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27 Oct 2011, 20:34 (Ref:2977921) | #1 | |
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Tyrrell 025
Maybe there are some people here in this forum who might have knowledge in the history of my latest toy, a Tyrrell 025 car.
It has no chassis plate and is in 2002 Minardi livery which suggests that it was part of Paul Stoddarts collection. It was in Malaysia as a display piece for some time. Unfortunately the seller don´t know much about it and sold it as Tyrrell 024 which I think is wrong. Looking at the details of the monocoque it is most likely a 025 except the nose which is 024. A former Tyrrell team member who was involved in designing the car told me that there were no showcars or mock up´s built only real race cars so mine must have been one of them. But which one??? Maybe there are some former Tyrrell or Minardi team members in this forum who can shed some light on the history of my car. Any information is gladly appreciated. |
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27 Oct 2011, 23:01 (Ref:2977955) | #2 | |
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Your Tyrrell is probably one of 5 chassis used in 1997 and originally used a Ford Cosworth ED4 or ED5 engine, if it had a Yamaha engine then it would be a 1996 024. I seem to remember another 025 for sale in Germany about 2 years ago but cannot remember any more details. Most if not all of the later Tyrrell's ended up in Paul Stoddard's hands.
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28 Oct 2011, 06:49 (Ref:2978022) | #3 | ||
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Frits van Eerd has or had at least 2 that were used in EuroBOSS circa 2006/2007. One of the guys from Geva racing who ran the cars then I believe has/does post on here so maybe he might be able to tell which 2 they were in order to help deduce which one is yours.
I believe they are ex Paul Stoddart cars but like the above I do stand to be corrected on any of that. |
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28 Oct 2011, 07:09 (Ref:2978024) | #4 | ||
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Are there any photos to help?
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28 Oct 2011, 20:30 (Ref:2978361) | #5 | |
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There is a chassis plate in the car "European Formula Racing, Chassis 026T, No. 08, year 2000" written on it.
Maybe this is of help identifying it´s real Tyrrell chassis number. The pictures show clearly the 024 nose but rest of the car is in 025 style. But one detail makes me wonder: All pictures I found of 025 cars show a about 2cm thick sidewall around the headrest area where the tower wings were fixed to the monocoque. The sidewalls on my car are thinner, exactly as they were on the 024 type. |
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31 Oct 2011, 08:39 (Ref:2979433) | #6 | ||
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I don't claim to be an expert, and its difficult to tell, but it looks 024(ish) to me
http://rvreekum.home.xs4all.nl/ty07g.html but that would have been a 96 car The 025 had a much thicker underbody central strake on to which the front wing was attached for a start & I doubt it would be easy to change that. http://rvreekum.home.xs4all.nl/ty07g.html However, to put a spanner in the works, I wonder if it is a Minardi. I'm sure that when Paul Stoddart bought Minardi & had to get a team on to the grid at very short notice he had already bought the remnants of the Tyrrell team & I have a feeling that I read somewhere that his first "Minardi" was essentially the based on the design of a never raced Tyrrell "027". The Minardi 2 seaters were certainly based on the Tyrrell 026 |
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2 Nov 2011, 20:16 (Ref:2980798) | #7 | |
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Does anyboby know if Tyrrell did test drives in 1997 with the 025 car with smaller track to simulate the new 1998 F1 regulations?
My car has shorter wishbones to fit the new 180cm wide track regulations instead the 200cm track the 025 normally had. The wishbones are properly made, not made from water pipes as you would expect for showcar use. Any thoughts? |
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20 Nov 2011, 20:46 (Ref:2989298) | #8 | |
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I send an email to Paul Stoddart´s European Aviation Company but didn´t get response yet, are they still in business?
Frits van Eerd owns two Tyrrell 025 (chassis 02 & 04 ?), a collector in France has one (chassis 05?) Does anyone know, how much Tyrrell 025 were built? I have two sources, one say 5 cars built the other say 6 cars. Are there forum members who were Tyrrell or Minardi/Ledbury team members back then and are willing to share some information? At the Minardi auction back in 2005? there were several Tyrrell cars for sale. Has anyone an auction catalogue to confirm which cars were sold? Thanks for all efforts |
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16 Dec 2011, 22:26 (Ref:3001022) | #9 | |
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Does anybody has a copy of Giorgio Piolas book "Technical analysis" about the 1996 and 1997 F1 saison?
