2014 WEC Livestream

[valedave]

Indeed, she specifically said: "We are passing [your feedback] on".

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by valedave

Is this what it has come to? Outrage that RLM aren't expressing outrage?

Christ, it's not up to them to voice your concerns. If you've got a problem with the coverage, let the WEC/ACO know.

If you listened to the MWM before Silverstone and the FP/quali sessions, there were certainly some veiled comments from Hindy and GG, among others, particularly with regard to the fact that RLM coverage is completely free.

I can't speak for the others, but my "issue" - if you can call it that - all along really hasn't been about them talking or not talking about it, but that I rather hope they stop criticizing other series for doing similar things when they're now part of one too. If you stay silent of your own baby's issues, then don't bash other series (again like SRO etc in the past)

I'll be happy if they do that

[valedave]

But it's not anything to do with them! There's a RADIO in Radio Le Mans after all. The online video coverage is literally nothing to do with them, I'm not sure how else I can express that. It's like saying BBC commentators Martin Brundle and Ben Edwards were at fault for F1 going behind a paywall (Sky) in the UK...

Look, I do agree to an extent that they now cannot champion WEC for its (TV/online) coverage, and I think that will stop now. As far as I am aware, there hasn't been any criticism of other series since this paywall was set up? So what's the issue? Accusations of hypocrisy are ludicrous.

[rdjones]

I have finally got my internet connection back following our house move and I download the app on both our iPad any my iPhone both look very impressive.

I have access to Motors so I can still watch the race's live (which I normally dip in and out off). However I think I am going to buy all the extra features for Le Mans.

[J Jay]

Originally Posted by valedave

But it's not anything to do with them! There's a RADIO in Radio Le Mans after all. The online video coverage is literally nothing to do with them, I'm not sure how else I can express that. It's like saying BBC commentators Martin Brundle and Ben Edwards were at fault for F1 going behind a paywall (Sky) in the UK...

To be more accurate, I don't remember Brundle, Humphreys, etc. crowing about how Indycar wasn't available free-to-air either. Something about a speck and a log I think ...

However I agree that the silence regarding this issue is telling. Honestly, it's the most to expect from RLM at this time. More than a few regulars would not be pleased if there was gushing praise for the live stream, and Neveu would probably have a conniption if Hindhaugh was openly criticizing it. For last week's MWM in particular, there was so much actual racing to discuss that even mentioning the stream would come a long way down the list. As has also been mentioned, away from the radio waves those affiliated with RLM have not exactly held their tongue either.

I am more than confident that Hindhaugh will still criticise SRO though, just not for anything related to streaming

[Adam43]

Not quite sure I'd expect them to voice any negative opinion on this given the circumstance. The output is influenced by the situation. Always has been. Sometimes it may be laughable, but isn't outrageous or offensive.

If you want them to be truly independent they need an independent source of funds. Are fans prepared to pay for something like that? This thread suggests not.

[porsche91722]

It's a bit hard to bite the hand that feeds you sometimes! I'm sure that as the voice of sports car racing and as providers of a free service themselves, they are more than aware of the angst caused by some of the decisions made by the WEC. Like most sub contractors (and employees) of company's, they don't always agree with everything the boss says and does, but have to toe the line, when it comes to presenting a united front, especially if they want to keep on getting work.

[nkoske]

I suppose my minor issue is that MWM purports to be a journalistic motors sports endeavor.

I do appreciate that they talked for like an hour about the WEC race, but it sure seems worthy to mention that the WEC's 'cutting edge' media solution leaves many in one of the largest markets in the world without a good solution to watch, instead of some might happen Mike Newton P2 chassis.

I'm not saying I'm not going to listen, I enjoy the banter. But it's far from true journalism. Well maybe that's not fair...as it's definitely close to what passes for journalism these days.

I have a similar issue with Dagys tweet:

Any of the naysayers over the #FIAWEC's new paywall strategy should read this Q&A. Some great insight/answers: http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/f...y-for-new-app/ …

"Any of the naysayers"...really was that necessary. First naysayers are completely in line due to the WEC's tweet saying coverage will be free. Additionally the FIA WEC's solution is near worthless to a fan that has a life outside of watching motor sport, due to lack of VoD.

In the end, in my opinion, the FIA WEC needs my (and other's) eyeballs more than I need the FIA WEC in this hugely competitive entertainment environment. So, erecting barriers to keep fans from watching seems silly.

I pay for cable, I pay for internet, I pay for mobile data already, I have Amazon prime...I'm not against paying for consumable media, but I don't have to pay even more for F1, Indycar, NFL, NCAA Football, PGA, etc... and I can throw them on the DVR and watch them at my leisure. So in the competition for eyeball minutes, I just don't get the philosophy. Why does the WEC make it so much work to watch?

