French GP under threat ?

josvandeperre · 21 Jun 2005, 19:50 (Ref:1336358)

Now apologies to Wrex for starting a new thread but I think the implication of this story on grandprix.com may warrant it - essentially we have seen the last 20 car grand prix for a while as the FIA may ban Michelin which could prevent the seven teams competing :

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns15080.html

alesi95 · 21 Jun 2005, 19:51 (Ref:1336362)

Suicide, comes to mind.

pirenzo · 21 Jun 2005, 20:02 (Ref:1336372)

"apparently suggests"

I'd think its more likely they'd be excluded from future championships, which is what has already been talked about anyway...

GP Racer · 21 Jun 2005, 20:15 (Ref:1336383)

This sport has obviously spiralled out of control. Max's constant fiddling with the rules to manufacture good racing has begun to backfire on everyone. The sport has become a mess of terrible rules, which are simply unmanageable and the standards unattainable and to complex for the teams involved.

The worst may be still to come...

Inigo Montoya · 21 Jun 2005, 20:36 (Ref:1336413)

Well, they could still race in France with the 6 Bridgestone runners. Wouldn't THAT be something

ensign14 · 21 Jun 2005, 20:36 (Ref:1336415)

Desperate attempts by the FIA to get Ferrari into the Championship lead.

Seriously, this is, I am guessing, a shot across bows - but I wonder if the FIA is getting desperate with the GPWC? Ferrari having an off year was the absolute worst thing to happen to the FIA/F1 axis, the GPWC will have, ooh, the 4 best teams around. And presumably they will still have a Ferrari, albeit in the back of a Red Bull. (Also giving Ferrari a foot in both camps.)

TomS · 21 Jun 2005, 20:42 (Ref:1336424)

Surely the FIA wouldnt be this stupid?

Inigo Montoya · 21 Jun 2005, 20:49 (Ref:1336430)

This is not going to happen. The reason the teams are going to France to answer to the FIA is to receive their respective fines, which will then be used to reinburse the spectators at Indy. Rightly so, IMHO.

REALIST · 21 Jun 2005, 20:51 (Ref:1336431)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomS

Surely the FIA wouldnt be this stupid?

Of course they would!!! Why change the habit of a lifetime?

Inigo Montoya · 21 Jun 2005, 20:52 (Ref:1336433)

We've got enough bashing of the FIA in other threads. Discuss the topic at hand please.

Fogelhund · 21 Jun 2005, 21:15 (Ref:1336465)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inigo Montoya

We've got enough bashing of the FIA in other threads. Discuss the topic at hand please.

Of course one could say the same about your comments above.

Back on topic -

The point, no matter whom to blame here, is that the rhetoric is appearing to escalatte. Both sides are posturing that they are 100% in the right. We all know the egos are large, and that backing down is going to be difficult.

So the teams each get fined $ 4 mil, and some points.

How do you think Michelin will feel having an FIA panel decide, and declare whether their tires are safe or not? Or banned from the series on account of being deemed unsafe. Sorry for being graphic, but the FIA is bending them over and greasing them up. As a corporation, they are being put in an even more difficult position now. Will they subject their tires, or information to this panel?

With all the previous tension, and things being ramped up even further now, talk of the GPWC... this is getting to be on rather fragile ice.

I can easily see the teams and Michelin saying Sod off if the FIA comes down too hard on them... and that being the end of the season. No matter what you feel about whose fault Indy was, a Nuclear Winter is not a particularly palatable option.... though I do wonder how quickly a GPWC could have races organized. Seven teams, with or without Minardi and Jordan... Surely Ferrari would be excluded...

Strange days.

Inigo Montoya · 21 Jun 2005, 21:29 (Ref:1336501)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Of course one could say the same about your comments above.

My comments above? You mean the joke about having the 6 Bstone runners go in France. That IS on topic. Feel free to PM me if there are any further misunderstandings.

Menelaos · 21 Jun 2005, 21:35 (Ref:1336514)

If the FIA tries to rob the Michelin teams off of even ONE point they will be totally right to leave the F1 championship forever and go on with the well known "side-plan". It's ridiculous, their tyre manufacturer made a big mistake and they received no points at all. Do they need to be further punished?

If they ARE punished, especially by reducing their championship points, I'm afraid the whole championship is going to be screwed, not just the french gp...

Silk Cut Jaguar · 21 Jun 2005, 21:40 (Ref:1336519)

Say what you want about the FIA but they're not going to launch a cannonball into the French and British GPs.

If they do suspend Michelin from competing this season for however many races you can kiss goodbye to Formula One and the FIA will have to find something else to stick their World Championship label on.