These books show which chassis numbers were used for the races, which ones were abandoned because of damage, which development was done to the cars etc. Maybe I´ll find some more information to trace the history of my Tyrrell. |
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17 Dec 2011, 10:02 (Ref:3001137) | #10 | ||
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You say a ex tyrrell man said there was no show cars built
When Paul stodart ran his cars in boss formula They had full time people making parts Maybe they built some show cars ! They had the moulds And the facilities to do this Plus it has a European aviation chassis plate Is the tub complete in every way , with hard Points etc Does it have fixings for the fuel cell etc Paul stoddart had a very big company when he was running These cars and even bigger when he got involved with minardi You need to find someone that worked for him in 97 or 98 The team was once owned by sOme else Richard sailsbury maybe |
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20 May 2016, 12:51 (Ref:3643233) | #11 | ||
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Quote:
Last edited by Koek; 20 May 2016 at 13:00. |
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17 Dec 2011, 11:43 (Ref:3001170) | #12 | |
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Your car appears to be a narrow track version that woul d make it dating from 1998 or later. If it is a Tyrrell 026 it should have wing mounting points at the front outer shoulder of the side pod. The 025 had them mounted (X wing) behind the rear protection area of the cockpit.
There were 5 025 chassis used in races in 1997 all appear to have survived the season intact. Some or all of these were used by Paul Stoddard in Euroboss I seem to remember 2 of them at one round of Euroboss. |
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17 Dec 2011, 13:14 (Ref:3001191) | #13 | ||
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There was often 2 of them; they ran 3 cars at some meeting the other being an 024 I recall. They demoed a pair of 026s at Brands in 2000 with Stoddart and Greensall driving.
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17 Dec 2011, 18:52 (Ref:3001312) | #14 | |
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From looking at the photos and the information available I suspect this is a Tyrrell 026 based car. I have gone through some more data and a number of the 026 six cars were damaged during the 1998 season. 026 02 was damaged at the German GP and was not raced again that season. both 026 03 & 04 were damaged in Belgium, none of the above chassis were raced again in 1998. Chassis 05 was damaged at the last race in Japan where chassis 01 was also used. There was a spare chassis available but will have to do further digging to find out which one it was. I doubt that all the cars built by Tyrrell in 1998 survived the seaon but there were at least 2 useable at the end of the season chassis 01 and one other.
I suspect from the information funformula has and from the photos the car in question might be a car built/rebuilt by Paul Stoddard giving it the 026 08 chassis number. From the photos above it is clearly a narrow track car. It might also be a 025 converted to 026 as in the latter years Tyrrell may not have had the budget to build brand new cars? |
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17 Dec 2011, 19:06 (Ref:3001314) | #15 | ||
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Tyrrell became bar at the end of 98
Bar used a tyrrel chassis and fitted the Renault engine They called that the barrel For winter testing Paul stoddart did have this car as I saw him drive it At an exclusive day at donnington , he also let Members of staff drive 024 and 025 cars Till a guy from Pi put one in the pit wall He also had his f3000 cars there and a young mark webber |
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18 Dec 2011, 00:01 (Ref:3001411) | #16 | |
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Thanks for your thoughts.
