McRae calls for Schumacher duel!

[f1manoz]

It would be interesting to see, but it would never happen.

[AndyF]

I seem to rememeber Tommi Makinen behind the wheel of an F1 car a couple of years back in some challenge thingy (I'll have to try and find the Autosport that it was in). I'd love to see a real head-to-head!!

[Gt_R]

I remember the Tommi thingy too.. it was an exchange program that if i remember correctly, organised by his sponsor, which at that time sponsors an F1 team also.

[rdjones]

I would pay to see this one, as Colin would whip TGP backside........................

[pug205t16]

Colin has already driven an F1 car a Jordan, vs Martin B a few years ago (the gold car i think), he was pretty quick too.

The tommi/williams thing was where JV, tommi and Doohan got together but insurance would not let the others in the rally car or on the bike so it was just the F1 car for all.

[SJ Spode]

My money would be on Mr McRae. They could run the event at Silverstone; on the GP track and the RallySprint course.

Drivers / riders from different disciplines get together for the Race of Champions in Gran Canaria each December, so why not...... The money it would make for charity would be great.

[chrisgr31]

My money would be on Colin McRae, he has previously driven a F1 car and if I recall correctly he did quite well. Driving a rally car on dirt I think is a different proposition and an F1 driver would be likely to put it in a ditch or tree.

A number of F1 drivers have tried driving rally cars haven't they/ Was it Brundle who entered the RAC once or twice? Hasn't Alesi also tried one? Seem to recall they managed to put them in the scenery.

Surely though Colin and Michael should be entering the Race of Champions? Isn't that designed for this sort of test?

[Red]

"my money would be on McRae".... whoa, what do you mean by that? Probably Colin would beat Michael in a Rally vehicle, but I don't believe that anyone here seriously suggests that he would've had a chance in a whatever F1 car.... Right? Anyway, stupid test and I agree with you. Just cheap publicity.

[Dino IV]

It would be unlikely between Colin and the Schu because for a moment I don't see a mutual connection like a sponsor, who'd want to fund this thing.

On the other hand it's not an impossible duell.
At the Zandvoort Marlboro Masters there have been a couple of occasions where Marlboro brought their top drivers incl. their equipment to Zandvoort to do some demonstration laps. This duell could easily be arranged then. Have Francois Delecour, Max Biaggi and Schumacher do some laps on MotoGP bike, WRC Mitsubishi and Ferrari F2002 and add all time differences and see the outcome. Biaggi would probably win because of the bike in this equation as the most difficult machine to master.

[z2252314]

The most important point which most people seem to be forgetting is that Michael is under contract by Ferrari!!! There is no way in hell that Ferrari would risk Michael sustaining an injury in such a meaningless competition. The only thing such a competition would prove is that Colin can beat Michael in Rally, and Michael can beat Colin in F1.

In my opinion however, while Colin would whip Michael in Rally now, given time, say a year of practice, I am confident that Michael would gain the upper edge. On the other hand, Colin could never match Michael in an F1 car no matter how many years of practice he is given. F1 requires a deft touch, and skill like Michaels comes along once a generation. He may get within half a second at best, but certainly no more.

To sum up:- In my opinion, an F1 driver could enter any sort of motorsport,and given ample learning time, compete successfully. However, it rarely works the other way around.

[paul-collins]

Of course, there's also the end-of-season kart races. So it's not impossible for an F1 driver to participate in some sort of extracurricular wheeled competition. (No hang gliding, though, eh Nelson?)

I'm not sure who would handle who in such a challenge. Sure would be interesting, though.

<curmudgeon>In the old days, when drivers did it all, we wouldn't have to resort to challenges. They already raced each other in all the major races - Paris-Dakar, Mille Miglia, Grand Prix, Le Mans...</curmudgeon>

[SJ Spode]

Originally posted by z2252314
In my opinion however, while Colin would whip Michael in Rally now, given time, say a year of practice, I am confident that Michael would gain the upper edge. On the other hand, Colin could never match Michael in an F1 car no matter how many years of practice he is given. F1 requires a deft touch, and skill like Michaels comes along once a generation. He may get within half a second at best, but certainly no more.

To sum up:- In my opinion, an F1 driver could enter any sort of motorsport,and given ample learning time, compete successfully. However, it rarely works the other way around.