In the meantime I spent nearly all Sunday with motorsport in the background while I played with my kid. Last week's F1, Indycar Quali, and the Indycar race. Could have been the WEC if it happened to be on my DVR, but alas it was not. Sure I probably could have hooked my laptop up to the TV and found some crappy pixelated copy of the WEC race, but it was a little more effort than I was willing to expend.

Just to note:
MWM Series 6 Ep. 1 talks about the ALMS 'Cutting edge' media package. In the first minute and continues with more in depth coverage at 80 min.

[Deleted]

All specialist media is biased one way or another... general we-don't-give-a-**** news sources (pardon me for not having better expression) in many ways can be the most objectival as they don't add in anything

Speaking of "never criticize your employee", take a listen to that Stephane Ratel RLM interview at Spa 24 last year (it's somewhere middle ish in the race podcasts)... after they were finished with him there were some rather bold comments coming out from Hindy's and Graham's mouths. I thought it was rather interesting in positive way to have them saying things not entirely favourable of state of things. They were clearly the employees of SRO that weekend (honestly I didn't thought that was ever happening knowing past arguments) yet they still managed to be quite opinionated

[Victor_RO]

Originally Posted by Chiana

They were clearly the employees of SRO that weekend (honestly I didn't thought that was ever happening knowing past arguments) yet they still managed to be quite opinionated

Not really sure about that, I think the Spa 24h stream was mostly pushed and funded by Nissan sponsorship (as was the Bathurst 1000 commentary later in the year).

[Deleted]

It's kinda hard to judge when Nissan sponsors most of their stuff but would make sense knowing their, hmm, differences

Anyway, whatevet the case, if you do race broadcast for organization X's race you want to please them to come back the following year

[nkoske]

Originally Posted by nkoske

Just to note:
MWM Series 6 Ep. 1 talks about the ALMS 'Cutting edge' media package. In the first minute and continues with more in depth coverage at 80 min.

Just finished listening to this. If you replaced ALMS with FIA WEC and ESPN 3 with Paid Stream you'd think they were talking in 2014.

John: From the midweek motorsport listener's collective a number of people making the same point 'you can't really PVR (personal video record) a webstream'. Now what I would say though if it is going to be available on-demand and you can download it or you can watch on-demand as we've got [inaudible] then you don't need to PVR it.

Isn't that what many are asking for from the WEC...oh wait not important enough to talk about...

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by nkoske

Isn't that what many are asking for from the WEC...oh wait not important enough to talk about...

*Insert hmm yes soundclip here*

PS: Technically speaking you can record any web live stream but it isn't exactly as simple thing

[Ginaro Zukovsky]

Originally Posted by nkoske

Isn't that what many are asking for from the WEC...oh wait not important enough to talk about...

Well every WEC race in the last 12 months is on Youtube in HD, including Silverstone which was uploaded on the day after the race, but yes it would be good to have the WEC do it officially and give people a reason to part with their cash.

[Deleted]

Yup all major series and events - except recent Grand Prixes due to FOM - are on Youtube nowadays, uploaded mainly by people who torrented them first. Since there are no time time limits and such anymore it's easy and gets you viewers quickly. So yes technically speaking everything is available if one looks around, but as you said not in official capacity

[Mystery]

Originally Posted by nkoske

I suppose my minor issue is that MWM purports to be a journalistic motors sports endeavor.

If you challenge them on that they'll deny it. When I complained about their reaction to Davidson hitting a Corvette at LM a few years back Declan was at pains to point out they aren't and are an entertainment organisation. Hence, I no longer pay too much attention.

[wewantourdarbyback]

The idea that a sub doesn't work cross platform would be my biggest gripe with all this. The up front amount is one I could stomach if I was shown an amount of advantages, good quality innovative coverage I can view from any device and I'm sold. But now it seems to be a stream, over excellent radio coverage (where I might add a reporter in the pit lane appears to be completely disconnected from the commentators who will talk over her as no one seems to be bothered to tell them an interview is coming up), of just some standard pictures. Nothing exciting for my cash.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Mystery

If you challenge them on that they'll deny it. When I complained about their reaction to Davidson hitting a Corvette at LM a few years back Declan was at pains to point out they aren't and are an entertainment organisation. Hence, I no longer pay too much attention.

I've had my difficulties with them too from time to time, particularly one time couple of years ago on MWM when Nick was basically calling BTCC not real racing but "entertainment racing" because all the artificiality and goofy stuff that happens in that series. Apparently touring car fans are there purely for that. As a reply to that on their forum I called Dubai 24h, which they had just covered like previous weekend, "the biggest clown show on wheels" (because of all the reference lap time joker lap post qualifying adjusting crap). For that I got huge ****storm on live broadcast and they - well Hindy - bashed me to the ground.

