! |
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30 Apr 2004, 08:12 (Ref:956528)
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#15 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,065
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Suggestion:
If this Series wants to go to the "Big Apple," try to work a deal with the City and with the Sports Commission there to hook up a deal to race at Floyd Bennett Field near Brooklyn.... It is an old military airfield that is still in decent shape, has plenty of room for parking and grandstands, and is 10 minutes away from JFK Airport and the support industries (hotels, restaurants, etc) that surround JFK....the place once did host races at one time.... you can look it up on a site called www.airfields-freeman.com I've even looked at "zoom in" aerial images of the place...and hav drawn up possible courses there... It would work....and would be much better than a race in a parking lot.... [/B][/QUOTE] I looked at the airfield photos. It could work, but those taxiways on the eastern and southern edge of the field are pretty narrow. That could be a problem. BTW, thanks for posting that website. I looked up some old airfields in my area, and the history is very cool 
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30 Apr 2004, 08:26 (Ref:956545)
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,512
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Quote:
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__________________
You got to learn how to fall, before you learn to fly P.Simon |
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30 Apr 2004, 14:06 (Ref:956942)
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#17 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Quote:
BTW, thanks for posting that website. I looked up some old airfields in my area, and the history is very cool [/B][/QUOTE] These images are courtesy of www.airfileds-freeman.com The lines are courtesy of me...after speaking with people who have been there for other events and have seen the place....I got a ton of e-mails from New Yorkers when I posted this facility as a possible ALMS site.... All were very positive about the facility, but worried about the politics to get it done... The key would be the New York Sports Commission buying into it... NOTE TO "SPORTSCAR & GT" people who surf this Forum...I PROMISE Iwon't get off on the "airfields" jag again...but it is appropriate just to puth this forward once...to get people to thik about "do-able" possibilities... I also looked at a lot of potential facilities in or near major markets, including Dallas, Boston, and others....those two also have excellent possibilities (Dallas NAS and South Weymouth NAS near Boston) NOTE: The Runways (according to people who have actually been there) are somewhere between 80 and 100 ft wide, and the taxiways are about 40 ft. wide (if I remember correctly...I could be confusing it with one of many other facilities) This is an actual image of Floyd Bennett from above... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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30 Apr 2004, 14:08 (Ref:956948)
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#18 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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This is an image of "Options" that would be possible to create a race circuit
The White areas are places where a top coat of asphalt would probably have to be done: |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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30 Apr 2004, 14:11 (Ref:956951)
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#19 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Here is one option that I really like for this circuit...
NOTE: at the bottom of the image, the "extended" southern portion could easily go onto that stretch of taxiway just above it insead to lessent the cost of getting the place ready to race: |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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30 Apr 2004, 14:16 (Ref:956956)
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#20 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Here is one that is a little more conservative at the north end of the facility.....
I'm done.... But I believe that these "Abandoned Airfileds," if they are in workable shape and are in markets that make sense for Champ Cars, are a MUCH BETTER idea than "street parades" on avenues that are rough, and crowned, and do not promote passing and good racing... |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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30 Apr 2004, 14:32 (Ref:956975)
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#21 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,983
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That looks a lot better than the foible at the Meadowlands. In one of those Meadowlands races in the '80s, Arie Luyendyk went off an escape road, actually got lost in the parking lot and had to be directed back on the course! There's just no room for a course and no room for people there and it was just abominable.
As to all the hypotheticals about the 2005 schedule, the 2004 schedule isn't even complete yet. |
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30 Apr 2004, 14:41 (Ref:956989)
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#22 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,213
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Quote:
 Funny story! As to the 2004 schedule....I take this as a positive.. If they're already thinking of 2005...then perhaps at least THEY know what those provisionals are going to be, and are just waiting for I's to be dotted and T's to be crossed on contracts before they can get to announcing...
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__________________
We need to win like you need to breathe.... |
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30 Apr 2004, 16:15 (Ref:957088)
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#23 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,065
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Great job sketching the track out! If the taxiways are 40 feet long, then that should be more than enough clearance to have a 2-wide passing area.
The first track could be too long. Approxomate how many miles are each layout? |
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__________________
Cuz trucks need love, too! |
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30 Apr 2004, 16:26 (Ref:957096)
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#24 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,215
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Quote:
The longer one is approximately 4.67 miles and the second is a little over 4.5.... BTW....I don't know where Elk Grove is located.... But if Long Beach ends up going away, I've got a GREAT "airfield" that is either in the "Riverside" area or the Santa Barbara area in California... Look up the "El Toro MCAC" airfield... It's HUGE...and it offers TONS of options for circuites, pit lanes, places to set up grandstands, etc... THe long runways are 11,000 ft. in length each.... Check this place out!!!!! |
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__________________
Finally... One American Open Wheel Series! |
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30 Apr 2004, 16:31 (Ref:957099)
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#25 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 549
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Hey Tim,
that's a very good concept with Bennett's Field, maybe you could direct this to someone who'd listen... (insert "idea" emoticon) on the other hand, you forgot that Flushing Meadows still could be worked out - all is needed is convincing the tennis loving yuppies that Champcars are not as loud as F1 cars, and the F1 proposal is still being tossed around in re: Flushing Meadows (was involved with it myself back in '80ies)... another thing, Meadowlands has acquired extra acreage and the plan is to build a semi-permanent road course - no longer a parking lot thingy like it used to be - God only knows if it will ever see daylight... funny thing is Paul Newman wants a road course and Mario wants a short oval... hihihaha... I don't think we'll see a Champ Car or F1 race in/around NYC anytime soon (same goes for Chicago, btw) ?! zerO |
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