Somehow I can't see Michael ever reaching the top of rallying. His comments about Le Mans cars seem to show that his instinicts for self-preservation would prevent him from the sort of 101% commitment needed to drive fast through the trees or on the roads of Corsica with 300ft + drops down the side of mountains, like the top rally drivers do. (And before I'm accused of being anti-MS, I'm not. I don't blame him either).

Modern F1 cars with the electronic aids are such that I think the top rally drivers would get more competitive in them faster than F1 drivers (including MS)would do the other way around.

[chrisgr31]

Originally posted by Red
"my money would be on McRae".... whoa, what do you mean by that? Probably Colin would beat Michael in a Rally vehicle, but I don't believe that anyone here seriously suggests that he would've had a chance in a whatever F1 car.... Right? Anyway, stupid test and I agree with you. Just cheap publicity.

Well I was working on the assumption that the chances are in a competitive situation an F1 driver would throw the rally car in the scenery thereby taking an indefinite time to finish the stage . A rally driver is probably less likely to throw an F1 car in the gravel traps thereby setting a time! Anyway that was my theory!

However if we turn our attention away from Colin v Michael and turn it to Colin v Eddie or Pedro there may be more realism as Ford/Jaguar would stand to gainpublicity and if Jordan get the Cosworth engine it could be Colin v Giancarlo or Takuma. Now bearing in mind Eddie Jordans love for publicity there could be a chance of that happening!

Ok, perhaps I should actually return to earth and concentrate on packing for my trip to the French Grand Prix

[Liz]

What I want to know is this: Would TGF get Nicky Grist to read his pace notes? Or would he get Louis Moya?

Laying aside all the drivel about "Ferrari would not allow their baby to play with strange children" -- let's assume that everyone involved said Okay Boys, Let's See What You've Got.

TGF has already said that Le Mans, Ovals, modern Champ Cars and the 1982 Ferrari are "too dangerous". Show him film of Tommi's spectacular barrel-roll-over-the-spectators-and-bounce-three-times extravaganza, and he'd have to go change his y-fronts before I'd let him in MY car.

But why not negate the advantage either man would have, and put them both in the Panoz LMP-07 for about 20 laps of Le Mans? (Yes, I know TGF said it was 'too dangerous' but is he going to wimp out in front of a world wide audience? Not if Bernie gets a cut of the PPV and orders him to take part!) To make it even more fun, put Tommi and Montoya into the other LMP-07 and put them out together. Ten laps each, one driver change, fuel and tires, and the best team wins.

I'd pay to see that.

[Speed]

Put my money on Montoya/Mäkinen !!!

Great idea Liz !

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Jukebox

What's the difference in terms of value / cost between a F1 and a rally car?

Do you all think Ferrari is stupid enough to allow someone who dosen't have any experience driving a single seater race the F2002?

It has to be remembered that McRae has had F1 experience before (Jordan '96) so allowing him to drive a F2002 wouldn't be a problem.

Anyway, this arguement doesn't hold any weight, Ferrari were reportedly going to allow David Beckham to drive it in a swop with TGF to keep Vodafone happy.

[Jordi]

Mick Doohan once tested a Williams FW20 and had a big crash and nothing happened!

Valentino Rossi and Fonsi Nieto rolled and hit trees with Seat Cordoba WRCs and nothing happened!!

For Jukebox and Red it may seem like a stupid idea, but I'd do it...

I guess TGF only drives F2002s and Fiats...

[Red]

Originally posted by Liz
Schumacher has already said that Le Mans, Ovals, modern Champ Cars and the 1982 Ferrari are "too dangerous"

About the 1982 Ferrari; indeed he said that they're very dangerous. But that didn't stop him to take one for a spin. Besides, it was not exactly his opinion; it was more a compliment addressed to Tambay who was "couching" him.

Liz, they are dangerous; but to suggest that F1 cars are "safer" is ludicrous. Besides, 3 years ago he was very close to his death. Less than 3 months later, with a leg not 100% healed he was back in the car. So please drop the "Schumacher is chicken" line.
-------------
Jordi, actually it was a FW19 Actually Doohan managed to set a timed lap. Eventually . In the same test Jacques wanted to test Mick's bike, but his contract with Williams specifically forbids that kind of activities! By the way, the idea is not stupid, if you look from the "entertainment" point of view. I said that the TEST would be stupid. Wouldn't prove anything, and secondly that will never happen.