Was that the nicest thing I ever said? No, but I don't think my opinion calls for such anger especially when they themselves had just said similar thing of another series! Not for the first time either...

Anyway, that didn' stop me from listening

[Simmi]

It's MWM, not Panorama. People are taking the show way too seriously. But then again some people seemingly enjoy being offended and actively seek it out.

[bella]

Originally Posted by Simmi

It's MWM, not Panorama. People are taking the show way too seriously. But then again some people seemingly enjoy being offended and actively seek it out.

i think if people took that view with most if not all of the specialist media they consumed they'd enjoy sportscar racing a lot more

[isynge]

There are a whole array of interesting point on this, and in many ways it feels reminiscent of the popularisation of Premiership Football in the UK in the 1990s.

Simultaneously it went behind a paywall (Sky TV), went all seater (and managed to lose its reputation for hooliganism), and many casual enthusiast (which I guess I was in that period) found some of the light hearted coverage provided by Baddiel and Skinner with their Fantasy Football show one of the big hooks to become interested in some of the more detailed aspects.

Were people hacked off by how football changed in that period? Of course they were - but it did build something that's still, in broad brush terms, flourishing 25 years later.

What the WEC is doing with its media package and how it communicates isn't perfect, and nor are the RLM guys pure unalloyed perfection, but all in over the last 10 decade things are clearly progressing.

[J Jay]

Originally Posted by isynge

There are a whole array of interesting point on this, and in many ways it feels reminiscent of the popularisation of Premiership Football in the UK in the 1990s.

Simultaneously it went behind a paywall (Sky TV), went all seater (and managed to lose its reputation for hooliganism), and many casual enthusiast (which I guess I was in that period) found some of the light hearted coverage provided by Baddiel and Skinner with their Fantasy Football show one of the big hooks to become interested in some of the more detailed aspects.

Were people hacked off by how football changed in that period? Of course they were - but it did build something that's still, in broad brush terms, flourishing 25 years later.

What the WEC is doing with its media package and how it communicates isn't perfect, and nor are the RLM guys pure unalloyed perfection, but all in over the last 10 decade things are clearly progressing.

There isn't really a WEC "equivalent" for all-seater stadia though, and I believe that had the biggest part to play in bringing families and casual fans to the matches, and therefore more cash to the clubs' coffers.

More to the point, the revenue generated from subscriptions was put to "good" use - a significant amount went to the teams, and a lot was spent on improving the available coverage. Both of these contributed to more subscriptions and yet more money rolling in. However, it was only possible in the first place because there was a ****load of money to be made from a loyal, captive, massive audience; all forms of motorsport bar F1 are missing that last requirement. This is why I'm not sure the long-term strategy behind the pay-stream makes sense. Top flight football could afford to implement pay-per-view because even if a small percentage of people took it up, the money generated was significant. The FIA needs a much larger percentage of the WEC audience to subscribe for the same effect.

The press release post-Silverstone made a lot of noise about the downloads, but tellingly there was no mention of subscription numbers. I realise there are other reasons for not publishing subscription information, but if they got good numbers I have no doubt we would have been given ballpark/rounded figures.

[porsche91722]

I've had a few points of differing opinion with Radio Le Mans over the years, but imagine trying to follow sports car racing without them! Sure... there's plenty of other online media outlets, but there's no other permanent, dedicated, FREE, online commentary available. Even though I tire of their "cash for comment" reporting sometimes, particularly on the LM24 coverage, RLM doesn't exist without it. The fact that they do take the michael out of other series and personalities doesn't concern me. I've questioned them sometimes via twitter on certain things eg their stance on the WEC paid streaming, only to be given a rather defensive response, but I put that down to dealing with asking a question in 140 characters and having to be rather direct and to the point.
Different opinions and outlooks are what makes the world go round! We are all passionate sports car racing fans but also disagree on a lot of things. I am sure that if a private "in confidence" conversation were to be had with Hindy, Dagys, Pruett, Goodwin etc where they could all say what they really think about the sports governing bodies, we'd have a better idea as to why they have to tread warily. They all know which side their bread is buttered.

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by porsche91722

I've questioned them sometimes via twitter on certain things eg their stance on the WEC paid streaming, only to be given a rather defensive response, but I put that down to dealing with asking a question in 140 characters and having to be rather direct and to the point.

I'm guessing he responded that way due to the manner in which you asked the question. Which came off more like an accusation.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Simmi

But then again some people seemingly enjoy being offended and actively seek it out.

So if RLM moans about series X on air it's fine and if I happen to disagree with it I must just shut up about it

If I response to that by moaning about series Y of which they like or are involved with it's wrong and I can be rightfully condemned to death

?