My car is for sure no Tyrrell 026 because it has a completely different monocoque. The 024 and 025 had a very similar monocoque. The most visible difference of the 025 are the two oval holes on both sides of the roll hoop and the "wedges" on both sides of the monocoque just in front of the sidepods/radiator air intake. It also has thicker sidewalls in the headrest area to fix the tower-wing supports. My car has the oval holes and the wedges but NOT the thicker sidewalls. So maybe it´s an updated 024 to make sure that the 025 bodywork will fit properly, because all the bodywork, floor etc. is clearly 025 style on my car. I also had the idea that my car was built by Stoddarts company as a showcar after Tyrrell closed the doors. But my monocoque is built far too complex as it is made out of carbon and alu-honeycomb which I think no one would do for a showcar only. So maybe it´s an updated 024 monocoque to make sure the 025 bodyparts will fit properly because all these parts, floor etc. are clearly in 025 style. At least one 024 was crashed and abandoned in 1996 (Katayama, GP Canada), so maybe this monocoque was used for my car. Questions over questions ;-) Last edited by funformula; 18 Dec 2011 at 00:08. |
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18 May 2012, 18:42 (Ref:3076216) | #17 | |
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Still no news about the history of my Tyrrell but some more questions:
Where are the Tyrrell 024´s? Never seen one on track after their GP-career. -searching on the internet I found one in 1997 PIAA colours and 025-nose displayed in Japan -one was displayed at British GP 1998 in 1998 colours -one was displayed at British GP 1998 at the BAR team presentation in blue/grey/gold livery equal to the design of Villeneuves 1999 pre-saison testing BAR 001 -what about the Stoddart Minardi auction around 2005? I recall a Tyrrell offered for auction, which has a large cut out section at the left side of the monocoque to get a view of drivers seating position. Can´t remember exactly but I think it was a 024 rather than a 025. -regarding Stoddart-Minardi auction, does anyone still has a stock list about the offered cars to check the chassis numbers? Regarding Tyrrell 025: -it is said that Frits van Eerd owns two cars -one French guy has a white one -another frenchman has a black one with wider "bulky" monocoque sides, this one is probably for sale now -some time ago the was a black one with PIAA livery for sale Makes total five cars, so no more room for mine. Checking closely some pictures of 024 cars, I recognized that only the early models (chassis no. 01-03?) had the thin headrest-sidewall same as on my car. At least from chassis 04 onwards the sidewall is as thick as on the 025 models. This would suggest that my car could be one of the early 024´s. Can anybody add some more information to this subject? Thanks. |
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31 May 2012, 14:53 (Ref:3082643) | #18 | ||
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Quote:
OK, I can offer a little. The following chassis were in the Stoddart auction: 019/6 019/2 022/5 023/2 023/3 024/2 024/4 024/8 025/2 025/4 and...I have some 019 pieces that Fritz von Eerds can use for his 019, and he has some 018 bits that I need--anyone have a way to get in touch with him? Jim Nelson 018/2 018/1 017/4 |
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18 May 2012, 19:17 (Ref:3076227) | #19 | |
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There was to the best of my memory a late model Tyrrell fitted with a Supertech(Renault) engine used by a BAR as a test mule but I know no more details.
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14 Apr 2018, 22:35 (Ref:3815555) | #20 | ||
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Did you ever find out which car you had funformula?
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25 May 2020, 21:52 (Ref:3978296) | #21 | |
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25 May 2020, 22:17 (Ref:3978302) | #22 | ||
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Can you remove the nose and post a picture of the front bulkhead - I'll see if I can ID it from that.
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26 May 2020, 19:06 (Ref:3978472) | #23 | |
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I´m curious, what are the differences in the front bulkhead, are there alternations between the chassis built?
Will post pictures when I´m in the workshop next time. |
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27 May 2020, 02:24 (Ref:3978496) | #24 | ||
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The front bulkhead and to a lesser extent the roll hoop are often the best way to identify a car, in many ways for me they are like a finger print. With all the mounting points around the bulkhead, it is rare for them to remain the same year on year. Its unlikely that you will find any/much variation around a front bulkhead or roll hoop between chassis 03 or 04 for example as such changes would have required a new crash test. Even with very similar tubs there are usually clear identifiers (ie 024 and 025)
I'm pretty sure I have bulkhead pics of the Tyrrells from that period so it will simply be a case of matching yours to that. My initial thoughts looking at your car in the two pics early on this topic is that your car is a 024, and reading the posts here and having a bit of a guess I'd say it was 024/8, but some better pics would be helpful. Last edited by ss_collins; 27 May 2020 at 02:34. |
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27 May 2020, 09:51 (Ref:3978601) | #25 | ||
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There is a “Tyrrell Racing Organisation” Facebook page which includes some former team members. I have copied the link to this thread in there in the hope that someone else may also have relevant information.
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