Michelin are on thin and extremely expensive ground and I expect the teams are already faxing over their requirements to Bridgestone for 2006.

Sodemo · 21 Jun 2005, 21:48 (Ref:1336526)

LOL!!

I must be having a month of preminitions!

A month ago I said the FIA should change to slick tyres / little aero / wide cars, and the FIA announced just that for 2008.

Now they are suggesting the 7 teams could be effectively banned from the rest of the championship, which, yes you guessed, I stated about 3 days ago!!!

How about 3 on the trot?

Silk Cut Jaguar · 21 Jun 2005, 22:03 (Ref:1336546)

You better start predicting that everything will be swept under the carpet.

Sodemo · 21 Jun 2005, 22:14 (Ref:1336554)

Actually i'm predicting this isn't going to end well, and its going to go on and on and on.

Mosport67 · 21 Jun 2005, 22:33 (Ref:1336567)

What do I know? I was the guy who 20 minutes before Indy said there is no way they won't figure something out here so all 20 cars race.

There doesn't seem to be much desire to figure out a solution. I worry about Max and his next steps/

BootsOntheSide · 21 Jun 2005, 22:37 (Ref:1336569)

He's becoming ever more dictatorial - a sign of old age, perhaps. There's no way the teams should recieve any penalty over and beyond the loss of points in the US - any further punishment to Michelin should be either financial or future-based (such as a abn from 2006-7).

Menelaos · 21 Jun 2005, 22:57 (Ref:1336580)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monster

How about 3 on the trot?

Please, PLEASE, say there won't be any further problems with F1 and everything will be sorted out asap.

Dixie Flatline · 22 Jun 2005, 00:01 (Ref:1336618)

Quote:

Originally Posted by josvandeperre

Now apologies to Wrex for starting a new thread but I think the implication of this story on grandprix.com may warrant it - essentially we have seen the last 20 car grand prix for a while as the FIA may ban Michelin which could prevent the seven teams competing :

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns15080.html

grandprix.com tend to mix solid news reporting with more than a dash of speculation about what the news means. It'll be interesting as to whether their speculation this time turns out to be correct.

Asa · 22 Jun 2005, 02:39 (Ref:1336689)

Yeah, 6 cars on the track for every race from France, get your tickets now before Bridgestone screws up and Grand Prix racing is no more.

alfasud · 22 Jun 2005, 03:30 (Ref:1336715)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Menelaos

If the FIA tries to rob the Michelin teams off of even ONE point they will be totally right to leave the F1 championship forever and go on with the well known "side-plan". It's ridiculous, their tyre manufacturer made a big mistake and they received no points at all. Do they need to be further punished?

If they ARE punished, especially by reducing their championship points, I'm afraid the whole championship is going to be screwed, not just the french gp...

Of course it can be argued that there is a valid argument for removing points from Michelin teams... I'm not saying I support removing points, but the argument goes something like this.... the Michelin teams were given several options to race, but did not race because they might not have scored points (or maybe no better than 7th and 8th). By withdrawing at the last possible moment, it would seem that they are now able to carry fresh engines into the French GP which should allow them to be more competitive in that race, thereby gaining from the Indy withdrawal, by minimising the total loss of points over the two races.

Therefore a reduction in championship points would not be completely unfair in this case. Like I said, I would not call for a removal of points, because the teams can put forward an argument that they were primarily motivated by safety concerns, but if there is a removal of points the Michelin teams should accept it and move on.

RaceFreak · 22 Jun 2005, 03:32 (Ref:1336718)

Gentlemen
I firmly believe we, as racing fans, would be better off if this were indeed the beginning of the end. F1 is SO hopelessly screwed up now. NO credibility. NO regard for it's customers (the fans!). NO sportsmanship. NO scruples beyond money. F1's very soul has been corrupted by men who think they are bigger than the sport itself. We would be better served if the sport naturally purged itself and came reborne in a year or two.
Painful ? Certainly. But cathartic for sure.

There will always be motor racing. History tells us so. The question is what form will it take. It's only one man's opinion, but the present form is unsatisfactory.

Raglanparade · 22 Jun 2005, 03:41 (Ref:1336726)

How hard could it be to whack Bridgestone tyres on McLarens, Williams, Renault, Red Bull, Toyota, Sauber and BAR ???

In the old days they switched tyres within the season. I remember Brabham running on both Goodyears and Dunlops in the same season in the 60's at some point.

The FIA bans Michelin from F1 with immediate effect, and the 7 Michelin teams are forced to run on Bridgestones for the rest of the season.

If i was the FIA, thats the punishment id be dishing out.

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