Does Ralf have any legal recourse?

[Kirk]

Just a thought but imo, Ralf's (and Alonso's) shunt was the direct result of negligence. Can Williams or Ralf take legal action? Has any driver or team ventured there in the past?

[Kicking-back]

I think it's a bit much to call it "negligence".

These things can happen in racing.

And as for encouraging legal action - I don't think that's a road anyone would welcome.

When you enter a race, you accept that accidents can happen.

[Peter Mallett]

The family of Mark Donoghoe entered into legal action against his team but it got nowhere.

I do stand to be corrected on this BTW.

[Kicking-back]

I think the Donohoe case was against Goodyear rather than the team.

[type49]

...and there was a settlement, out of court details undisclosed.

[Peter Mallett]

Thanks. Folks.

[Morris 1100]

His wife (they were separated) sued Goodyear, Penske, Bell helmets and I think they all settled out of court.

[BootsOntheSide]

My respect for Ralf (which is low as it is) would drop furhter if he went down this route. I'm sure he was aware of the situation that races would be continued even when tehre was the risk of debris left on the track from previous crashes, and said nothing about it. Realistically, he ought to accept that he's been unlucky, and hope that Michael can use his influence to improve things in future.

[mcurtis26]

I don´t think legal action would benefit the sprot in ayway, and may harm its long term prospects in the states. As it says on your ticket "motor racing is dangerous," the risks are there and you consent to them as you enter the track. Generally, the english legal position is that there is no recompense for sporting injuries causd within the rules of the game unless there is a large degree of neglgigence.

[ensign14]

If the standard of care of the organizers fell below the required standard, then he has a good chance. Would be interesting if he did have a go because they would have to give details of why the race was not stopped to clear all debris away. Motor racing is dangerous and drivers know the risks - but they do not consent to risks caused by the organizers' negligence.

A widow of someone who died on a trackday recently sued Goodwood, the RAC and the FIA but lost because they had put barriers up where anyone would expect an accident to take place.

In practice, Ralf may not have a choice - it may be up to his insurer.

[Kicking-back]

If Ralf sued, he may find he would have difficulty getting a licence next year!

[Mr V]

Originally posted by Kicking-back


These things can happen in racing.



When you enter a race, you accept that accidents can happen.

Agreed with these statements. As K-B says, it's (part and parcel of) racing, team owners and drivers know and except this.

What next, Renault asking Williams pay for the damage to the car?

The thing of course with suing someone is (i should imagine) that the driver doing the suing would have to prove that the other driver did it deliberatly. Very difficult thing to do.

[Adam43]

Originally posted by Kirk
imo... negligence.

and there is the problem. IYO.

Additionally it can be argued that such situations are expected in such a sporting situation.

If there was a case then motorsport would become unfeasible.

[Adam43]

Originally posted by BootsOntheSide
My respect for Ralf (which is low as it is) would drop furhter if he went down this route.

I know you are not suggesting he has, but I feel it is worth saying here that there are no reports that this cause of action has even crossed his mind.

[Frank_White]

As previously stated, ralf has consented to the inherant dangers of motor racing by virtue of his position as a racing driver. The principle in english/american law is "volenti non fit injuria". Roughly translated it means that the risk of injury was accepted voluntarily.

Aside from that fact, there are three separate considerations, in regards to any cause of action that ralf might have.

1) a suit against the team (i.e. Williams) for some defect in the car beyond the norm which substantially caused his accident. (i would suggest that minoe negligence would not be actionable; it must be flagrant oversight or a reckless decision to use a faulty or dangerous part... for example)

in the circumstances of indy, there is nothing to suggest that the accident was caused by a fault of the car. therefore there is prima facie, no cause of action against williams.

2) a suit against the stewards at indy and/or the organization that they are accountable to.

This is also a no go because, even if they in their tardy delay might be termed negligent, there is no indication that he sufferred increased injury because of it.

The fundamental principle of negligence is that it is only actionable when the plaintiff/claimant can show somw "loss" as a result of the negligent action.

The actions of the indy stewards is only a talking point in regards to "potential repurcussions" of a slow response time.

3) a suit against the fia itself for promoting an unsafe sport, through its regulations or managment. This is also a no go because with the advancements in safety standards in f1, it is perhaps the safest sport of its kind (considering high speed levels) in the world.

So there u have it ladies and gentlemen. the simple answer is; NO RALF DOES NOT HAVE A LEGAL SUIT AGAINST ANYONE!

[Kicking-back]

What about the hospital in Indiana which apparently failed to spot his neck/spinal fractures?

[Pitstop]

Oh dear! oh dear! oh dear!

I cut my finger today whilst chopping up some carrots with a lovely new, sharp, knife. Now folks, who/whom should I sue?

I have the name of the knife maker, the retailer, the receipt and 'blood evidence'.

But!! I hear you cry! you are to blame!!

I used the product, knowing full well what the consequences might be if I missused it,(it says so on the label (contract!), or perhaps, I did not treat the product with the resect it deserved, (on my chosen chopping board), according to the manufactuers instructions.

Get real.

[avsfan733]

Originally posted by Kirk
Just a thought but imo, Ralf's (and Alonso's) shunt was the direct result of negligence. Can Williams or Ralf take legal action? Has any driver or team ventured there in the past?

why does this have to be brought up is it really a place we want to go? people already complain about the sport if you sue them then there response will be bike tyres electric motors and a 15 mph top speed

[grumpy1]

Originally posted by Kicking-back
What about the hospital in Indiana which apparently failed to spot his neck/spinal fractures?

Agreed Ralf accepted the risks involved with his chosen profession.

As for KBs statement.It the good old USofA and everyone sues everyone

The Grumpy1
P.S.On a serious note yes he may have grounds to sue the medical center if they failed to find the fractures.

[Frank_White]

"Originally posted by Kicking-back
What about the hospital in Indiana which apparently failed to spot his neck/spinal fractures?"

the same principle applies. in negligence there must be "loss" for negligence to be actionable. i.e. he must show the misdiagnosis was not only negligent but that it also caused him some further suffering or injury (physical or monetary).

further, have you heard that the hospital in indiana was negligent?

just missing something does not connotate negligence. some diagnosis take time to be apparent. later inflammation would cause a fracture to show days later that did not show initially.
the indiana hospital, might have diagnosed severe back spain possible hairline fractures. he would have been advised to get further check ups and x-rays within "x" amount of days. i'm sure they didnt tell him; "ralf you're all ok. do'nt worry about those few pains in your back, go ahead and race in a fortnight."

[Kirk]

Originally posted by AdamAshmore
and there is the problem. IYO.

Additionally it can be argued that such situations are expected in such a sporting situation.

If there was a case then motorsport would become unfeasible.

Ordinarily, I would agree 100 percent Adam, but in this instance, when I saw the SC leading the pack through all that debris and carbon fibre I was flabberghasted. There was bound to be a resulting incident and there were two. Ralf's shunt could easily have been fatal and now his very career could be jeopordized; all because the SC did not route traffic through the pit lane. That's pretty serious stuff! I agree, it would not be good for the sport and I would not like to see legal action but the possibility exists, again imo.

[fog_shadow]

according to f1-live, Ralf is contemplating legal action against the hospital for failing to detect the two fracured vertabrae.

sorry for the spelling, tooo lazy to look it up. it's the weekend and i've gotta go.

fog_shadow

[BootsOntheSide]

Considering that the failed diagnosis didn't ultimately worsen his condition or delay his recovery, I don't think he's got much of a case, although far more frivolous lawsuits have been successful in the US.