[Jukebox]

Originally posted by Jordi
For Jukebox and Red it may seem like a stupid idea, but I'd do it...

Do you see any purpose to the challenge? What can be accomplished by doing so? Yes he did mentioned about giving away to charity, but what does the outcome serves?

I'll tell you what's in McRae's mind...knowing that rally followers aren't that many as F1 followers, he's just trying to use Michael's popularity to further gain his own. Would people pay to see both riders drive cars that they are not familiar with? I sure am not gonna pay even to see my favourite driver drive a rally car because i know he's not going to be good at it, it's like asking any person on the street to drive the car.

That's why it's a very stupid idea coming from him. Cheap publicity is what he's trying to get at the expense of Michael.

[chrisgr31]

Originally posted by Jukebox


I'll tell you what's in McRae's mind...knowing that rally followers aren't that many as F1 followers, he's just trying to use Michael's popularity to further gain his own. Would people pay to see both riders drive cars that they are not familiar with? I sure am not gonna pay even to see my favourite driver drive a rally car because i know he's not going to be good at it, it's like asking any person on the street to drive the car.

That's why it's a very stupid idea coming from him. Cheap publicity is what he's trying to get at the expense of Michael.

I think you will find that in any carf a WRC driver and F1 driver will be quick, its just that I suspect it will be easier to throw a WRC at the scenery.

As regards Micheal saying Le Mans etc are dangerous didn't he come to F1 from the Mercedes sportscar programme?

[Adam43]

Originally posted by Red
Besides, 3 years ago he was very close to his death.

Oh, come on!

I agree that too much is read into Schumacher thinks everything else is dangerous. He did indeed have a go in the 1982 Ferrari and he was right it is dangerous compared to today's cars.

I don't think he is a chicken otherwise he wouldn't risk running into people.

Liz, good idea, but I would rather see Schumacher/Montoya in the same car, verses Tommi/Colin. It retains the F1 v Rally idea. However I would prefer a different car. Perhaps one of the front engined GTS cars. Negates the advantage that the F1 boys have for it being on a circuit a bit more.

[Jukebox]

Originally posted by chrisgr31
As regards Micheal saying Le Mans etc are dangerous didn't he come to F1 from the Mercedes sportscar programme?

He started racing in go-karts since his dad owns the track over at Kerpin-Manheim, he was the 1984 German junior champion and the European champion in 1987. Then he was in Formula Ford (Formula Koenig) in 1988, Formula3 in 1989 and for a short stint in the Mercedes junior team driving a sports car for Sauber before enrolling to learn proper driving in a race car driving school before driving for the Jordan in a single race before signing a contract with Benetton because of some legal problems that might arise with the Jordans.

Before joining the Jordan in 1991, he was the German F3 champion in 1990. So you see it was a very short stunt with the mercedez sports car. Most of his experiences were with single seater cars.

[275GTB-4]

I seem to remember a few years back Martin Brundle and was it Colin? had a televised challenge at a track in Britain. Didn't prove much except that it was patently obvious the two disciplines require different skill sets. The common denominator was talent!! I don't recall the result - think it was draw!!

Live and let live die I say, I'm just happy that the politically correct ****ers of the world have not yet been allowed to limit our enjoyment of motorsport!!

[Mr V]

Originally posted by z2252314

In my opinion however, while Colin would whip Michael in Rally now, given time, say a year of practice, I am confident that Michael would gain the upper edge. On the other hand, Colin could never match Michael in an F1 car no matter how many years of practice he is given.

So your saying that TGF would only need a year to match McRae in the hardest, most treacherous and dangerous series on earth, dispite Colin having years of experience, but no matter how many laps and years Colin drove a F1 car he'd never match TGF? Thats crazy.

[Jukebox]

Originally posted by mr v
but no matter how many laps and years Colin drove a F1 car he'd never match TGF? Thats crazy.

mr v.....Michael is a gifted driver and even the great Senna himself was impressed and saw potential in him when he was racing in the go-kart series.

Ironic isn't it that Michael was able to achieve better result than Senna apart from the pole position record.